Deflex / Reflex selfbow

[John Scifres]

Where is it cracking?  Is it the knot making noise or the grain where it sworls all around the edge?  If it is the knot, excising and filling should correct your fears.  if it is the grain, I believe I would have to wrap with sinew.  Arrow pass or knot     Flip it over and it won't be the arrow pass anymore.

[DCM]

John,

I think it's popping right in the top of that knot.  I posted the pic with sanding dust to show where the crack is.  

I'm trying to work up enough courage to ignore it but it was loud enough, and as I was drawing it by hand I could feel it, noticable enough to alarm any experienced bowyer.

I'm gonna go into the top with a dremel tool this weekend and see what it looks like.

[AZStickman]

David... This isn't an exact match for what you have but I had this bow starting to crack out from a knot.... I drilled it out and plugged it,which held for about 50 shots until I heard a ... Tic.... at full draw... a new hair line crack had developed.... I sent it to Mike Westvang and he did A patch, over my plug, like Dean Torges describes on his site and I've never had a problem since....
  http://www.bowyersworkshop.com/plug.htm  

Good Luck.... Terry

[John Scifres]

I'd be afraid...very afraid until I saw what was inside there.  I like epoxy and sawdust to fill those punky knots.  I have one on my static that clearly moves but it has held so far.  I'll show it to you at MOJam or the Kentucky Classic if you are going.

[NEW GUY]

wow, the snug plug cutter.

[Dave Bulla]

Isn't that what Jim Fetrow on the *********** used to refer to as a Dutchman's plug?  I seem to recall him suggesting that type repair to several people.  Sure wish he'd get back on line and start coming here.

[AZStickman]

I think you're right about that being a dutchmans plug  Dave ... George Nagel is the one who turned me on to the plug cutter... Terry

[the Ferret]

Why in the world is it popping there David, it's not bending there is it?

[DCM]

Well every bow bends in the handle Mickey.  We just don't realize it.  Evidently it doesn't take much movement to separate this crack in the knot.  I picked up a cutter for my dremel on the way home.  I'm gonna dig it out a bit and see what's in there.  If it's fairly sound I'll put a patch on top.  If not I may go deeper with some kind of plug or in from the perpendicular.

I think for filler epoxy and sawdust is fine.  I think for structural work I prefer replacing the bad part with real wood and URAC.  This bow may have a lesson in it for me yet.

[DCM]

Well I think I got this problem figured out.  I've learned over the years identifying the problem properly is more important than the solution.

My idea is that this bow has in effect a Y in it where the branch that left the knot grew out from what became the main trunk.  Well that branch has a pith line in it.  We all know how weak a pith line is and this knot having been long dead didn't help matters.  I got down about 3/16" with the dremel and it became obvious.

I think I can drill that pith line out with a 3/8" drill and dowel it with URAC be back in bidness.  Only trouble is I kinda need to stay in that line of weak wood or I'll compromise it even more.

Now, how am I gonna figure out what angle to drill down into that knot?  I'm thinking straight up and down like the handle runs.  Or maybe at an angle to where I can see the pith line in the main trunk (lower limb)?  Maybe I'll just jump up to a 1/2" bit and then whatever extra I get won't hurt and I'll have a better chance of staying in the pith line?

[trashwood]

I peice and clean out knots like this before I start getting down to the nitty girtty.  that way I can judge (wrong a lot of the time) how much wood to leave around the knot to keep it stiff if it is in the handle.  I have gon outside the grain lines on a knot in the handle many times.  If it's is stiff it don't matter.  Sometimes it takes more wood around the knot to keep it stiff than ya think.  I have had a lot of practice at piece knots in and out of the handle area.  don't have a lot of bows to show for it though  

rusty

[DCM]

Well in hindsight... I know where I went astray Rusty.  I worked this handle down too narrow because I wanted a better arrow pass.  You are right, I should have dug this knot out, and patched it then if necessary, before I made it a bow.  I still hope to save it with a dowel.

[Bob Barnes]

ttt- great thread David.  You can do it and then bring it to mojam for us to see.
Bob