HH bug got me ... Part One!

[ChrisM]

Why not get one with a dual shelf.

[MT Longbow]

Originally posted by sunset hill:
back when I started shooting longbows, no one put silencers on them, and everyone knew they were way quieter than recurves or compounds.  Everyone shot them and got used to the feel of the string hum and quietness of the low vibration.  Nowadays, someone will shoot a bow three times and start tinkering with silencers and all sorts of stuff.

I would be willing to bet, that if someone takes the silencers off their straight end longbow and tunes the bow to a lower braceheight around 6" or less, and goes out for one month and shoots at least 100 -200 arrows, they won't even miss the silencers, will be amazed at how quiet the bow is, and the string hum will be ignored....and probably won't put the silencers back on because they now know how good the bow can really shoot.

Nate is right on, I replaced my string on my Robin Hood HH bow and put on a new SBD, I have about 200 shots , and it is getting noticably less and less.


Im not turning back.  and Im taking them off my other HH bows as well.

do I notice any difference in performance...well no, I cant say that I have.  I just like it better without them.   Howard killed all kinds of stuff without them, so ....


Patrick

[swampthing]

Right on Nate,
 Still shooting 125g on cedar, 470g tops with my 26" draw.
  If my bow gets loud it is because I torqued the shot, and the arrow banked off the riser, or, my arrows were too stiff. 55# 26" net length, 125 field points any stiffer spine and they will need 145's up front.

[Nate Steen .]

Jesse...In our earlier talks you were concerned with  the performance of those wood string follows.  Now if I am not mistaken you can now see how powerful they are...they will put down the game for sure...

[MT Longbow]

Went to Bob Burtons Whispering arrow shop today shop today spent some time shooting woodies with him, it was snowing but hey, priorities!

Anyway ordered a dozen  of his great arrows after we settled in on length and spine after shooting a bunch.
Great guy and unreal collection of genuine Hill stuff!!! (I have one of his hardback books as well)

Then I went to Craigs Ekins shop..Spent some time with Craig and Ordered a 70 inch, straight grip , 70 Lb , String Follow Redman (4 lams of Yew only)with a rust grip wrap, and Paduke riser wood, with clear glass all the way around...she will be named "Yewlogy" (as in Eulogy)!

Great day, spent with my 13 yr old daughter who learned some neat stuff, got some "tradition"  and now knows which HH bow she wants! a 66" Redman!

[David Mitchell]

WOW!!! What a day you had.    I'm jealous.

[Overspined]

Nate,

I shoot 68" Hill style bows for the most part. I like the brace about what's recommended and no higher, but why go lower, say to that 6" mark or less? Does that small change make the bow react or feel different? I understand a little extra time on the string and longer power stroke. I have shot at 6" accidentally for a while, and really just raised it because that's the recommendation.  

Of note, my T/D hill needs a little higher brace of 6 1/2 for a quiet shot with the sleeve, and NM T/D bows needed a bit higher too or they had a little slap at the joint.

Thanks,
Matt

[Nate Steen .]

Matt..

I use the old method of starting real low with the arrows clanking against the bow and then raise the bh until the arrow flight straightens and leave it there.  I am usually ending up around 5 7/8 or so...lower with ff strings.  Sure the bow shoots fine with a bh around 6 1/2 but the string hum is a higher pitch which I don't like.   The feel of the bows at a lower bh is real good plus they seem to draw easier and are quieter so I don't need silencers even with ff strings.  

Each bow is different and each shooter is different...but try it lower for 100+ shots and see how you like it.

[3Feathers]

Nate is that true with B-50 strings also?

[Nate Steen .]

Yeah...try for yourself.  I shoot b50 mostly.

[3Feathers]

Won,t a low brace like that give you string-slap?

[Lambow]

Well said in regards to BH and silencers, Nate.

I've never understood why so many longbow shooters want to use such a high brace height, especially with Hill style bows.
More noise with less speed and just doesn't feel right to me.
Higher BH's will allow for a stiffer arrow, and will be more in line with center... and a little easier to tune an arrow to the bow.(more spine tolerance)

John Schulz once told me that even a 70" longbow shouldn't be braced over 6"

String slap will be more prevalent with a lower BH, but that is easily remedied in how you hold the bow. I expect a little bite anyway... that's the nature of this style of bow and is why I wear an arm guard. If I didn't have one on, the string hits my wrist.

[Overspined]

I tuned some arrows with it today, ended up 68" Redman at 5 7/8" brace and no problems with anything. Sounds good, shoots good, no silencers and I won't need any. I see what you mean by a lower pitch humm after the shot, but there's almost no noise at all.  I think the string is a 450+ 6 strand. I don't typically use an arm guard.  

Nate, any experience with T/D sleeves?  I haven't lowered it on that bow yet, but it seemed to come up with a noise until I went to 6 7/8". I am going to make another string, but it was a bow noise, not the arrow. I'll have to try it again. I don't think I can harm the sleeve by taking it down in brace...

[canopyboy]

Originally posted by MT Longbow:
Went to Bob Burtons Whispering arrow shop today shop today spent some time shooting woodies with him, it was snowing but hey, priorities!

Anyway ordered a dozen  of his great arrows after we settled in on length and spine after shooting a bunch.
Great guy and unreal collection of genuine Hill stuff!!! (I have one of his hardback books as well)

Then I went to Craigs Ekins shop..Spent some time with Craig and Ordered a 70 inch, straight grip , 70 Lb , String Follow Redman (4 lams of Yew only)with a rust grip wrap, and Paduke riser wood, with clear glass all the way around...she will be named "Yewlogy" (as in Eulogy)!

Great day, spent with my 13 yr old daughter who learned some neat stuff, got some "tradition"  and now knows which HH bow she wants! a 66" Redman!

MT -- Congrats!  I did that in reverse last year when I first got the bug.  Picked up a bow blank from Craig and then headed to Bob's.  Craig and Jason were quite busy and I didn't feel like imposing much so that visit was kind of short.  But Bob had so much stuff to look at and all the time in the world to talk about it.  Being an engineer I was seriously impressed with the stuff he's come up with to make his arrows darned near perfect.  The setup for making a parabolic taper is just too cool.  And all his Hill stuff, Africa stuff, and random stuff is a kick.  I was there for several hours before I pried myself away. I'm looking forward to going back some day soon!

[30coupe]

Okay, Nate. I took the cat whiskers off last night and gave it a try. Here are my thoughts so far after maybe 50 shot before it got too dark.

Performance = can't tell any difference here.

Noise = different.

At the shot with cat whiskers, I could hear a bit of a noise that is hard to describe. Kind of like plucking a rubber band held pretty loosely. There was no hum of the string after the arrow left. Pretty quiet.

Without the whiskers. There is almost no sound at the shot other than maybe the sound of the string coming off of my tab or glove. After the arrow leaves the string, things get interesting. Sometimes there is a string hum, sometimes there isn't. Sometimes there is just a slight hum, other times it is more pronounced. I think the differences happen for a couple of reasons. When there is no hum, I think the string is hitting the arm guard just enough to stop the vibration, though not enough to make a slapping sound. When it doesn't hit the arm guard, I get some hum. When I torque the string, the hum gets louder. This just might help me learn to quit torquing the darn string.

It's still to early to tell which way is better. It's been raining all day, so I haven't been doing any shooting.

Brace height...for me, the main reason to keep the brace height low is to eliminate hand shock. Above 6 1/4" brace height, I do feel some shock with my Shelton. I have it braced at between 5 5/8" and 5 7/8" and feel no shock to speak of. As I think about it now, there may have been a bit less shock after I removed the cat whiskers. I have to think about it to feel the hand shock anyway, but I'll have to concentrate more next time I shoot to see if the lack of whiskers reduced it even more. It sort of makes sense that less weight on the string would mean more energy transferred to the arrow.

The experiment goes on! Gotta love it!

[tradlongbow]

Originally posted by MT Longbow:
Went to Bob Burtons Whispering arrow shop today shop today spent some time shooting woodies with him, it was snowing but hey, priorities!

Anyway ordered a dozen  of his great arrows after we settled in on length and spine after shooting a bunch.
Great guy and unreal collection of genuine Hill stuff!!! (I have one of his hardback books as well)

Then I went to Craigs Ekins shop..Spent some time with Craig and Ordered a 70 inch, straight grip , 70 Lb , String Follow Redman (4 lams of Yew only)with a rust grip wrap, and Paduke riser wood, with clear glass all the way around...she will be named "Yewlogy" (as in Eulogy)!

Great day, spent with my 13 yr old daughter who learned some neat stuff, got some "tradition"  and now knows which HH bow she wants! a 66" Redman!

Pat-

That sounds like trip that I would like to take. An it's awesome that you spent the day doing it with your daughter too. A couple of months ago Bob Burton told me that he wanted to join us next year at the Hill Hog Hunt 2013, it's going to be good.

Darren

[ChrisM]

I use a Jo Jan Fletching jig and with my  5" feathers all the way back I can only run my BH at 6" or my feathers will be into the shelf.  So how are yall running so low.  A different jig or shorter feathers.

[swampthing]

Just let it jam in there! I would rather they not hit my draw fingers! Don't matter one bit out my way, even with 5.5" feathers and a 5.5" B-Height. I just use 5" as the big boys are a bit over kill for my set up.

[Nate Steen .]

Per Schulz's book....quoting Hill.."if the string doesn't bite your arm, it's braced too high....."   also Schulz said "it's usually the shooter that needs tuning not the bow."  Good words about keeping things simple in this age of overthinking everything.

My braceheight is low, I use an armguard that the string hits,  no silencers, 5 3/8" feathers touch the shelf when the arrow is nocked, moderate weight arrows cut so that the blunt is pulled onto the shelf, and this simplistic setup shoots arrows much better than I can ever realize it's full potential...so I  keep shooting to tune me.  

Keep it simple guys..believe me it works.  Simplicity is perfection.

[Nate Steen .]

Takedowns might be different because of moving  parts