Psychotrigger

[Jackpine Boyz]

Hello,
I've been really enjoying the Masters of the Barebow series.  Amazing information.  Tonight I  watched Joel Turner on disc 4 twice and wanted to get some feedback.  He refers to psychotriggers, which I've heard other people use.  The idea of increasing back tension to a contact point is something that I've seen others do and have played with myself.  Here's my question...

When you draw do you draw to primary anchor (eye tooth/lip/etc) then increase back tension while remaining on anchor or expand past anchor and into the psychotrigger?

After watching the video I realized that my psycho trigger (feather touching nose tip) was more of I a secondary anchor as it occurs at same time as my primary anchor.  I don't not actually expand into it.  I remain on these two anchor points the whole time while expanding, I'm just expanding into them more solidly.

Hope that makes sense.

[SteelyDan]

I draw to my primary anchor (middle finger at corner of mouth), and remain at anchor and then increase back tension until feather touches nose or until the clicker goes off, if I am using one.
SD

[Caleb Monroe]

What you have is a double anchor. A trigger is just that something that happens during your expansion that triggers your release. It works the best when you can't anticipate it.

[McDave]

Joel begins his expansion phase with the feather about 1/8" off his nose, and expands until it touches his nose.  I'm guessing about the 1/8"; I would imagine he sets that distance based on experimentation to determine how far the arrow moves during his expansion phase.  In a dynamic release, such as Joel uses, there should be some movement during the expansion phase, albeit small.  

If there is no movement, it becomes more of a static, or dead release.  Some people prefer a dead release, but it works best if developed as a separate skill, and not by just stopping movement while trying to execute a dynamic release.

If you're interested in Joel's techniques, he has produced new DVD's since MBB4, where you can see the movement from feather to nose during expansion that I describe above.

[KeganM]

I try not to move off of anchor. Anchor, rotate the elbow through the trigger, follow through.

[McDave]

Originally posted by KeganM:
I try not to move off of anchor. Anchor, rotate the elbow through the trigger, follow through.

If there is no movement once you reach anchor, how do you activate your trigger?  Most triggers, such as a clicker or feather to nose, require some movement to activate.  Joel also discusses a tab sear, which can be activated independently of shooting the bow, and could be used by a dead release shooter.  I've thought about that, but don't like the idea of tension in my thumb while I'm shooting, so I don't use the kind of external trigger that Joel recommends.

[KeganM]

Originally posted by McDave:
 

Originally posted by KeganM:
I try not to move off of anchor. Anchor, rotate the elbow through the trigger, follow through.

If there is no movement once you reach anchor, how do you activate your trigger?  Most triggers, such as a clicker or feather to nose, require some movement to activate.  Joel also discusses a tab sear, which can be activated independently of shooting the bow, and could be used by a dead release shooter.  I've thought about that, but don't like the idea of tension in my thumb while I'm shooting, so I don't use the kind of external trigger that Joel recommends. [/b]

Expanding/inhaling the 1/8" into my feather isn't very much. It's very small, so it doesn't require moving  off of anchor, per se. Does that clear it up any?

[McDave]

I understand what you mean: there is no movement of your hand on your face, but there is still a small movement of the feather toward your nose as you expand your chest.  Probably Joel does it the same way.

[Jackpine Boyz]

Thanks to everyone for the feedback.  I appreciate the perspective and it clarified my thoughts on the process.  I think everyone was right above.  I was using a second anchor previously.   I think a "psychotrigger" will fit my mentality well.  I will experiment now that I'm in "office season".

[KeganM]

McDave, Joel helped me a bit at ETAR the two years he visited and explained (if I'm remembering correctly) that the expansion can be tricky. Too much movement, going too slowly or too quickly, moving the head, etc.

That's why he started working on tab and grip sears. No distracting movement, just hold steady. I just can't figure one out that works on my longbows.

[Jackpine Boyz]

Ok,
Gonna have to show my ignorance on this one.  
What is a tab sear?  I've heard the term before but don't know what it is/does.  I've seen them mentioned in other posts as well when I did a search, but don't know what it is.

[Flingblade]

Jackpine,  
If you search for the thread "target panic reality check" there are a few pictures of the one I was using on page 14.

[McDave]

You know those hooks on hiking boots that you use to lace them?  Imagine one fastened on your tab in a place where you could press down on it with your thumbnail.  Imagine if you could press down on the very edge of it with steady pressure, eventually your thumbnail would slip off.  This would be a type of tab sear, which is named after the sear that is a part within a gun that activates by the pressure of your finger to fire the gun.  The idea is that you release the arrow when your thumb slips off the sear, to make the trigger a surprise.  It's sort of a unique concept, because unlike a gun sear or a clicker on a bow, the tab sear really doesn't have anything to do with the shot activation; it's just a signal to the brain to release the arrow.  A grip sear is similar, in that you either put something, or find some irregularity on your grip that you can press against with a thumbnail.  This is mainly of interest to dead release shooters, as dynamic release shooters are generally satisfied with some kind of pull through trigger.

I've never tried a tab sear, since I don't like the idea of putting any part of my hand other than my curled fingers under tension.  I did try an interval timer for a while to try to improve my hold time.  Maybe it worked, because now I'm happy with my hold time and don't use it anymore.

A surprise release is a good idea, like squeezing a rifle trigger until the shot goes off at an unanticipated moment.  Many people use a subconscious trigger to achieve a surprise release.  However, it is suspected that a subconscious trigger is a major cause of target panic, so people are looking for other ways to achieve a surprise release.  Actually, a good surprise release can be achieved by relaxing the fingertips instead of willing them to open, as there is a slight delay between your brain giving the command to the fingertips to relax and the fingertips relaxing enough for the string to flip them open.  I've found that maintaining my sight picture as a part of my followthrough while my relaxed fingertips are flipped out of the way seems to be a good solution to this problem (easier said than done, but that's what I'm working on now).

[YosemiteSam]

I attempted to use the string against my eyebrow as a trigger for my selfbows.  Seemed to work fairly well.  It's not as good as a clicker but better than trying for a dead release.  My eyebrows are on the bushy side, however, so that tickle vs touch comes into play.  How are some of you using these touch-activated triggers to avoid that gray area between a firm touch and just being close enough to feel it a little?  Or is that just another area to practice?

[Jackpine Boyz]

Thanks for the feedback.  I appreciate everyone's thoughts. I think I got a better idea of the this concept now.

Shoot straight

[Bowwild]

Several steps to get to anchor (must keep pulling with the back to keep it there). Then aim. Next take your mind off aiming (they brain and eye can maintain the sight picture you formed). If the last thing on your mind is aiming, target related issues are in your future.

Keep your bow arm active (pushing into the grip).  Keep your drawing arm side active by feeling the arm being held back by the rhomboid in the drawing arm side back.  Then budge the drawing side scapula toward the middle of your back (back motion is more positive than back tension).  As soon as this scapula budges, relax the back of the drawing arm and fingers all at once.

The bow arm will jump towards the target and fall to the side and down (the arrow will clear the bow before this bowers movement occurs).  The drawing hand will paint the side of the face, under the ear, and the thumb will end up on or near the shoulder. The elbow will fold down.  That's the archer's swing.

Avoiding this swing by keeping everything "still" is like the batter stopping the bat as it hits the ball. The only way to do that is to adjust before the bat and the ball come together, thus messing up your swing.  

This is an animated archery shot.

[F Thomas]

Keep your bow arm active (pushing into the grip).  Keep your drawing arm side active by feeling the arm being held back by the rhomboid in the drawing arm side back.  Then budge the drawing side scapula toward the middle of your back (back motion is more positive than back tension).  As soon as this scapula budges, relax the back of the drawing arm and fingers all at once.

The bow arm will jump towards the target and fall to the side and down (the arrow will clear the bow before this bowers movement occurs).  The drawing hand will paint the side of the face, under the ear, and the thumb will end up on or near the shoulder. The elbow will fold down.  That's the archer's swing.

This is an animated archery shot. [/QB]

I am getting back into shooting after a few years absence and working on the mental picture of "Perfect Form".  I like your description, particularly of the "drawing hand will paint the side of the face, under the ear ......"

It reminds me of a DVD called "The Push Release" by Mike Linsin that came out sometime in 2006.  If I remember correctly Linsin was teaching pushing into your anchor point as you made the release.  I found this caused me better involve the shooting hand elbow and back.  

Would that be a good mental picture of what you describe?