Fast, Low poundage bow?

[Doug Treat]

I want to know who makes a low poundage bow (for bad shoulder) that shoots very efficiently with heavy arrows (for elk).  I'm trying to decide if I can find a bow that's more efficient than what I currently have.  I've already determined that I want a 650 gr. arrow (based on my own experience and Dr. Ashby's studies) and I want that arrow @ or above 160 fps shot @ 28".  By low poundage, I mean 45# or so @ 28". Now, I've heard that most bows lose 1 fps with every 5 gr. added to the arrows.  Starting @ 160 fps with a 650 gr. arrow (nearly 15 gpp) and going backwards to 9 gpp for a 45# bow (assuming 5 gr. per 1 fps), that would mean that I would need to find a bow that would shoot a 9gpp arrow (405 gr) @ 209 fps @ 28" draw length.  Is there such a bow or can I find a bow with a better speed to grain ratio (say more like 1:10...then it would just need to shoot about 185 @ 9 gpp)?  Sorry for such a long post.  Thanks.

[Straitshot]

I would consider bows that have carbon faced limbs instead of fiberglass with sufficient pre load, and the ones that come to mind are O.L. Adcock, Centar, Border, and probably a few others that I can't currently think of. Since I am not an expert on the subject you would probably do better asking an established bow maker. I do have a Border recurve and it casts a heavy arrow extreamly well as I have heard others testify about the other bows I mentioned.

Louis

[vermonster13]

Black Swan Hybrid fits the bill also.

[eagle24]

ACS-CX, Black Swan, Turkey Creek Double Carbon

[waterone]

Are you limited to a longbow or hybrid?

If so, by all accounts and shooting one Adcock, ACS and one Black Swan, they'll give you the needed "horsepower"

If you can expand your horizons, you might consider a recurve, one of the higher performance recurves, a Border already been mentioned, there are others.  You might look to something you may not have considered, a Warf bow (search here) or a Dalaa.

[indianalongbowshooter]

My Super Diablo 47@28 shoots a 567 gr. arrow at 174 fps at 29 1/2 in., verified on 2 chronographs, so should be close to speed youd be looking for. tips have been redone for FF, have 225.00 in bow and it will shoot with about any custom at that weight.. It draws 47 at 28 and about 50@29.

[Doug Treat]

OK, stick with me here. Really, the reason I'm asking is:  I have a 47# @ 28" hybrid longbow (G&L) right now that I chronographed @ 183 fps w/a 420 gr. arrow (9 gpp)pulling 28" (with cat whisker silencers). That seems to keep up with most of the high-end bows that I see in the TBM "traditional bow review" @ 9 gpp.  For example, this issue shows a Stinger longbow that shoots @ 185 fps with finger release (without silencrs).  I think the fastest is pushing 190.  OK, but how well does it shoot heavy arrows?  I then shot a 650 gr. arrow (13.8 gpp) with it and it shot @ 163 fps.  That amazed me because I had always heard the 1:5 ratio as a general rule.  Mine got 1:11.5 (fps/gr.) which (if you're wanting to add weight like I am) is more than twice as efficient as 1:5.  Does this make sense?  So anyway, if there's another bow out there that is significantly more efficient (like 1:20), I may have to buy it...I guess I'm trying to convince myself that I have the most efficient bow you can buy and should be content with it. LOL  I was also wondering if maybe the old "a longbow shoots a heavy arrow with more cast" has any merit.  Maybe there's something about the design that makes the speed to weight ratio better with a longbow.???  Has anyone else done any similar weight/speed tests with these bows mentioned above? What were your results?

[Pinecone]

Adcock ACS and Morrison both come to mind.  I recently chronoed one of my Morrison recurves (47# @ 27") at 182 fps with a 10 gpp arrow.  The Adcock (42# @ 27") chronoed at 167 fps with an arrow weighing just under 12 gpp.

Claudia

[Doug Treat]

Sorry for the longer post...

[DEAN]

ANY TURKEYCREEK

[DesertDude]

If I remember right, Someone had a Turkey Creek around 40# and it shot a 400 gr (10gpp) @191. I remember thinking, wow that's smokin for a 40# bow.  Do a search for Turkey Creek here in pow wow and that post should come up.....Mark

[Doug Treat]

OK, Pinecone.  Thanks for the numbers.  Looks like your Morrison is a good comparison to my 47# longbow. Let's say that your Morrison gets 1:10 ratio. According to your #s, it shoots a 470 gr. arrow @ 182 fps.  Using the 1:10 ratio, it should shoot a 650 gr. arrow @ 164 fps. 1 fps faster than mine. Granted, it looks like you draw an inch shorter than I, but 1 fps isn't much.  I'm also assuming a 1:10 ratio.  Maybe there's a bow out there that gets alot better than 1:10.  Anyone tested their bow with different weight arrows?

[Doug Treat]

Now if that Turkey Creek shoots 10 gpp @ 28 and it gets a 1:10 ratio when you add weight, it would shoot 650 gr. @ 166 fps.  That would be impressive for a 40# bow.

[HATCHCHASER]

I have a Turkey Creek 45@28.  I shot a 654 grain arrow 164 feet per second. Average of 6 shots, shooting a tab and I draw 30".  Doug said he gets about 7 more fps out of his double carbons. You probably would not get that speed with a 28" draw but it would be close.  Those bows are shooters too.

[Doug Treat]

OK, Hatch.  That's close to my weight, but if you're drawing to 30", it's probably about 51#.  @ 51# it's shooting a 654 gr. arrow at basically the same speed (164 to 163) as my 47# shoots the same weight arrow (654 to 650) and you have a longer power stroke.
WOW, this is really making me feel good about my bow.  Good therapy!!! I do still want to know other chronographed results though, esp. if you have shot different weight arrows from the same bow.

[wingnut]

Doug,

Energy is Energy.  It's about efficient use of the stored energy in the bow.  The ACS is the most efficent bow I have ever shot so it will be the fastest with a light and heavy arrow.

For your requirement of 650 gr @ 160 fps out of a 47 # you need to produce 37 ft pounds of KE.  This comes out to be 198.3 fps with a 9 gr / #.

This fall into your very high end bows.

Mike

[Pinecone]

Doug,

Since you are in Estes Park, you might want to think about calling Rocky Mt. Specialty Gear in Arvada and asking Tom if he has any FF low poundage Wapiti TD recurves in stock.  If he does, I'd recommend driving down there and testing one to see how they compare.
I make the suggestion because I just returned from a couple of days of meetings in Denver and stopped by the shop to shoot the bows.  I was very impressed with the speed on the FF Wapiti and actually bought the bow I was shooting.  I didn't chrono the bow, but I shot it with several of his test arrows and it really smoked!  FYI, the FF bow I bought is 44# at my 27" draw length.  I've been playing with this bow since arriving back home and even shooting a 600 grain arrow, the cast is amazing.

Claudia

[O.L. Adcock]

Mike's numbers are right on the money. The very best bows @28" will have an se/pdf of about .95...They'll be about 85% efficient....That's a 47# bow to get 37 ft/lbs into the arrow you are looking for.....O.L.

[Doug Treat]

Thanks, Pinecone.  I've never shot the Wapiti, but have heard good things about them.

[larry]

my double carbon centaur is 43lbs at my 27" draw.
I get 168fps with a 483 grain arrow, 11.2 grains per lbs.

larry