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Author Topic: Thoughts on dropping DW....  (Read 916 times)

Offline GMMAT

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2009, 11:51:00 PM »
Question No. 2....

I'm pulling the trigger on the 45# model.  I know I'll be OK with it.

Right now I'm shooting CX 150's out of a 52# Mohawk LB.  The recurve I'm getting (45#'er) is cut 1/16" past center.

What's the chances I can shoot the same arrows.....or do you think I'm gonna have to go to CX 90's?

Offline nightowl1

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2009, 11:56:00 PM »
cut 29" 100g brass insert 125 broadhead, that should get you close... I used the dynamic spine calculator... it predicted my arrows spot

Ill let some more experienced guys with that poundage chime in
Combo Hunter 46@28

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Offline GMMAT

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2009, 12:20:00 AM »
What does it say if I leave them at 30"?

That's what I'm shooting, now, with 50gr. brass inserts and 125 up front.

Thanks.

Offline Rob DiStefano

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2009, 07:26:00 AM »
jeff, just shoot yer current arras, you'll most likely be just fine.  as in golf, archery is an aiming sport that depends lots on form.  

no matter how yer shooting right now, proper aiming is the logical extension of solid form.  aiming the arrow means that arra spine is far less importnat than if you aimed the bow.  

the following article was an eye opener for me, and i shoot the same 29" carbon 500's out of bows that range 43# to 55# in holding weight, the only changes are in front end weight that tailor the gpp and foc ...

 http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=004545
IAM ~ The only government I trust is my .45-70 ... and my 1911.

Offline Bear

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2009, 09:24:00 AM »
For a second I thought "what could Don have done that is this bad"?    :confused:      :D  

I started at 40, worked up to 65, dropped to 50, and now settled around mid to upper fifties. It was amazing how I was able, almost over night, to start shooting heavier bows when I discovered the right muscles. From there it's just a matter of staying in shape. There were several months a couple years ago where I didn't shoot. That's the only reason I dropped down from the 60's. Back into the upper fifties now. Don't really care to go any higher now.

This is all great advice, but one of my favorites is what James Wrenn said. It's all about the fun. Lighter bows allow more fun, plain and simple. When you've been having fun for a while and notice your accuracy, consistancy of form, and confidence are up (and they will be), go ahead and order some heavier limbs. By then your muscle memory will be such that you hardly notice difference.
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Offline ron w

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2009, 09:43:00 AM »
You don't have to drop all the way to 45#! Go down to 47 or 48# ,a couple of # in your favor won't beat you up but will give you that extra perfomance your looking for. I have a Great Plaines SR Swift 48#@28" that I would hunt any thing with including Elk and sheep or mt. goats,all tough critters. A heavy arrow, sharp head, and shot placment is the recipe!!!  ron w
In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities. In the expert's there are few...So the most difficult thing is always to keep your beginner's mind...This is also the real secret of the arts: always be a beginner.  Shunryu Suzuki

Offline Rob DiStefano

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2009, 09:46:00 AM »
as mentioned by someone already, lots does depend on the bow design - there's a large performance difference between a 45# hill style reflex longbow and a 45# aggressive hybrid r/d longbow .....
IAM ~ The only government I trust is my .45-70 ... and my 1911.

Offline Tree man

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2009, 10:25:00 AM »
I have been impressed at how very little performance difference on game Ive gotten at weights from 42-58 lbs. When you are straining it may seem like you are harnessing awsome power but really bows don't function with huge energy inputs and outputs and a sharp broadhead tipped arrow works very similarly over the range of "normal" drawweights.

Offline Onehair

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2009, 10:40:00 AM »
If you start dropping weight you will find that in time the lower weight begins to feel heavy. Better to work out a little and build up to the bow you have. Unless you are really over bowed to begin with.

Offline Rob DiStefano

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #29 on: April 10, 2009, 11:59:00 AM »
a good way to work out is to overdraw yer bow an inch or so past anchor.  do this a few times a day, and as part of yer shooting warm up.
IAM ~ The only government I trust is my .45-70 ... and my 1911.

Online M60gunner

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #30 on: April 10, 2009, 12:12:00 PM »
If all your going to do is hunt with the 45# bow at under 20 yards go for it. But if your like me and you shoot alot of 3-D, 1-2 times a week, you may be disappointed like I was. My bows range from 50-64#'s in draw weight. I am pushing 64 years old. I am doing bow exercises and weights to maintain these bow weights.
I would stay at 55lbs. as long as you can. Like Onehair says about the lower weight feeling heavy. Even these days when time is money a person can find a few minutes to do some bow exercises. Even this old guy.

Offline James Wrenn

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #31 on: April 10, 2009, 12:36:00 PM »
M60 just wondering what dissapointed you shooting 3d with a 45lb bow?

A 45 and 60 will shoot the same speed with the right arrows so really can't see the difference.Every bow I own reguardless of the weight can be set up to shoot as fast or slow as I need.Just wondered what your reasoning was.
....Quality deer management means shooting them before they get tough....

Offline amar911

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #32 on: April 10, 2009, 12:37:00 PM »
I have bows from 43 pounds to 72 pounds. I am almost exactly your height and only a few pounds lighter. I am 56 years old, have had past shoulder injuries on both sides, had surgery on my right shoulder (I am right-handed) in December 2005, and even went through an almost life ending bout with stage 4 cancer a couple of years ago. So, I doubt my overall condition is as good as yours. A year ago I could barely draw a 45 pound bow. Now that weight is very easy for me to shoot, and I regularly shoot bows in the 50 to 60 pound range without problems. Like everyone else, I cannot shoot as many arrows in a session with the heavier weight bows as I can with the lighter weight bows, but up to the low 60's I can shoot almost as well. My form starts suffering noticeably  when shooting bows above the low 60's. Mostly I shoot in the mid-50's with no problem at all.

Obviously, like all other archers, a 45 pound bow is easier to shoot than a 55 pound bow for me too, but the performance of the 55 pound bow in the same model of bow is much better, and the arrows hit with much more authority. Because some states require at least a 50 pound bow for elk, I don't see any reason to buy an "elk hunting bow" at less than 50 pounds, even if you might go to a state without that requirement.

If you get into a regular (almost daily) exercise program and build up slowly, even someone in my situation can easily get to the point that 50+ pounds is not difficult to shoot. It should be no problem for someone your size and in your condition. Even four months after cancer treatment I had trouble lifting 10 pounds. It took me more than a year of physical therapy before I could start thinking about shooting a bow again. At that point, in addition to working out with my physical therapist, I started using a BowFit exerciser every day to build up my strength and then started adding in the shooting of a 45 pound bow. At first I could barely draw the 45 pound bow to full draw and could not hold at all. I could only draw a 50 pound bow back to about 25 inches of my 29 1/2" draw length. Now, a year after starting shooting again, I can shoot my 70 pound bows for a short time and can shoot 55 pound bows for hours at a time. I shoot my 45 to 50 pound bows a lot for fun and form and can shoot hundreds of arrows from them without my form beginning to suffer much.

If all you intend to shoot is animals under 200 pounds, then a 45 pound bow is plenty, but a 600 pound elk is a totally different animal. A 45 pound bow at close range will definitely kill a big elk if shot broadside through the ribs, but quartering shots require more penetration and 45 pounds may not be enough to make a quick, clean kill. I will be hunting cape buffalo this June/July and my professional hunter is concerned that a 70 pound bow is too light. He is a trad bowhunter himself, so he understands what it takes. I can't shoot a heavier bow anyway, so I guess it will work or he will have to shoot the buffalo with a .470 Nitro Express following my failure.

A 30 pound bow with the right arrows and broadhead and with perfect shot placement can kill elk under many circumstances, just like a .22 long rifle cartridge can. In Africa they do culling operations on impala at night with .22 rimfire rifles and silencers and kill hundreds of impala in a single night, but no professional hunter would ever suggest that his client use a .22 rimfire to hunt impala or other similar sized game. Often people discuss the minimum weapon needed to kill animals; however, just like any other life and death endeavor, there should always be a significant overkill factor built in for the times when less than idea circumstances exist. Shooting at least a 50 pound bow on elk, especially if you are fortunate enough to encounter a 600+ pound bull rather than a 300 pound cow, seems to be a very good idea.

I obviously shoot lower poundage bows, but not often anymore. Onehair is right in saying that after dropping to a lower weight it will eventually begin to feel as heavy as the higher weight. I'm not disagreeing with anyone who says that you should not overbow yourself or that a 45 pound bow is adequate for deer, turkey or smaller hogs. Also, a 45 pound bow will always be easier to shoot than a 50 pound bow. If I were in your shoes I would get a very smooth drawing, fast 50 pound bow and do your regular exercises and shooting so you can shoot it easily. If you are working out with a BowFit exerciser and using it to draw and hold the equivalent of 55 to 60 pounds in an exercise mode, a 50 pound bow will feel as light as a 45 pound bow feels to you now.

One final note. I keep at least one bow strung all the time and have it sitting in my living room where I have to pass by it regularly. I pick it up almost every time I walk by it and draw and hold full weight until I begin to get the shakes. Then I put it down until I go past it again. If you are very stable in your exercises and don't strain to draw or hold the bow, you won't hurt yourself, but you will build up your strength and your ability to shoot a heavier bow very quickly -- certainly within a few months.

Sorry to be so lengthy here. It's just that I am your size and have been through the struggle of coming from near death, with no strength and previous shoulder surgery, to being able to easily shoot bows above 50 pounds. I just don't see any reason why you could not shoot 50 pounds with no problem and have a bow that would legally handle all the hunting you stated you wanted to do.

Allan
TGMM Family of the Bow

Offline Rob DiStefano

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #33 on: April 10, 2009, 01:26:00 PM »
i think everyone's different, at least slightly.  i see no issues with using a 45# stickbow for both hunting and target type events.  a huge number of barebow hunting type events have been won with stickbows in the 45# and under range.  larry yien has how many ifaa longbow world champ titles using his 43# 21st century edge?  

anyhoo, all this stuff is just jabber and food for thought, and you surely need to do the testing yerself and see what works, what doesn't.  the bottom line that we're all 'experiments of one'.
IAM ~ The only government I trust is my .45-70 ... and my 1911.

Offline Greg Skinner

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #34 on: April 10, 2009, 02:06:00 PM »
Lots of great comments here for you to mull over.  I can't add much to what amar911 said, but I do agree with those who say a little extra cushion in draw weight for elk is good. If all I were to hunt was deer class animals, I doubt I would use anything heavier than 45#.  However, I live in elk country and at age 64 I still believe I have a few elk hunts left in me.  For that reason I work to keep in shape enough to be able to handle a mid-50's draw weight at my 27" draw.  I'm only 5'8" and 157 lb, and I used to shoot 60-65# bows, but developed some minor shoulder problems, so I backed off a bit. I shot a 50#HH for a while to work on form. My latest HH blank came out at 57#, which seemed quite stiff for awhile, because I was so used to the 50#.  My form suffered at first, so I had to work back and forth between the 50# and the 57# until I gradually got the muscle memory back to accepting the 57#.  Now I am shooting the 57# and everything in between the two better than ever - with good form. Those who have told you that correct form enables you to shoot the heavier weights better and more comfortably are correct also. I guess my advice would be to drop back in poundage to develop your form, but don't forsake something a little heavier if you think elk hunting is in your future.
And in the end of our exploring we shall return to the place where we started and know that place for the first time.

Offline Stump Buster

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2009, 07:00:00 PM »
Quote
My wifes longbow is 41#@28". I shoot it a lot for form practice. Light wieght, comfortable as all get out to shoot. I am definitely more accurate with it, and I I use it to focus on form, then when I shoot my heavier bows, my form is better and I shoot them better. If I feel bad habits forming, I immediately go back to the lighter bow to resolve them. [/QB]
This is EXACTLY why I went with #38@28" for my new Mohawk. I mostly shoot for fun now, but have 45,50 and 60 pound bows. I have no idea what my true draw length is going to be once I start into this again, but it will probably be somewhere between 29-30". Just like GMMAT, I want to "Start Over" and do it right, so this will be my 3D, Stumpin', Small Game and Form Perfectin' bow. With all the new discoveries discussed here that I missed over the past couple of years (EFOC, String Count, MoBB DVD's, Etc.), I CAN'T WAIT to start shooting every day like I used to!!!  :archer:
In the wind, he's still alive...

Offline bayoulongbowman

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2009, 07:08:00 PM »
Ive talked about this with many hunters, And the way I see it , its simple , hunters dont put enough time in , or practice...ya got to commit to it and work at it . Not just once in while thing...you should be able to work up to later. You should be able to sit in chair and pull ur bow back comfortable. ps  DONT OVER DO IT...a little everyday...practice , practice...once weekend dont cut for me..good luck bud! Youll be shooting lights out in no time!  :wavey:
"If you're living your life as if there is no GOD, you had  better be right!"

Offline Rob DiStefano

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2009, 07:32:00 PM »
lotta good stuff in this thread, could make for a good article.  :cool:

'form' is so much easier to define and cultivate with an easy-to-hold bow.  once the form feels natural, you'll know when it's wrong when applied to a heavier holding bow.  all my form work and fun shooting/roving is with a 43# or 46# longbow.  when it's hunt time, i'll gradually work out with the 55 pounder.  this is best for me and my shoulder issues - not fun geting older!

one thing for sure, as bayou said, ya really gotta pull string daily to keep fit physically and mentally.  even if ya don't release an arra, keep a bow strung and give'r a pull now and then (especially pulling *past* yer anchor and holding).
IAM ~ The only government I trust is my .45-70 ... and my 1911.

Online M60gunner

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Re: Thoughts on dropping DW....
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2009, 10:08:00 PM »
James, I just could not get used it. Maybe I was expecting more preformance from the light arrows than I got. I hear you when you said you can tune your bows to shoot the same. I just can not tune me!

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