Heavy carbon arrows?

[Bonebuster]

There is alot of question and answer posts about getting arrows to weigh in like we want.
Does anyone know why they don`t make what we obviously want?
Even the Grizzly stix aren`t what alot of us seem to want. Not to mention price.
I have seen some good ideas on these posts and even have had some hairbrain ideas of my own(that have worked) on how to get arrow weights up, and it just doesn`t seem like it would be too hard to make what we want at the factory.
Maybe they are working it.

[Bowmania]

I'm glad they don't make them heavy, in the near future I'm only hunting elk and whitetails.  Don't know if I'll ever hunt brown bear and the only other thing I would need a heavier arrow for is moose.  And would probably only shoot 550 grs. for that.  

Bowmania

[Shawn Leonard]

Bear, do not require an arrow any heavier than Whitetale, now Moose and even Elk require more. I do not know how heavy ya want. An arrow that weighs 14gpp before ya add the point weight and the inserts and such can weigh up wards of 800 grains and with the GSs I think ya can get them over that. Carbons now outweigh most wood shafts and aluminums as well. Shawn

[dino]

Bonebuster,
In the larger scheme of things, carbon shafts for the trad market are a very small percentage of carbon shaft total sales.  Goldtips wood grain hunter shafts are seconds from their target shaft line.  They don't run them specifically thus all the shortages. (That was right from my rep at the Gold Tip factory)  Trad is a way of using up their "blems".

Carbon Express discontinued making their weight tubes and cut production on the Heritage line last year.  Weight tubes weren't selling to their expectations.  I don't think that Heritage shafts were either and that is why production was pushed back and delayed.

Beman MFX is just an Axis with a woodgrain wrap for the trad shooters.  Again not a huge leap.

The moral of the story is that the trad market does not justify the making of a variety of heavy weight carbons specifically for trad shooters.  Their bread and butter is wheel shooters and target shooters and that is were the product development is focused.  And justly so.

You are 100% right that it wouldn't be too hard to make but I would be shocked if any of the large carbon manufactures made a specific carbon for the trad market in HEAVY gpi weights.  Mainly because the market is not there for them. dino

[Bonebuster]

Dino, thanks for the reply, and the answer.
I guess in the modern business world, you gotta go where the demand is.
Maybe its more "fun" to play around with different set-ups to achieve the results you want anyway.
I know I certainly get more miles out of my arrows
ever since I switched to carbon shafting. With alot of trial and error, I got my arrows to weigh what I wanted without too much up front, and I think it is the most efficient set-up I have ever used. Thanks agian.

[Shawn Leonard]

Dino, I do not understand your reply. They may not not be made specifically for T5rad guys but how heavy do ya want them. I know of several shafts that weigh from 12.3gpi. to 17gpi or whatever the heavy Grizz stick are. Shawn

[waterone]

Bonebuster:

I'm not sure what you are wanting.  Are your bows so heavy in pull weight that you need arrows greater than Shawn wrote about.  It is easy to get carbons with point, and adapters to exceed 12 gpi.  I guess if you are shooting bows that need an extra-heavy arrow to contol hand shock, vibration, and noise, you would need real heavy arrows.  If so, about your only solution is to stick with hardwood.

Also, I'm not sure why people still think they need an extra-heavy carbon.  If 10 gpi the LOW point?  The bowyers I've talked to say, unless your dealing with a selfbow, try to target 10 to 12 gpi. Some will say you can even go lower.

You might seach the site here with some terms like "carbon"and "LaClair" and "carbon and morrison" or even "carbon and "Terry Green"

Just don't get into the research habit, you might lose a couple of hours a night searching!!! I know I have.  It's almost like hunting, well at least going down rabbit holes.

[JImmyDee]

I don't think "heavy" and "carbon" go together -- after all, they use that stuff in cars and planes because it's light.

I'm sure they could use different resins or change something else in order to increase weight, but the shaft-building tools and materials AVAILABLE seem to be driven by the golf club shaft market.  So If you want more weight, you need more material.  And that means stiffer shafts.

The heaviest carbon shafts I've found are from Carbon Tech.  I bought a dozen of their Safari shafts for a heavy bow and they're an absolute delight -- but I've got 250gr points on 'em and they're way too stiff for anything under 80#.

I tried some weight tubes, etc., but seem to like the brass insert  and heavy points approach to puttng on weight better.  

I have one bow that seems to shoot carbons as light as 8 gr/lb; none of my others do well with anything less than 10 gr/lb and I wasn't comfortable with the thought of tearing-up my bow with too-light arrows...

[Danny Rowan]

waterone,

Most bowyers say shoot at least 8gr per pound of bow weight for target and 10 to 12 gr per pound of bow weight for hunting. For a 60# bow that means 600+ grains for hunting and around 490 grains for target. Do not know how gpi figures into it.

Danny

[waterone]

Danny:

10 gpi for a 30" arrow shaft would be 300 gr. then add the weight of the insert, nock, fletching, broadhead, etc.  

This os what Shawn was getting at better than me  

(nice if you could still easily buy Forgewoods wouldn't it - I'd love to see someone take up production once again)

waterone

[bjk]

I can very easily build a carbon arrow rig that will weigh from 7 to 12-14+ gplb...Beman/Axis make exactly what I want...in that regard, so does Cabelas, AD's, CE depending on my mood...IMO Bemans with HIT are awesome.

[yleecoyote23]

Yep, like bjk said, not hard to build a carbon to weigh as much (or as little) as you want.

With weight tubes (or aquarium tubing, rope, weedeater line, etc), brass inserts, heavy adapters and points you have a lot of choices and variety and can get just about any weight you want or need...

So even if they don't "give us what we want", we can make do with what we have..... and have fun experimenting and playing  

[Bowspirit]

Danny, you said it best...

[James Wrenn]

I think they do make what most of us want.  

[Shawn Leonard]

Danny, what was said above. I have shot carbons that just the bareshaft, no inserts, nock, feathers, nothing weigh 12.3 gpi. now add 100 grain insert, broadhead adapter, feathers, nock, crown wrap, ya get them up there to where they weigh a total of 6,7 or even 800 grains, than ya get the gpp. figure. 60#s 660 grain arrows is 11 gpp. Shawn

[Mike Bolin]

When I shot Grizzlystiks, they finished out at 605 gr. That was 29" to bop and the supplied brass insert with an aluminum broadhead adapter and a 125 gr. Woodsman. Also 3-5.5" high back shields and these shafts were the "alaskans". My current arrows are right at 570 gr. The are Beman 400's with the 100 gr. adapter and the same length, fletching and point combination. The largest game I have taken was a big bull caribou with the grizzlystick and penetration was excellent. There are weight tubes still available out there and I could easily push the 400's to the 650+ gr. range if I needed to. Good luck! Mike

[Doc Nock]

I copied this from AK Bowhunt website:[note: grizstick Alaskan is the lighter and the SAFARI is the heavier:
**********

GrizzlyStik is the only arrow shaft that uses…

Continuous Taper Technology: Slow motion photography proves that when an arrow is shot out of a bow, it bends. The sudden acceleration that causes the bending is called the archer’s paradox. The GrizzlyStik, because of its continuous taper design, has less weight on the rear portion of the arrow enabling it to quickly straighten out from this bending. However, very little thought is given to what happens to an arrow when it decelerates….as when striking a target. The reverse happens. But now the bending takes place in animal tissue and it causes friction…drag…which retards penetration. The GrizzlyStik, because of its lighter tail weight, straightens out much more quickly when it decelerates….resulting in less drag and greater penetration.

GrizzlyStik Safari is designed for the largest and most dangerous of the big game animals. It has the same features as the Alaskan but at 15 grains per inch, the Safari is the strongest and heaviest production shaft available. The finished arrow weight of this shaft will range between 650 and 850+ grains and is designed to be shot out of bows between 55 and 100+ pounds draw weight.