EFOC believer

[olddogrib]

I confess that I came to the same conclusion as Dr. Ashby by the "blind hog picks up an acorn" approach.  I shoot bow poundages in the high forties due to 3 shoulder arthroscopies and the simple fact that I'm not as young as I used to be. The obvious choices, 1916's and 2016's flew great with points in the 100-145 grain range, but I was less than impressed with their penetration. I killed deer, but pass throughs were not a given, even when no bone was encountered. Axis/Beman 500's with 175 grain heads were an improvement, but I still wasn't satisfied and wanted a heavier shaft.  I got some 400's, which everyone knows is way too stiff for my set-up.  I left them 30.5" long, with 100 grain inserts and 250 grain heads.  Total arrow weight is now 680 grains and I thought that must be the ticket, as I'm blowing through deer like hot butter!  Never considered nor checked the FOC until reading the article...24%! Yea, trajectory out past twenty yards isn't impressive, but I'm not shooting at anything outside that anyway! Thanks Doc, for proving that I'm smarter than I look!

[Dr. Ed Ashby]

Richard, reading that today did me more good than you'll every know. Independent confirmation! Here's wishing you multiple chances to confirm just how well the setup works! Good hunting, my friend.

Ed

[Guru]

I remember back in my LW days...Bob Morrison talking about putting a whole bunch of weight up front of his arrows and getting great penetration. I believe it was only because a friend of his had been trying it. That was probably about 7yrs. ago.....


I too am a firm believer, although I have no idea what my "FOC" is, I haven't shot an arrow at big game animal with less than 250grs. out front in about 4yrs now.

 The arrows I'm shooting now out of "Timex" have 300grs. up front.

[Terry Green]

Curt & Ed, check out the start date of this thread, 14 days after TradGang's birth        

Man how time flies...    

   Original TradGang EFOC question...

[Guru]

   

[Steve D]

Would alum shafts that are too stiff work as well with
the heavy end loaded B/H as well as carbon? I've dropped in bow
wt. and have a bunch of alum shafts too stiff for my set-up?

[longbowben]

   

[George D. Stout]

Steve D, of course it will.  EFOC is EFOC, and it matters not what the material is.  You just have to experiment with the frontal weight on those arrows.

[John Havard]

olddogrig, one other benefit of your new setup is the fact that you're now shooting more grains or arrow weight per pound of draw.  When you do that you capture more of the stored energy.  The bow and its draw weight doesn't change, but the dynamic efficiency (the percentage of the energy stored by the bow that actually goes into the arrow) always goes up when grains per pound goes up.  Congratulations!

[Dr. Ed Ashby]

Awsome Terry. Absolutely awsome!

Ed

[Ham]

Terry, that thread was great!  I wasn't around here then, but even later threads were more amusing than useful for me.  I was "fat and happy" with my set up.  With my 60 to 65# @31" recures, all my wood arrows were over 600 gr.  What else do you need for deer?  Shoulder problems have brought me down to 47# and an unwillingness to foot shafts to get that extra inch have pushed me to carbons.  Ive been really studying "The Study" to make sure I get the most out of my equipment since last winter.  As an aside,while reading Doc's article in the current Trad Bowhunter last night, I was concerned that without all the information, many just wouldn't get it.  I almost laughed out loud reading Dr. Thomas's follow up piece.  I could see my "fat and happy self" coming through.  Don Thomas has shot a whole lot more animals than I ever hope to, but I can't believe that at least a few of those shots would have provided a better out come with a bit more penetration.  Futhermore, reading the whole study gave me a flash back to a pass through hit with my heavy equipment that resulted in a lost buck.  My best recolection was a 10 yard slightly quartering away shot from 12 - 14' up.  At the time, I wondered at the bright red blood the full length of my arrow with no bubbles.  The ash shaft didn't break, but it had a severe bend about a forth behind the head.  I'm now guessing that I found the critical skip angle for my Snuffer tipped arrow.  Lets remember that there is much more than FOC in "The Study"!

[Dr. Ed Ashby]

Ham, you are one first folks who seems to truly 'get it'. The Study is not about one thing. It's not about 'you should use this or that'. It's about what factors affect arrow terminal performance, why and how they affect it, how much they affect it, how they relate to the other factors, and all the myriad of different things we can potentially do to improve our arrow setup.

Basically, the Study is all about how to make the most of the arrow setup you choose to use. It's a box of goodies that can be used to improve your odds and reduce your wound/loss rate. Way too many seem to get so locked into one tiny aspect of the Study, failing to see the forest for the tree.

Thanks for your post,

Ed