Short osage stave

[dixiearcher]

This may be a blasphemous question, but I am on a quest to build a short bow for blinds/treestands (52-56" and 40-45# @26.5"). I have been researching various laminated options and had a wild idea. I have a seasoned osage stave and was wondering if I could turn that into a bow the length I want by backing it with fiberglass or something else? I am not a professional and don't have a large budget, I just want a bow that is functional and fun. Anybody have any experience or ideas? Would it be better do leave the stave for another day and invest in the parts to do a laminated bow?

[KenH]

With an Osage stave, why would you want/need to back it with anything?  That long of bow can certainly get you that draw length and weight without backing.  And I don't consider 52"-56" a short bow.  Most of my bows are 48" in that draw range, others even shorter.  The tribes of the Pacific Northwest built wide, short  "paddle bows" from 32" to 42" with draw weights up to 50# at 20-26".  They were designed for close range hunting in the seriously thick undergrowth of the Temperate Rainforest in the PNW. 

Have you ever carved a bow from a stave before? 

[dixiearcher]

No I have never worked a stave before. I love the idea of a 48" or shorter bow though. Would you happen to have some pictures or plans I could see?

[dixiearcher]

I know it doesn't have to be backed, I just want to increase my chances of success on my first build

[fujimo]

as a bend thru the handle bow , you should quite comfortably be able to get a 52-54" bow to suit your 26" draw.
flipping the tips will help a bunch too.
sinew-ing the bow might be a great option.
i have seen it reported by many sinew experts, that in order to gain the max from sinew, anything over 55 to 60" is  not advantageous. sure it provides security and strength, but with the extra mass, and the sinew not being stretched to its max potential- a lot is lost- just quoting here!
but your bow would fall in that short category very nicely- i would refrain from the glass.
sinew can be very cheap or free- and there are folk on here that do a lot of it, and can guide you.

glass, with polyester resin is not a good deal- resin to glass ratio is too high, polyester wont stick to wood well, (epoxy would be the right thing, but its expensive.) and a lot of extra weight will be induced with transverse fibers sucking up resin, but not working, unless of course if you use uni directional glass.
glass should be laid up under tension, for optimal performance- which will be hard to do on an undulating bow back.
it will give you some security but i would rather use rawhide for back protection, or sinew and hide glue for optimal performance and security.

a bend thru the handle with flipped tips and some sinew would be an awesome bow- at your drawlength!!

[fujimo]

there Ken has some good info!!

also remember that backing wont cover up bad design or bad tillering.
i would consider building a board bow or two- to get a handle on tillering, then work up to a stave.
i bet you could get a hickory board bow to do what you need as a start!!

[Pat B]

Adding a glass backing would probably decrease the durability of an osage bow. Like was said above, a 56" osage bow doesn't need a backing but you could recurve the tips and add a sinew backing.

[neuse]

Dixiearcher, I am there with you.

I have two short Osage staves I am working on now, I have hitting a stopping point because I am not sure how to proceed.
I need to learn how to post pictures so that I could ask for advice.

[Roy from Pa]

Link below, Rob's second post explains posting pictures.


http://www.tradgang.com/tgsmf/index.php?topic=160865.0

Also on you tube, there are many videos on making self bows.

[George Tsoukalas]

An experienced bowyer could probably get 26" out of a 54-56" osage stave.
A first timer would do well to double his draw and add 10" ntn.
Jawge

[dixiearcher]

May be a dumb question, but what do you mean by "double his draw?"

[Forwardhandle]

Im sending this 44 in. stave to a friend in New Mexico this morning he will get 2 44 in bendys out of it and sinew back them he typicly gets 22-26 in. draw out of that size but even non backed with quality osage probably could safely go 23 in. or more but wouldnt be as fast as the sinew counter part !

[Roy from Pa]

I  moved back to Pa:)

 

Double your draw and add 10 inches means double the length of your draw and add 10 inches to that and that is the length bow you should make.

[KenH]

Paddle bow Specs:

Often they were made with Yew, Maple, Juniper, Ash -- woods common in the Pacific Northwest.  Often they were sinew backed which helps 'save' less than stellar quality woods.  Working with sinew and hide or fish glues is a smelly, nasty business, but raw flax (not linen) and Titebond in this type of bow will work just as well, cost considerably less and not get you thrown out of the house!

Here are the dimensions for a Hupa style paddle bow:
Width ------- at handle 1-11/16" -- at mid-limb 2-1/4" -- at pin nock 11/16"
Thickness --- at handle 3/8"       -- at mid-limb 5/16" -- at pin nock 5/16"  (virtually the same thickness tip-to-tip

Here's a site that specializes in making them, for some shape ideas.
primitive-bows.com/tag/paddle-bow

There is a fair amount of info on the 'net if you search on "Modoc Bow"

[BMorv]

Yeah check out some of the other bows Simon has built on that link that Ken posted.  He has done some amazing things with short pieces of osage.  I wouldn't call them beginner bows though. 

[dixiearcher]

I  moved back to Pa:)

 

Double your draw and add 10 inches means double the length of your draw and add 10 inches to that and that is the length bow you should make.

Haha ok gotcha!

[Eric Krewson]

I lot of folk transition from glass bows to selfbows and want to bring the glass bow mentality along with the change, I did but got over it.

I have shot up to a 68" bow out of a treestand and except for straight down I didn't have a problem with the longer limbs.

Like has been said you can make a bendy handle bow with flipped tips but this is not a beginners journey to embark on.

Learn bow making on a bunch of boards then tackle your hopped up treestand bow.

[George Tsoukalas]

dixie, 26" (2) + 10= 62"
Jawge