Bloody Carbons

[vermonster13]

To reduce weight and stiffen the arrow also it would allow Luke to use a wider range of broadheads and add weight that way.

[cajunbowhntr]

Luke, if the arrows are too stiff they can hit the riser and show a false weak condition.What is your set up bow,poundage,draw arrow length etc.400 spine carbons are stiff for a bow around 50 pounds.They would need to be left long AND have a ton of weight on the front.IMHO just because you can get good arrow flight with feathers does not mean your bow is tuned.


CB

[Pullonmylimb]

Vermonster os right about the weight.  You just let the arrow tell you what the total point weihgt needs to be, that is insert/head weight.  Depending on where you need to be the lighter alum insert plus stacked weights on the rear may allow for greater flex in broadhead selection.  Just select the broadhead of your choosing and make up the rest with insert/weight options to keep the total point weight the same as when you tuned.

Cajun has a good point about the false weak condition.  It's kind of the same thing that can happen if your nock set is way too low but your getting a nock high pattern because the shaft is bouncing off the shelf.  Only if the arrow is too stiff it will be bouncing off the riser.

[Ray Johnson]

As has been mentioned,you could be getting a false weak indication fdrom an overly stiif shaft.I would be willing to bet that the 500's would work great.If you changed point weight and didn't see a change in arrow flight then you have gone the wrong way.Your arrows are way too stiff.

[Stickbender1]

Luke many never mentioned how many pounds you were shooting?  Also I have yet to see a carbon shaft that couldn't be tuned to fly perfect as a bare shaft, I've been doing it for years and have probably tuned close to a hundred different archers set ups to shoot carbons, You just need the proper set up and a decent release. give me some details on your draw length and weight and I will see what I might suggest.

[Luke Vander Vennen]

I'm shooting 46@28, but draw (when I shoot properly, which is rarer than it should be) about 31. I tend to be a little inconsistent for some reason. I'm working on it, but it doesn't seem to be getting much better.

Ok I'm back from another round at the bale. I built out my arrow plate with a matchstick, put on a couple 100 grain points and shot a couple rounds. At first the fletched arrows were flying pretty good, bareshafts still showing a little weak. Then after a couple arrows I guess my muscles warmed up a little and I started drawing a bit more. This brought me back to where I was before I built up the arrow plate: ok fletched flight, weak bareshaft. I guess one of the things that's making this difficult is that I haven't been shooting in a couple months, so my draw length is kinda inconsistent. When I draw what I should be drawing though, there is a slight tail wag in the fletched arrows, and the bareshafts are sailing to the right with the nock traling behind. Flight with the fletched arrows isn't bad, but it isn't the sight of the spinning nock I was hoping for.

It looks like I'm left with the option of either cutting my arrows down no more than an inch, or ordering some aluminum inserts and trying to take out the brass without destroying my shafts. Cutting them down will be annyoing becase they all have wraps and half of them are already fletched. I'm not much a fan of either, as they both have their drawbacks.

CB I don't think my arrows are stiff. After shooting the 100s I went back to the 175s just to double check I was going the right direction and things got worse.

[Luke Vander Vennen]

Forgot to ask: Does anyone have a trick to removing weight tubes from inside the shaft? I tried but didn't have much luck.

[bm22]

1/2 inch of over or under draw will go A LONG way in messing up your groups especially with carbon arrows, you MUST be consistantly drawing the same amount EVERY time to get an accurate measurement of the spine of the arrows, i would get it as close as you can and don't worry about it, until you get proper form and them retune. a carbon shooting alittle  to the right will out penetrate a wood arrow.

some bows are more critical than others, and if you don't shoot the exact same way you cann't expect your arrows to react the same way.
i would tune as best you can then put 3 or 4 fletch 5 in. feathers and go kill something.

from my understanding most people just started bareshaft tuning arrows within the last 10-15 years and people have been killing animals for hundred and thousands of years with bows.
do the best you can but don't lose sleep over it.

[cajunbowhntr]

Luke I  did'nt know you had gorilla arms LOL.I think this is the best tuning info out there,
 http://www.acsbows.com/bowtuning.html

taking inserts out of carbons can be difficult,but if you can heat up a fp and grab it with pliers and pull while heating they will come out.A long piece of allthread or a screw the same size as the insert thread works well too.The idea being you heat the point as little as necessary to loosen and pull out the point without heating up the carbon too much.


good Luck

CB