Done with POC!

[monterey]

It's been a long love affair, but today I'm building a dozen arrows for a family member and the shafts are as inconsistent as I've ever seen.  Not going to name the seller or the manufacturer.  I believe this is just the state of affairs as far as POC is concerned.

In a dozen 11/32 shafts the range of diameters was from .360 to .345.  one was so thick on one end I had to shave it to fit the 11/32 taper tool fitting.

Really, this is not even a rant on my part, but more a lament over the passing of an era.

[two4hooking]

Still can get some acme poc from some vendors. Old stock but pre finished.

[Dave Lay]

ive had the same issue with a vendor everyone here seems to love.. but way to much run out and just inconsistent for my liking

[monterey]

I dug out 11 old ACMEs last spring and made my hunt arrows from them.  If I can find more I'll go for that for sure.

Yeah, I don't blame the vendor.  I've been seeing a gradual decline for a long time now regardless of where they come from.  I turn out most of my arrows on a veritas but prefer perfect matches for hunting.  Going to try some Doug Fir next time around!

[Shadowhnter]

Ive had the same problems you had, with Douglas fir, numerous times.

[M60gunner]

I have some old Acme shafts that I am saving, maybe 3 doz. Been using Doug Fir from Surewood lately. Not happy to hear about quality of cedar going downhill like that. I seem to remember another smaller cedar shaft maker out there. Think name is Wapiti? Used to be Rouge River? Had good luck years ago with them.

[monterey]

Well dang! Can't see me shooting anything but wood from my ASLs.

I hear good things about shurewood DF.  Have you tried those?

[Sam McMichael]

What about some of the other woods such as spruce, lodge pole pine, etc.? Fortunately, the last several POC purchases I have made have been good.

[M60gunner]

I have used Sitka Spruce from Hilabrand in the past. Well made shafts if I recall. One set I made were backend tapered.  I ended up selling those to a friend. They were working great from his A&H LB.

[Grey Taylor]

Poor grain orientation (runout), poor machining, those are the fault of the manufacturer.
Poor grouping of spine and/or weight are the vendor who sells the shafts.
You need to read your vendor's literature. Some sound like they weight match the shafts but they actually don't. Some manufacturers and some vendors don't hand spine the shafts. If the shafts are not placed on the spine tester with thought to the grain orientation then you'll get variable results.
One of the BIG POC manufacturers (not named here) has a fancy machine for spining that they're very proud of. Problem is that the shafts are just dropped on it willy nilly with no particular grain orientation. Results: crappy spine measurements.  

While I choose to use other materials, you can still get good POC shafts from Wapiti.
Good Douglas fir shafts are available from Surewood and Hildebrand. Good Sitka spruce shafts may be had from Hildebrand.

The good stuff is still out there, you just have to know where to get it.

Guy

[Stumpkiller]

I have entirely switched over to Douglas fir for new shafts.  Still have a few dozen raw POC I will use up but I don't figure I will buy any more.

[monterey]

Can't fault the vendor.  They weighed each (accurately) to within 10 grains and spined within 2 lb.  Family member picked them up this eve and says they shoot great.  So, the inconsistency was with the diameter and roughness of finish.  Straightness was so so but I expect to have to straighten and they did straighten right up.

Not sure what to think about the manufacturer but they are probably doing as well as they can with what they got.

[Rough Run]

I just got a dozen spruce shafts from Hildebrand.  Haven't finished them yet, but - very straight, gorgeous grain with no blemishes/defects, and only 6 grains total weight variation.  Fantastic quality.

[frank bullitt]

Face it, old growth cedar is gone!

Unless we quit cutting, and wait for a couple hundred years!

[Roy from Pa]

Mike, try some cane arrows.

 

 

[Rob DiStefano]

we're at the point that getting GOOD wood for most anything in life now costs many times the going price of 50 years ago.  GOOD wood is near as expensive as gold.  

back in the day, i used to get a gross of 60-65# 11/32" POC and after examining each shaft would lose maybe 10%, while the rest were perfect for diameter and static spine.  these dayze, i might get 50% usable shafts out of a gross.

i used to build woodies a dozen at a time, these dayze i'd build no more than 6, then really test them out and i might have 3 that'll fly perfect for me.

these are not the good ol' woodie days, they're sadly long gone ... but i still build and shoot 'em, if only for nostalgia and nothing else.

[myshootinstinks]

I'll always have a few cedars around the shop but I too have pretty well given them up as the go to shaft.  For the most part I've transitioned to aluminum arrows.

[frank bullitt]

Agree with Roy on cane!

Shot 2 squirrels last week with cane.
One shot, took a hard hit on a sugar maple!

[JR Belk]

I have no issues with the cedar I get. I'm always waiting for that bad batch though. One doug fir manufacturer that everyone loves really let me down and I'll never use them again. Terrible quality in every way. I'm about to try some poplar in the near future.

[wapiti]

Japan pays a PREMIUM for POC. They use it for religious ornamental artifacts and such. The dead old growth is from the forest floor and as an arrow material a lot of lesser quality logs are used because of it being shipped out for high dollar purposes.Cedar trees that are cut are very restricted no matter what kind of cedar it is. The old days of abundance are long gone.