are "speed bows" more critical?

[DanielB89]

I am curious if other find that "speed bows" are more critical than others?  


Just wondering other peoples opinion.  We do not have to throw out names here..

[ThePushArchery]

Daniel, can you elaborate on "more critical"?

As in the bow is more critical of the shooters form flaws, or that speed bows in general are more critical to shoot than slower bows?

I'll take a stab for the latter. I think it's more dependent on the game we are playing. For competing, I want the fastest set up possible. For hunting, quiet kills. So I want the quietest set up I can shoot accurately. Extremely heavy arrows and oversized string silencers are my personal recipe for a sniper set up. And those definitely don't lend themselves to be a fast rig.

I shoot bottom barrel ILF limbs on my hunting bows. I want something that can take a beating and be silent at the shot. That's my hunting criteria.

[Orion]

Critical of what?  More difficult to shoot? Less forgiving?

I find my faster bows rip the string out of my hand more quickly so the arrow clears the bow faster and is less affected by any movements I might impart to the bow.

On the other hand, if I pluck or torque the string or bow, the increased string/limb speed might heighten the negative effects for the same reason.  Not really sure.

In short, I don't find them any different than my less speedy bows.  If I do my part, they do theirs, regardless of how fast they are.

[DanielB89]

Originally posted by cpnhgnlngct:
Daniel, can you elaborate on "more critical"?

As in the bow is more critical of the shooters form flaws, or that speed bows in general are more critical to shoot than slower bows?

I'll take a stab for the latter. I think it's more dependent on the game we are playing. For competing, I want the fastest set up possible. For hunting, quiet kills. So I want the quietest set up I can shoot accurately. Extremely heavy arrows and oversized string silencers are my personal recipe for a sniper set up. And those definitely don't lend themselves to be a fast rig.

I shoot bottom barrel ILF limbs on my hunting bows. I want something that can take a beating and be silent at the shot. That's my hunting criteria.

sorry for not clarifying.  

It was the latter.  I have just found that some of the bows I shoot best are not top tier performers.  

there is nothing scientific about this.. just wondering if anyone else had an opinion on it..

[LBR]

Tons of variables to consider.  

One thing I have noticed, consistently, is concerning strings.  I've never met or known of an archer who's made a name for themselves shooting accurately who tries to pick up a couple of fps by using (what I consider to be) a very underbuilt string.  Most use (what I consider to be) a slightly over built string;  I.E. Brady Ellison using 16 strands of 8125 (I liked 14 strands when I used it).  Lighter strings are not as consistent.  How much that affects the individual will, again, depend on a ton of variables.

What is "critical" will often come down to the individual archer.  A good example would be look up a thread asking if Hill bows have hand shock and see how much the answers vary.

Like a lot of things in this sport, there's no one correct answer.

[LBR]

I have just found that some of the bows I shoot best are not top tier performers.
 

FWIW, I've shot some of my best scores with selfbows that were noticeably slower than my laminated bows.  I've also won a couple of long-shot novelties and killed my biggest stingray to date with the cheapest (new) bow I ever paid for (Samick Journey).  I shoot it as well as anything, but it's no slouch when it comes to performance.

[Tedd]

I was all in to the Black Widow thing for a while. Generally they have a forgiving design with a high brace height. Lots of people are really accurate with them. The are very well made. I was just never was completely accurate or confident  and my shooting was starting to showing that. I swapped out my best Widow for a new Predator. The predator is built for more speed but I find it much more accurate and consistent. That makes it more fun to shoot.
The grip and low shelf on the predator is better for me.
So in that case the faster bow is more accurate.

[BWallace10327]

Daniel, I will not dance around an answer.  Speed bows seems to be harder to shoot than some less efficient designs.  If you have perfect form I don't imagine there is a difference, but I can only speak for myself and I have many bad habits.  Speed bows are harder to shoot with less than imperfect form.

[ISP 5353]

I am shooting Palmer recurves.  They are known as pretty quick bows and I have never noticed that they are any harder to shoot than any other tuned rig.

[PastorSteveHill]

Rick Welch says that Speed bows are like Race Cars... When all is well they are great, but one little thing off and they are more critical..   I agree...

[Steelhead]

Does slowing a speed bow down with a heavy arrow make them more accurate?

At what speed does a bow become what is considered a speed bow?

What is it about a speed bow that makes it less accurate or stable?

Are all speed bows in a category as finicky and squirrely to shoot.

Is a flat shooting bow less accurate on longer shots.

I think thier are very accurate shooting bows that are slow,moderate,fast and at the very high end of speed.

The archer and how the overall attributes of a bow suits them.Is probably the most determining factor overall in accuracy.Thiers quite a few things that go into a bow fitting an archer near perfectly.

I don't think the bow being too fast would be high on the list of variables in setting up an archer for having a bow that they could shoot accuratly

I have had slower and fast and very fast bows that shot excellent and consistant groups.Vice versa I have had bows of all speeds not shoot so great for me.

I think the trajectory of a fast bow that you shoot well will help you as the yardage gets longer

[Cyclic-Rivers]

I notice with speed bows, I just miss quicker            :p    

[Tim]

I've found one of the easiest ways to settle in on a particular bow is to bare shaft it.  My current bow is a Toelke Lynx.  It's a great shooting bow, not overly fast but incredibly quiet and forgiving to a not so perfect release.   The beauty of the bow is how easy it was to tune.  I can shoot 10 bare shafts and get the same result each time.  A few other bows I've had the same results with are Leon Stewart's bows and Thunderhorns.  Each of these bows are solid performers but provided great consistency in tuning which carries over to shootability.  

A friend told be years ago there is no free lunch.  High performance bows give up something, either noise or sensitivity.  I've owned several bows that have just pushed the limit with design enough to make them critical on release.  If everything about your setup and your release comes off perfect, you're good to go.  If not, they will tend to bite you.  In 3d shooting most of the time our setups are consistent with regard to stance and bow alignment, making the shot process very easy.  Hunting scenarios that require awkward shooting positions at times along with additional clothing is where a stable bow shines.

[Sam McMichael]

DanielB89, you said that some of the bows you shoot best are not the top tier performers. From a hunting perspective, the fact that they are the most accurate makes them the top tier performers. It is the accuracy, not the speed, that sets the performers apart. A fast bow that you shoot accurately is the ideal, but the more accurate one is the better bow. With that being said, there are many "best top tier" bows out there. What performs best for one archer may not be the best for another.

[D. Key]

Daniel:

Let me take this in a little different direction.  Arrow speed is a relative term; you shoot your arrow at the intended target and it reaches the point of impact at some time factor later.  Let's look at the time it takes an arrow to travel 18 Yds. (54 Feet).  At 200 FPS the arrow reaches the intended target in .27 seconds while an arrow traveling at 170 FPS reaches the target in .31 seconds, which is only .04 seconds later.  Considering this, I do not feel the speed of a Trad. Bow makes a lot of difference.

If you are relating to forgiveness in a bow, then that is all together different.  I have owned a lot of bows from many of the top Bowyers and honestly, if you buy a quality bow (IMHO)I cannot tell a 10% difference between all of them in speed and/or forgiveness.  However, a shorter length bow is typically not as forgiving as a longer limbed bow, at least for me.  There are short bows out there which are very forgiving and I have owned several but in general, old school short bows were less forgiving.

With bow technology advancements within the last 10 years, I feel you should experiment with many bows until you find the right combination which suits you best.

Shoot straight.  Hope this helps.

[BenBow]

Bow FIT will have more to do with accuracy than speed. You get a consistent grip and a smooth draw your accuracy will improve. The jerk behind the string is the main source of inconsistency.
I like to build my own bows so I can get the bow to fit me well. I had a longbow that shot a 675gr arrow at 188fps 10gr per lb that stacked arrows but it fit me perfectly. Just had to give up shooting that much weight.    :(

[Bowwild]

First time I've heard the term associated with recurves.

At the same draw length, approximate same draw weight, and with same weight arrow I've choreographed at least 30 bows. Only one  shot less than 10 FPS differently than another.  For all intents and purposes they were all "same speed bows".

[Caleb Monroe]

I think some fast longbows seem twitchy because of the lack of mass weight. I shot my best 3D scores with the fastest bow I have ever owned. A Morrison 19" aluminum riser with Max 1 limbs. So I think that weight of the bow has more to do with it for me.

[Hankem]

There is a difference between shooting a high performance bow with hunting weight arrows at 10-12 grains per pound with FOC between 12-17% vs light weight arrows ay 7.5-9 grains per pound with 10-12% FOC.....
 
The difference is getting off the string clean & your form..... An ultra light arrow is effected more by a poor release.  But having  a faster arrow will have benefits of flatter trajectory. When shooting 3D, a flatter shooting bow is going to help your score.... When hunting, a flat shooting bow helps you too......

I like between 9-10 gpp arrows shooting in the 190's the best.

[Wheels2]

I have shot everything from cheap wood/glass limbs to Border hex 6.5H.
I prefer the faster speed as it gives me a flatter trajectory and better momentum gor the same poundage.
However I find that the high performance is more critical on brace and spines.  Same for noise and they are also designed for a specific draw length for a given limb length.  I learned that my 28" draw does not do justice to a set of longs.
You get more but you need to spend more time to achieve optimal set up.