Bow Hunting Evolution

[GreyGoose]

Wow!  Another thought provoking spread.  Biggest difference in my lifetime (and locality) is the shift of focus to hunting deer, owing to their population recovery. The majority of the hunters I grew up around hunted squirrels and rabbits for food, and the whitetail season was short (6 days for firearms) with a limit of one.

[monkeyball]

And I would bet a crisp $100.00 bill that the guys taking those long shots have an expandable blade broadhead screwed on the end of there arrow or bolt.  Makes a huge difference in the margin of error.


                                  Good Shooting,
                                                       Craig

[Liquid Courage]

The latest and greatest broadheads crack me up with there descriptions as well. They advertise as though they have complete changed the way to kill an animal. If only they knew people still make there own arrows and broadheads and have complete pass throughs on deer.
On another note:
Cabela's opened up down the road from my house. The number of people marching into the woods with crossbows and range finding scopes in my area may have just doubled. Could not believe the number of people buying them.
Georgia DNR is going to cut down the number of deer harvested for the 2015-2016 season, I say they go back to making crossbows legal only for people who are handicapped. It might help some.

[mgf]

Different people like different stuff.

I use a stick bow (and prefer to shoot one I made) just because that's what I like. I don't do it to give the deer a better chance.

I want my shooting and hunting skills to be good enough that the deer has no chance at all (I'm not exactly there yet). I'd sure like to fill my tag before it gets cold...Deer hunting in the cold is an exercise in pain tolerance for me and there's nothing fun about pain.

Some equipment and methods require a greater investment in time and effort to develop the skill. Often, those that have the money just don't have or aren't willing to invest the time and effort.

[mgf]

"Wow! Another thought provoking spread. Biggest difference in my lifetime (and locality) is the shift of focus to hunting deer, owing to their population recovery. The majority of the hunters I grew up around hunted squirrels and rabbits for food, and the whitetail season was short (6 days for firearms) with a limit of one."

Me too but, for the hunters I knew, the weapon of choice was a shotgun. I didn't even know any bow hunters back in those days.

[Ron Vought]

Good stuff guys. Really proud of this site. There is no where else that we can we have these conversations without someone posting a personal attack. I really enjoy reading the different thoughts and comments. We have true professionalism here....

My concern is more about how these weapons and technology could negatively impact the archery seasons across the US. The long shots and mechanical heads are really just part of it. Maybe this is not an issue because as one member noted we are losing hunters so maybe no impact to the deer management plans. The underlying issue is when does it stop? As I said before does it stop after the crossgun shoots a bolt with a 209 primer? When do we as bowhunters start talking to our Game Divisions about equipment restrictions. What is the identity of archery and bowhunting? Something more to chew on...

Ron

[reddogge]

One only has to look at muzzle loader hunting in the US to see the slippery slope that sport took in 30 years. If you don't have an inline with scope and saboted bullets that will reach out to 200 yards you aren't in the game anymore.

Same thing is happening to archery hunting.

[kbetts]

No matter what, at least my bow bow is prettier to look at than a hunk of metal.

[eflanders]

Interesting thread and thanks to the OP for bringing it up!  I have 3 sons that have been brought up hunting and fishing.  All three were taught at a very early age not to shoot at anything (except targets) that they were not going to eat later.  They are all over the age of 17 now.  Several years ago I gave them each a custom recurve.  2 out of three also have compounds that they hunt with.  My oldest called me yesterday to talk about crossbows.  He says that with his work schedule, he doesn't have time to practice enough for trad archery or even in shooting a compound.  Says he went to one of the big sporting goods retailers and shot a crossbow and he was impressed with the scope in that he could shoot multiple yardages with it and that the guy told him that he didn't really need any practice to shoot it.  (This particular son has never shot archery yet even though I gave him a bow years ago.)  My son assumed it was like shooting a scoped gun.  Unfortunately my son believed this line of crap.  I explained to him that one needs to practice no matter what weapon he chooses to hunt with, gun, bow or whatever.  I explained to him that a crossbow gets sighted-in just like any other weapon with some sort of sight on it.  I asked him how heavy the crossbow was and how did he expect to stalk quietly and / or carry that big thing up and down a tree stand.  

I do not and will not tell my boys what weapon to use for hunting.  I want them to enjoy the outdoors and if they choose to carry a gun, a bow or even a crossbow, they are at least contributing to and enjoying the outdoors and each others company.

WI just changed the archery rules to include crossbows and personally I doubt it will have a major impact on the deer kill.  It has already increased the number of hunters buying licenses for deer.  I do believe that with the baloney being spread by some of the shows and retailers of the crossbows that there are going to be more crippled deer as inexperienced hunters will try and take shots at deer that an experienced hunter just wouldn't do.  They too will ultimately get educated the same as we all did or they will get out of it all together.  We all know from experience that there are no real short-cuts to effective hunting.  The harvesting of game can be made easier (via baiting, game-farms, etc.) but true hunting can not. Personally I enjoy hunting, not the harvesting of game.

[Wallydog]

The "outdoor" shows are mostly one long commercial hidden within a show. Selling products is the goal just like in Fred Bears days of the recurve bow. Fred sold a pile of bows by showing us the possibilities and his methods. The thing that I find disturbing is the actual arrow lethality these shows promote. These are all super light arrows with self expanding broadheads that have been proven to be the least desireable once flesh or especially bone is encountered after the hit. The assumption is that these are more lethal because they are faster arrows. The expanding broadheads are a must because trad broadheads wont fly right at those arrow speeds.
 If Dr.Ashby is right (and I suspect he is) then the very arrows and broadheads these speed rigs demand are woefully lacking in after the hit performance. The violence of the initial hit and deployment of the expanding blade broadhead renders them nearly useless for continued penetration.  
  IMO the long shot compound trend is wrong-headed and will result in more wounding by the average bowhunter. Arrow performance after the hit has not kept up with bow speeds.

[LongStick64]

This is a technology based world, that the majority people flock to. We have more accidents I would bet from texting while driving than drunk driving. So technology has crept into everything these days, its unavoidable because this is what is keeping companies in business. As far as affecting trad archery, as long as we retain our ethics and values, we'll do just fine.

[mgf]

It seems that a lot of people don't want to "practice".

I grew up gun hunting mostly birds and small game. I knew MANY gun hunters that couldn't shoot worth a darn. Most of those rarely fired a shot unless it was at game.

When I started deer hunting with a rifle, many of those I knew and/or hunted with, took their rifle to the range just before the season and just shot enough that they felt it was "sighted in.

Me?, I like to shoot. It's a good thin too because I shoot a lot better with practice. LOL

[Bjorn]

Where I hunt-California, oregon and Utah, we get lotsa guys with compounds. The guys I have hunted with and talk to seem to limit their shots to 40 yds-probably the equivalent of me shooting at 15 yds with my trad bow. Crossbows are not an issue where I hunt-only ever encountered 1 hunter with a crossbow-he had downed a bull elk at 55-60 yds.
A good hunter is a good hunter regardless of weapon choice. Unfortunately there are some that do not fit that category. What I am personally more interested in is are you recovering the game you shot? I do find that trad guys and gals spend considerably more time tracking their animals and recovering them successfully than our hi-tech brethren.

[Don Stokes]

My buddy who owns the cabin I hunt from in MO shoots a crossbow, because he can't shoot a real bow due to shoulder injuries. Last year I helped him track three deer he hit, and he also hit one other. We were unable to recover any of them. He is a good hunter, and has killed many deer with a bow before his shoulders got too bad, but he bought into the extended range idea. The deer paid the price. Fortunately he missed the long shot he took at a trophy buck. Hopefully he learned his lesson. At least he uses real broadheads and keeps them sharp.

[JamesV]

If it weren't for the equipment manufacturers  that lobby the state game departments there might not even be an archery only season. There certainly aren't enough traditional hunters to get the job done. There are only so many days in a hunting season and everyone if fighting for more days. Or that is how it is in Mississippi.

[Bowwild]

For most wildlife agencies the number of "recreation days" provided for and used by bowhunters is important. This is especially true east of Colorado/WY,MT,NM, etc.

Bowhunting wasn't legalized or expanded to "manage" a big game herd. These seasons were created because of demand for recreational opportunity.

Some might think that an agency could increase its deer harvest (again in the east) by reducing bow season in favor of longer firearms seasons. In fact, in states like SC, AL, GA, and others the agencies have found diminishing returns with making firearms season too long. If a firearms season is too long the "urgency" to get out and hunt is less and some just "forget" or neglect to go.

Interestingly, the bowhunter has become more effective since the 1960's and earlier. In the 60's success rates were less than 5% in most states. These days (more deer biggest reason)success rates are 2-5 times higher.

The bowhunter (again in the east) is one of the most avid Doe-takers and can also hunt in urban/suburban areas. So, the bowhunter is more a manager today than 50+ years ago when our seasons were born.

Another thing we all need to remember, especially wildlife agencies, most bowhunters participate in firearms seasons as well. In fact, the number of bowhunt-only archers is less than 10%. Therefore we are often the most avid supporters and users of wildlife management programs. I had to remind my Commission of this every time a "bowhunter" made a jerk-like statement at a public meeting.

[3Feathers]

I,m happy with my 15 yards and under...............

[Steve in Canton]

Long is a relative term, I set up two tree stands today that were close to 30 yards from the trail the deer are using, I regularly practice out to 50 yards and have no problem shooting at an animal to 35 yards.  

I have been shooting the same recurve I bought in 1991 and know what my arrow setup can do.  I have probably shot over 100,000 arrows through this bow.  If more people in the traditional community took every opportunity to learn their bow I think more people could extend their range.  Traditional hunting does not have to be a close range hunting

[ChuckC]

But I LIKE close range hunting.  I haven't killed a deer over ten yards away in years. About half from the ground in a ghillie suit.
ChuckC

[Nightwing]

I agree the guys on tv are shooting longer ranges and yes you can say they need to be better hunters and get closer etc...but if you didnt know... the late Fred bear, Howard hill etc shot as long as them or longer and I wouldn't be the one telling them they arent very good hunters....


Not picking sides just thinking out loud.