Woodie vs carbon penetration when hunting

[Mint]

I believe the difference in penetrating has more to do with the carbon retaining more energy since it recovers so quick out of paradox and does not vibrate upon hitting the shield. I wish I could find the high speed camera footage comparing a carbon, wood and aluminum arrow with paradox and upon impact. The difference between the carbon compared to the aluminum and wood was striking to me.

[catman1]

Dead is dead. I use GT 3555 trad carbons a have re-used kill arrows to shot again.

[Dendy Cromer]

Mint, I've seen that video also and I've spent the last hour trying to find it- I haven't been successful. It's a very interesting video and shows in great detail how all three arrow materials react when striking a target.
 For those gentlemen who think that wood will penetrate as well as carbon, especially on larger hogs-- out of curiosity- how many 200# boars have you killed with a wooden arrow?
  My point is this, I've seen an Apache helicopter. I've even seen them perform in combat. But if I were asked how to fly one of them I couldn't begin to tell you, because I have no experience flying them. So my answer would be purely second-hand information and speculation. I certainly mean no disrespect and I do not wish to sound argumentative. I love my wooden arrows, but carbon wins in the penetration department. That, I do know.

[kennym]

Originally posted by catman1:
Dead is dead. I use GT 3555 trad carbons a have re-used kill arrows to shot again.

True! I used the same arrow and broad head on four deer last year. Last doe was quartering a bit and the head hit offside leg. She broke the shaft but screwed that head on another arrow and took a bobcat with it. I guess carbons work ok.....  

[K.S.TRAPPER]

Originally posted by kennym:
 

Originally posted by catman1:
Dead is dead. I use GT 3555 trad carbons a have re-used kill arrows to shot again.

True! I used the same arrow and broad head on four deer last year. Last doe was quartering a bit and the head hit offside leg. She broke the shaft but screwed that head on another arrow and took a bobcat with it. I guess carbons work ok.....      [/b]

Yea, but I did the same thing almost exactly over a few seasons with the same Dougfir arrow and Ace broadhead. 3 big KS bucks, doe and a turkey till I hit a far leg this year on my buck. I' guess wood works ok too lol!      

Tracy

[pdk25]

I have only shot a few animals with wood arrows, and have had no problems, but I think there is enough evidence out there to suggest that carbon arrows will out-penetrate wood arrows, all else  being equal, on tough targets.  Will it matter for most people?  Most likely not, but if you haven't tried both on large tough animals like heavily shielded boar, you really can't be expected to understand what happens in that situation.  I will defer to Dendy and Robert on this.  I have killed a few big hogs, but all of them except one has been using carbons.

Who wants to shoot those big old boars anyway, the smaller round ones taste better. I just finished some off that was ho with a wood arrow, Yes, a carbon should out penetrate a wood arrow, but still needs to flying straight to get that done. In longbows that are not center shot the carbon arrows seem present more of a flight problem for the local guys here when they do not get full draws. They could be tuning them a bit stiff, I cannot know that for sure.  I have never had a penetration problem with arrows myself, but I am not planning on shooting a 200 pound boar either.

[pdk25]

Big hogs get a bad rap.  My wife said that the 225# boar that I shot a month ago was the best tasting one that I have shot and not given away.  Of course these hogs around here get plenty of corn, acorns, and pecans to eat a large portion of the year.

[pdk25]

I think Dendy's analogy of shooting through a thick shield being like shooting through the sidewall of a tractor tire is about the best analogy that I have heard.

[MikeNova]

I think penetration of wood and carbon are insufficient for ethical hunting.  I now shoot shafts of pure lead.  I get great penetration I just have to adjust abit when shooting running game at over 50 yards.

[Mr.Vic]

[wingnut]

I've never found a difference that mattered with penetration between wood and carbon.  I've taken a lot of game with both and had great results.

Durability and straightness are my issues.  Wood shafts these days would not even make the cull pile 20 yrs ago.  I don't have the time or energy to go through the process of trying to make wood fly like carbon.  So I hunt with carbon.

Mike

[Brock]

Where are you guys getting your wood arrow shafts that they are so out of straightness that it affects your shot negatively?  Wow...I hear all this talk and yes aluminum and carbon are man made and straight as (AN ARROW) and perfect nearly every time....but my goodness you give people the idea they are doing themselves and the animals a disservice and wood arrows are destined to look like the arthritic finger of the Evil Queen.

as to the question.....I personally think the penetration issue is null and void if all things are similar...same bow, same arrow weight, same sharpness on broadhead and same shaft diameter.  where I see a difference is having nearly same weight arrow with a smaller diameter shaft...all things equal except shaft diameter the skinny one will out penetrate.  It has to be equal or very close everywhere else though....

[Elewis]

Targets are specifically designed to stop arrows.  Some use friction to stop an arrow and diameter size will show a huge difference here.  Animals are not the same so the difference between 5/16 and 11/32 for example will be much less apparent when shooting an animal.

If one has doubts about penetration, get Grizzlies or Hunter's Heads or Hills. I don't have a problem with crooked wood arrows. Surewoods and Wapiti and Acmes. I keep them bundled straight and they stay straight in the bundles.  Before I finish them with Watco Oil, I may see a minor thing here and there, that is easy to fix.  Once finished, I check them every so often, but rarely need to do much straightening.  I find that a slightly bent wood arrow, when I get my quiver full of shoot away cheap arrows, will fly better and more on target than an aluminum arrow with the same bend.  Don't know why that is, don't care, and that's the way it is.

[Ray Lyon]

I shoot and love wood arrows. They're my go to arrow for 90% of my hunting and then it's Easton Axis skinny carbons.  As noted above, I'm not a hog hunter so any advice or possible anecdotes I give are pure speculation.  

However, I know that when guys like RC and the Wensel's (speaking of their experiences shooting larger African plains game) noting a difference on penetration with skinny carbon's and are recommending them when penetration can be an issue--well, that's some advice I'm going to listen too.

[Terry Green]

When did RC go to Africa??? What'd I miss??

I agree overall carbon will out penetrate wood in most instances giving all things being pretty close to equal but when you change bow weights and change broadheads to a degree that is above normal your your results can be misleading.

I'll shoot and hunt 90% with carbons but I also wax them or put black magic Tire wet on them and use a nice wax on my wood arrows.

Shoot what you like and what works best for your lifestyle.

Have Fun!

[dragonheart]

Originally posted by wingnut:
I've never found a difference that mattered with penetration between wood and carbon.  I've taken a lot of game with both and had great results.

Durability and straightness are my issues.  Wood shafts these days would not even make the cull pile 20 yrs ago.  I don't have the time or energy to go through the process of trying to make wood fly like carbon.  So I hunt with carbon.

Mike

x2

[pdk25]

This is the only hog over 200# that I have shot with a wood arrow, but he wasn't heavily shielded and I was using a bow that was a little over 63# at a little over 29", and was using a 2 blade broadhead.  I would suspect that it makes a difference with a less energetic setup on a more heavily shielded boar.  I still didn't get two holes, because the broadhead buried in the offside shoulder on this quartering away shot.  Pretty typical for larger hogs.

IMG]http://i.imgur.com/nkzMn0e.jpg[/IMG]

   

   

     

   


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[Ray Lyon]

Originally posted by Terry Green:
When did RC go to Africa??? What'd I miss??

I agree overall carbon will out penetrate wood in most instances giving all things being pretty close to equal but when you change bow weights and change broadheads to a degree that is above normal your your results can be misleading.

I'll shoot and hunt 90% with carbons but I also wax them or put black magic Tire wet on them and use a nice wax on my wood arrows.

Shoot what you like and what works best for your lifestyle.

Have Fun!

Sorry Terry, the Wensel's have stated elsewhere that they use the skinny carbon arrows due to penetration improvements that they noticed when shooting the larger African plains animals.  RC didn't say he went to Africa.  Bottom line, RC and Wensels have a boat load of experience and when I see a bunch of speculative anecdotes about 'it shouldn't make a difference on a large hog because it's worked for me on white tails.....you just need a sharp broadhead on a straight flying arrow.....'  well, if I'm going hog hunting, I'll listen to RC (or your advice).