All of these tuning issues...

[LittleChief]

Okay.  I'm one of the new fellows here.  I've been shooting my ONLY trad bow (Bear Montana) for a little over a year now.  I should add that I didn't even start shooting a compound until 2007.  The last few tuning threads have me reminded me that I know nothing about this.  My bow is 55# @ 28".  I draw 29.5" on a compound, so I assume that's an approximate 28" draw on the longbow.  I'm shooting GT 3555's cut to 29" with standard inserts and 145 grain heads.  I also have the GT weight system, and right now I have two 50 grain weights in the front and one 50 grain weight in the back along with the nock adapter.  Close to 600 grains total weight.  Maybe heavy, but I'm learning.  I also shoot split fingers.

I've only shot bareshaft at 10 yards, and the arrows are impacting about 3-4" left of the fletched shafts and they're significantly tail left and tail high.  Okay.  Tail left means it's showing weak, so I know what to do there.  Question is, how do you correct for the tail up/down?  Move the nocking point?  Also, what's this "playing with the brace height" I keep seeing?  Do you simply twist the string to increase brace height and relax the twist to decrease?

[Mo. Huntin]

bare shafts impacting left of fletched means stiff.  I would guess you are bouncing off your riser and giving you a possible false weak reading.  They say you should fix your up and down adjustment with knock height first.  yes you twist the string to increase brace height.

[SlowBowinMO]

Chasing nock position (like tail left) when bare shafting will drive you nuts.  Focus on the impact point versus the fletched shafting point of impact.  If you're right handed it sounds like your arrows are showing stiff as the bare shafts are impacting left.  I'd suggest you take the weight out of the back and see what happens, it should weaken them up a bit.  If that's not enough, put the weight back in but up front to weaken them even further.

The Montana is cut well short of center and is an average performing bow, it doesn't need a whole lot of spine, but those arrows should tune for you. My 2 cents.

[Mo. Huntin]

When I said possible false weak reading I meant that reffering to the nock left that you spoke of.  I agree with slowbowinMo he gets his point accross better than me

[eagle24]

Personally, I would start by playing with the brace height, removing the weight at the nock, and adding a heavier field point.  The gold tip weights work fine, but in my experience when you add weight, you don't get near the same result as a heavier field point.  Every weight you ad shortens the shaft.  The added weight makes it weaker, but the shortened shaft takes some of the gain away.  Sort of like 1 step forward and 1/2 step back.

Also, I use O.L.'s tuning method and don't worry about nock left or nock right.  Just worry about where the bare shaft impacts relative to the fletched group.  It has worked well and I can shoot bare shafts with my fletched arrows out to 30 yards.  If I go any further, I'm not a good enough shot to group well enough to make a decision on what needs to be done.  Shoot lots of groups when you start getting it close before you make an adjustment.

[McDave]

I'm assuming you're right-handed?  If so, I would agree with Mo; there's no way your shafts could be too stiff.  But that's the indication you're getting, so it must be a false indication.

Just for fun, why don't you take all the weights out of your bare shaft, and shoot it with just a 125 grain point.  That should be about right for your setup, and would be good for target shooting, since it would be a lot faster, flatter arrow than you're currently using.

Later, if you want to load up an arrow with more weight for hunting, you would probably be better off with a GT 5575.  You could load a lot of weight on the front of those before you would overload it.  The problem with loading weight on your 3555 is that once you get a true indication, about the only place you'll be able to load on weight is on the back and you won't have a sufficiently front-weighted arrow to get good arrow flight.

I don't know what your nock point is, so I can't tell if it is too high or too low.  You can get a nock high indication either way: either a true nock high, or a false nock high from the arrow bouncing off the shelf (which could also contribute to your false nock right).  You should probably start with a nock point of about 3/4", which should give you a true nock high, and work your way down about 1/16" at a time until you eliminate it.

On the other hand, if you're left-handed, the indication you're getting is that the arrow shaft is too weak, which is probably correct.

[LittleChief]

Thanks for the input, fellas.  

eagle24 - Never thought about that aspect of adding weights.  By the time you add the length of the insert and two weights, adding a third 50 grain weight is putting 50 grains of weight 1 1/2 - 1 3/4 inches from the end of the arrow.  I can see where that would make a difference.

[Mo. Huntin]

I would go with O.Ls tuning and forget about looking at knock angles.  Just go by arrow impact.  you better just go there and read it yourself it is not to hard.

[LittleChief]

McDave,

   Yes, I'm right handed.  I guess I should have added that at the start.  You folks are providing a lot of good information.  Thanks.

[WestTnMan]

I would suggest what McDave said. Remove all the weights and put a 125 gr pint on and see what happens. When I do mine if I have tail high I lower my nock point and visa versa. I go with the premis that tail right is weak and tail left is stiff. Change point weights around until they fly true. Worked for me. Or you could just bring everything to the shoot Saturday and work on it.

Forgot to add...Twisting and untwisting the string is how you raise and lower the brace heights. Brace height is measured from the deepest part of the grip to the string.

[LittleChief]

Originally posted by WestTnMan:
Or you could just bring everything to the shoot Saturday and work on it.

  I can see it now.  Me showing up at my first ever trad 3D shoot with my poor old Montana, a quiver full of arrows, some unfletched, assorted field points, various weight inserts and a 33 inch long allen wrench saying "Terry said y'all could help me out here."

[WestTnMan]

Happens more than you know. We need a good laugh too..............you will get it figured out though. Lots of good help here for sure.

[Wolfkiss]

LittleChief, this has helped me out a great deal.


 http://www.bowmaker.net/tuning.htm

Have fun. Andy.