Woodie vs carbon penetration when hunting

[FlintNSteel]

Originally posted by Ulysseys:
All things being equal carbons will penetrate better but not to the point that I'd be concerned with, plus when it comes to hunting when are all things ever equal?  Shoot the woodies and don't lose sleep.

I think Ulysseys covered it best.

I have shot quite a few northern-sized whitetails with both 11/32 and 23/64 wood arrows out of upper 50 to lower 60# bows.  Many pass thrus or arrow pretty much hanging out the other side.

[FlintNSteel]

Originally posted by Wheels2:
Carbons do straighten out quicker (recover form paradox) than woods but both are straight by the time they reach the deer.
 

Straightening out more quickly, as relevant to the OP's question, has nothing to do with how straight they are entering an animal.  An arrow that straightens quickly from the bow spends less energy trying to straighten itself out...so it's a statement of retained energy capability.  All other things equal, an arrow that straightens more quickly should retain more energy to be spent on penetration.

[Learner]

Originally posted by Mint:
Carbons will out penetrate wood for the simple fact that the arrow retains more energy with carbons.

If you look at the high speed camera footage of the shot the carbon will recover much quicker from paradox with much less oscillation than wood and then when the arrow hits the target the carbon will have much less vibration/oscillation than the wood thereby putting more energy into penetrating.

Thank you all for sharing your wisdom and experiences with regards to my question.  Very helpful!

I do find the point made by Mint here to be quite interesting.  Behind my Block Vault I have a sheet of 1/2" plywood.  (I aim close to the edge of my target of my target at times to make use of the entire target face, so the plywood saves my basement.)

When I have a wild shot, most times it will pierce the plywood if I am shooting my carbons.  But my 11/32 woodies (at about 510 gr), have always bounced off (except for one shot which may have hit a pre-existing hole).

So Mint's comment here makes sense in light of my experience: that upon impact the carbon arrow will vibrate much less, providing more energy to be retained for penetration, even though the woodies are much heavier.

I have some GT "Fact" internal weights on order. Once I bring one of my carbons up to 500 gr, I'll do some penetration tests, both with my target and with plywood.

All that being said, it's good to hear that a game animal provides enough natural "lubrication" to allow easy pass through with even tyick woodies.

[Shadowhnter]

Like some of the others, I believe that on average, carbon penetrates better. However,  Ive yet to NOT find my broadhead out the backside of a deer with 11/32 woods. In the end, once a hole is punched on the opposite side, what difference does it really make? You might save some arrows on pass through hits, but ive always been very ready to trade an arrow for the animal anyway.

[Mike Vines]

Shoot a tuned arrow with a razor sharp cut on contact head, and put it in the boiler room of your intended target.  You will have a dead deer at the end of the blood trail.  

I have 2 holes in whatever I have shot over the years, be it by wood, carbon or aluminum.

[longbow fanatic 1]

Tuning is they key. Put a well tuned woodie, carbon or amuminum arrow in the right spot and you will have no worries.

[Fletcher]

Originally posted by Bisch:
Well tuned is the key! That, and scary sharp broadheads and the ability to put the arrow in the correct spot.

Bisch

I'm going to second what Bisch and LF have stated: tuning trumps everything else for arrow performance.  A straight flying arrow will out penetrate even a slightly off flying arrow every time.  I suspect that carbons do have some advantage as they are stiffer and seem to recover quicker in hi speed video, but as a wood shooter, I have zero actual experience with carbons.  Shaft diameter does make a difference with targets that stop the arrow with friction, but I see no difference with 5/16, 11/32 and 23/64 with broadheads on game.

[K.S.TRAPPER]

Some of you really make this game/sport a lot harder then it really is. Wood arrows with properly sharpened broadheads will get the job done eveytime as long as you do your part.

Tracy

[WESTBROOK]

Originally posted by K.S.TRAPPER:
Some of you really make this game/sport a lot harder then it really is. Wood arrows with properly sharpened broadheads will get the job done eveytime as long as you do your part.

Tracy

Amen!

[RC]

I agree both work and get the job but in my experience as well as some killers I know...On a challenging critter like a big boar the wood will not penetrate like the carbon. On your normal size critters probably no problem. RC

[Broken Arrows]

All of the above is great information. The reason I use carbon arrows is I have the hardest time tuning a wood arrow getting every thing straight and spinning true. Ones you get the formula for a carbon arrow it is much easer to repeat. Like said above put the arrow where it needs to go with a sharp broadhead and you are good to go.

[forestdweller]

Originally posted by K.S.TRAPPER:
Some of you really make this game/sport a lot harder then it really is. Wood arrows with properly sharpened broadheads will get the job done eveytime as long as you do your part.

Tracy

I agree. If wooden arrows can penetrate steel armor (from selfbows none the less) they sure as heck can penetrate through any animal on this earth.

Carbon might perform slightly better but at the cost of an arrow potentially breaking off in your game and ruining a portion of the meat. Or carbon blowing up in your hand due to a damaged arrow.

A lot of us also shoot traditional/primitive to get away from the high tech world. Carbon arrows and compounds go hand in hand and is another reason why I don't like them.

Honestly, I even think that arrow tune is slightly over rated (still important though). If you put 4" up to 6" feathers on your arrows they will fly pretty damn straight out of anything regardless of their tune or at least this has been my experience.

[RC]

How many people replying on this thread have shot a heavy animal with both arrows? I don`t mean a deer,they are made purty lite. You can claim carbons are not "trad" I can see that line of thinking but don`t doubt the ability to penetrate they have.A deers chest is not wide at all. 8" penetration will get it done. On a big hog that will get you one lung.
   From shooting big hogs with low poundage bows MYSELF I can tell you from experience the wood will not penetrate like a carbon. My bows are tuned and I shoot 5.5 feathers. I also shoot 550 grain plus arrows at big pigs.
   I hear about peoples experience with broadheads , arrows and poundage and they will talk about "a" animal they took that it worked out on. worked great. I can tell you I have killed and been in the trailing of other hunters maybe 500 animals taken with a stickbow. A big pig is a whole nuther animal. When you go up in poundage its different but 55 and less ,arrow weight and material matters on big stuff.
   I have killed well over a 100 deer and pigs probably more since switching to carbon and never had any meat ruined. Shooting 35/55 and 15/35 carbons they will bend a whole lot before breaking.
  Yesterday at Fort stewart I shot a 175 lb boar with a 52@27 Dave Johnson Hill style bow with a 590 grain arrow. Shooting a grizzly broadhead and got a complete pass through. The last few weeks a friend of mine shot 3 different big boars with a well tuned setup with wood arrows and got less than 4" penetration on all the unrecovered hogs. He is a great shot and put the arrow in the center of the ribs forward. I expect he has killed over 150 deer and pigs with a bow or near that.When after big pigs he has a carbon in the quiver now. He is a wood arrow fanatic and it pains him to agree with me.lol He killed a big hog after those three he recovered with a carbon and got the broadhead to the other side of the pig with a 45 lb bow.
  shoot what you want but know the facts. RC

[Shadowhnter]

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[Sawpilot 75]

Originally posted by K.S.TRAPPER:
Some of you really make this game/sport a lot harder then it really is. Wood arrows with properly sharpened broadheads will get the job done eveytime as long as you do your part.

Tracy

Isn't that the truth.. I think a big problem is some guys have no confidence in the gear they are using. Last time I checked Indians never had a Carbon arrow..

[Mint]

RC, my friends and I have experienced the same thing with hogs. With wood I wasn't getting pass throughs on them but once I switched to carbons I noticed a difference. Now I didn't know if it was the front loading of the carbons that helped or just the carbon arrow but penetration increased. I think with the shield the wood and aluminum lose some penetration because of the vibration when hitting a hard service.

In the end shoot what you want, I was just trying to answer a question for a fellow tradganger.

[Mark R]

RC how do you know you only got 4" of penetration on the  unrecovered hogs.

[S.C. Hunter]

I can't speak for RC, but I'm assuming his friend could see the arrow didn't penetrate into the vitals. Arrow may have been mostly hanging out as the hogs ran off. The 4" of penetration is probably a guesstimate.

[RC]

My Friend shot the pigs at 10-15 yards. He recovered his arrow and used it to measure what was in his quiver. I don`t want to argue it is a mute point. shoot what you want. I only give first hand experience or what I know from close friends that are good at killing stuff.Good day.RC

[kennym]

I have no proof of this except from shooting whitetail deer. I used to shoot wood and still love em. My bro was shooting same weight bow and having complete pass thru. I was not, so switched to carbons and after finding the right arrow, shoot thru em a lot.

The reason I figure behind this was I get quite close to the deer I shoot. The woodies were getting as much or more penetration at 18 yards as at 5. They might have had enuff time to get recovered..I think the carbon recovers fast enuff that a close shot will be pretty much straightened out compared to a wood at same short range.

My .02 and that's exactly what it's worth. Carry on and enjoy yourself whether you shoot carbon, cane or wood!!