here we go again, african bow ban

[PAPA BEAR]

i smell anti hunting influences....smells like crap

[chrisg]

Not really "hunting,"Farm reared lions become very acclimatised to humans, and if they are 'farmed' for 'hunting' they are not wild, free ranging or in anyway able to function on their own as normal lions, they lay about looking for the meat wagon to arrive. To 'hunt' one of those you don't go out tracking, hunting etc, as soon as they hear your vehicle approach their camp (could be 200acres)or see you they come running, if you have not brought their grub they might happily eat you! They have lost all fear of humans. Hence those places routinely drug them and then set about creating a charade of 'hunting for tracks and 'finding' the lion.' Rather like mugging a drunk in an alleyway, some people are happy to do that. It is mostly about having a live target that looks just like the real thing and then you can take it home and tell your pals about what a brave hunter you are.

If they euthanase all those lions it is what will be, it is not at all about hunting in the fair chase sense of the word. It may even reduce or stop the cynical industry of canned hunts. If you ever do get the chance to encounter a real wild lion, it will be fleeting or else you had better be awake, they are no pushover.
chrisg

[BUFF]

I had a lion hunt over bait booked for 2010. I will spend my money else where

[tradtusker]

from what i can pick up from the guys in the industry PH's and some of the guys involved with SABA it is manly to stop canned hunting, big predators and some of the thick skinned big game.

 Not sure if they are going to include Buffalo on the lists or not, there will be a lot of guys looking out for that.
As for the plains game the way bowhunting has increase and the amount of bowhunters and bowhunting operations there now i can't see them outlawing it...

then again with their present government anything is possible!.....   :(  

 and why we don't have a house or a farm or live there anymore!   :mad:

[BUFF]

As far as I know my Buffalo hunt is still on

[chrisg]

A lion hunt over bait in a large wilderness area, or game ranch is a different matter, the lions will come to the bait on their own terms, some of those operations I referred to above are definitely not this. Buffalo are not on the list so far. Not sure about leopard. Speak to PHASA, a while ago Stuart Dorrington wrote a very full summation of the situation however I believe the recent (January 2008?) legislation does not match his comment entirely.I will try to get the SABA comment which is more relevant to us bowhunters.
Chrisg

[Patrick McCormick]

I'm all for canning canned hunts but to can bows seems pretty ignorant

[chrisg]

Patrick, there is no intention to can bows. There is the intelligent and carefully researched intention to assess the operation of hunting in a sustainable way. These regulations came after extensive industry consultation and while some may not agree entirely with them South Africa has a spotty reputation and needs to get its house in order. So while it may be possible to kill an elephant with a spear as stated above, the difference is that was a tribesman feeding his family and not a wealthy tourist, necessity vs recreation. Equally the proposals re big cats and thick skinned game are about what reasonably competent hunters can effectively achieve not what a the world's top archer/hunter can do at a stretch.The line was drawn at buffalo. (You can hunt buffalo with a bow) The arguement for canned predator hunts and the bleating about euthanasia is hypocritical in the extreme and is the same arguement 'for drug dealing' if there is a demand then it's ok. Garbage! Remember it is not only bowhunting canned lions but rifles too, yes, there are people who will sit on the back of a truck and shoot a drugged lion with a rifle and call it a 'hunt'.
chrisg

[chrisg]

One further comment is that is the USA wildlife belongs to the nation and if you have a valid tag/permit you may hunt it. There are restrictions regarding species, bag limits and seasons as well as posted land. I think that covers it.

In South Africa the game belongs to the landowner. That may be a farmer who does not even know there is a record book Kudu on his farm but if you shoot it, that's poaching. Certain species such as dangerous, endangered or exotic animals like lion,wild dog, elephant, Rhino, tigers come under closer limitations regarding ownership. The core difference is that the landowner can dispose of 'stock' at his discretion, and invite others to help him. This is where the ugly practice of lion farming arose, lions are not endangered but are considered 'dangerous' and in many areas are declared 'problem animals' in terms of the law. A problem animal must be destroyed unless it is kept under certain conditions, like a twelve foot electric fence. Have that and if you need to 'destroy' the animal you can sell the work to anyone you like...

 If you are a hunter you need a valid hunting licence and permission from the farmer. The licence will describe HOW and WHAT you may hunt under the act, eg rifle, bow, with dogs etc.If you transport game or game products you need permits from the state/provincial authorities and a form from the farmer stating that the game was legally aquired. Now the methods of hunting are set down in regulations that mostly start with what you are not allowed to do and then comes a list if conditions under which you may hunt...The base assumption is that you are not allowed to..except if you fufill a set of requirements.

It seems ponderous but I believe it has its origins in the old British notion of royal game and was intended to prevent the wholesale destruction of species by unscrupulous exploitation of game in open land. By giving game a value it has encouraged farmers to look after it. This has been a remarkable success story, there is now more land under game and more individual animals alive to day than there were 120 years ago, in the 'golden age of hunting in SA'! Amazing to think. South Africa can boast of hunters having multiple shot opportunities in good hunting conditions, they are happy and the farmers are happy.

I had the absolute gift of a job that took me to many game reserves and hunting farms over a period of four years and I was amazed at the care and expense farmers went to to ensure the health of their animals and farms. There were very few bad operations I am glad to report, although we saw a few masquerading as 'research or rehabilitation centres' that I doubt were anything of the sort.
chrisg

[Dartwick]

Part of the problem probably is that some one hunted Rhinos with a bow.

Using bows in unreasonable ways unfortunately gives all bow hunting a bad name.

[chrisg]

That is true, and now all wannabe heroes want a turn too. People watch and wait for bowhunters and all hunters, I guess, to make an unethical mistake. We don't get to decide what is ethical though, it is public opinion that does that.
chrisg