how do you tune stone pointed arrows?

[ozy clint]

i have been playing with wood for the 1st time last week trying to put together some primitive style arrows.
i bought myself some test packs from surewoods since i have points of varying weights and wasn't sure any how what spine i'd need.
my plan has been to use a wood screw adapter and screw in field point of matching weight to the stone point. bare shaft, then haft the point.
since these are to be a primitive arrow i went ahead and carved self nocks in a few to test shoot.
now i've got six broken arrows and a vague idea which spine will work      
seems like alot of work for little reward.

for a 69# recurve drawn to 28", shooting 23/64" woods this is what seemed to fly the best.

full length shaft 300gr upfront....80-85# spine
full length shaft 150gr upfront....75-80# spine

i want to keep having a go at this but spending a week making a few arrows, breaking most of them and ending up with just an idea of the spine i need is alot of work. i think i've come to realise that maybe the pleasure that i get from trad is being out there hunting not stuck in my shed making one arrow. anyone else feel the same?
oh, and how do you tune your primitive arrows?

[snakewood3]

So now you are close to knowing your correct arrow spine...don't give up yet. Being that you are shooting a modern recurve (I assume) that is probably very close to center shot, that alone makes the job much easier as compared to a self bow. Even the best commercially avalible wood shafting is generally weaker then shoot or cane shafts.
  Things to try are putting a 10 inch or so nock taper on your shafts, this will tend to make them show as a weaker spine, but will also make them more tolerant of differing point weights..to some degree.
  Spin alignment with a couple bearing or V blocks is the way I mount my points. Just go about it slowly and if you are loosing paitience then step away and go hunting...come back to the task with a fresh mind.

[Killdeer]

After busting a bunch of ash shafts, I don't bareshaft wood any more. If I had a test pack, I would cut the shafts to the desired length, fletch and glue on broadheads. Big wide broadheads. If you have more than one shaft in each spine range, put field tips on some.

The ones that fly well are close to the correct spine. The ones that hit where your field tips do are the gems.

Buy a dozen or two more of that spine, and make up your arrows. Put broadheads of the same weight as your stone points on half the shafts and practice with them. Save your stone points for the real deal. Make sure they spin true as a steel broadhead when you mount them.

Killdeer

[Bill Skinner]

Try some tapered ash shafts, get them 80-85.  You want 23/64 tapering to 11/32 for max weight.  If they are overspined, sand the middle 1/3 lightly.  It will bring the spine down quickly, so sand and check, sand and check.  3/8 ramin will also make a nice heavy arrow, you WILL have to do some sanding, they will spine out over 100.   Bill

[Benny Nganabbarru]

I no longer believe in bare-shaft-tuning wooden arrows, either. I'm much happier with paper-tuning, watching flight, and getting broadheads to impact the same as field points. Keep at it, Clint, as you will enjoy the rewards eventually!

[ozy clint]

that's how i broke them all....bareshafts into a styrofoam block. little bit sideways......snap.

if i point taper a shaft to allow the use of a woodscrew adapter in testing, how much stiffer does wood get when shortened by 1/2"? i'll loose about 1/2" after hafting a point. how weak do i have to leave them to allow for it?
i'll think i'll fletch some up and use the planing method. hopefully i won't break the two shaft i've got that are the spine i'll need.

ben- i've got a dozen shafts of varying spines from 90-110# if you want them. they have proved to be to stiff at 32" with the heaviest point i'm likely to shoot.

[Benny Nganabbarru]

Well, I am surprised! You learn something new every day! Yeah, I'll take them off you one day when we catch-up. Have you thought of rigging-up your own "haftable" fieldpoints, with a little bit of welding? Any merit to that? It'd keep all things equal.

[Killdeer]

I only use glue-on points for woodies, and need the taper anyway for the stone point. So, taper for glue-ons, and if you need to, you can take the glue-on off and slot the tip of the shaft for the stone point. Be sure to craft a smooth transition of taper from the shaft onto the point.

Killdeer

[Art B]

Wood shafts come in around 32" lengths but are spine rated at the standard 28" w/125gr point.  For example, an 80-85# full length shaft has a dynamic spine of around 60-65# (perhaps a tad more with center or close to center shot bows) using a 125gr point. But you're using a 300gr point correct? I would think that would put your dynamic spine in the 30's.

Heaviest point I've used is 220gr and I had to use a 110# shaft to get the correct dynamic spine (for a finished arrow of 30") and that was for a 50# selfbow.

You might want to hang on to those stiffer shafts. That 110# shaft cut to a finished arrow length of 28" using your 300gr point is about the closest thing you got IMO. ART

[Don Stokes]

Bare-shafting wood shafts works just fine, but you need a really soft foam target, like furniture cushions. The soft foam will catch the arrows without breaking them when the spine is off. Since wood is variable, even in a "matched" set, it works best a close range instead of by O. L.'s method of longer range and comparing fletched to unfletched.

I use a 2' cube of furniture foam, and shoot at around 6-8 yards. First set the nocking point just a fuzz high (the least you can get and still be high) and then test for spine, nock left weak and nock right stiff for a right-handed shooter. Get them shooting straight in by changing spine or length as necessary, and your field points and broadheads of the same weight will shoot to the same point when they're fletched. You need to take multiple shots and look for the average, since bare-shafting is so sensitive to slight variations in form, and the individual shafts might vary some. A spine tester is a must.

I've been doing it this way successfully for about 15 years.

ozy clint, I think you will need stiffer shafts, more like 100# for the heavy points. A 69# recurve puts out a lot of energy! For instance, my 60# Quillian recurve with FF string, lightweight string silencers and no quiver mounted, bare-shafts with 90-95# shafts with 125g. points.

[ozy clint]

i've shot the 100-110# shafts with 300gr up front and they shot stiff. might double check though.

[Art B]

What length are you making your arrows? Yes, stiff arrows will impact to the arrow pass side. But with some overly weak spined arrows you will get a "false" stiff reading as well. ART

[ozy clint]

they are 31 1/2" BOP to start with.

[Molson]

80/85's with 150 up front at 29 or so inches should be fine out of that bow.  300 is way too much weight up front on a wood shaft that's only 15 over the bow you described.

I don't bare shaft wood either.  Always used broadheads and field points to tune on fletched shafts. Taking a half inch out of your taper isn't going to make any differnce worth worrying about.

Why don't you just haft the heads temporarily while you tune them down.  It only takes a few minutes to cut the slot deeper, sand a slight taper, wrap with some synthetic sinew, then shoot the things into foam until they hit along with the field points.  Once they do, haft them on permanently and you're good.

[Art B]

Try cutting one of those 110# shafts as short as possible and haft that big ol' 300gr point on it and give it a shot. You can use a glue stick as hafting glue which makes the points easy to remove later if you want. Wrap with some artifical sinew for the time being and you're good to go.

Oh, and to keep your shaft as stiff as possible by keeping them parallel instead of tapering. ART