Light wood arrows

[the rifleman]

i read a lot of posts about ways to increase arrow weight, but I'm wanting to go the other direction.  For the past couple of years I've shot 600 spine carbons with 200 grains up front, cause that's what it took to tune them to my 42 pound Toelke Whip.  The arrows weighed about 490 grains and I struggled with a wide gap and plummeting arrows at a distance.  This winter I made up some .670 and 700 spine carbons with 125 up front--- they weigh 330 and 430 respectively putting me much closer to the 8-10 gpp--- and my shooting has improved with the more forgiving set up.
My current woodies are surewood Douglas fir spined 50/55 and weigh in at 530.  My question is-- is there a wood shaft that when combine w 125 grain point would give me around 425 grains total.  I would love to start shooting wood again, but want to keep arrows in that 8-10 gpp range.

[slowbowjoe]

Sitka spruce. Call around and find the lightest end of what the vendors have in stock for spruce. You'll want to end up with a dynamic spine of right around 46 lbs; don't know what you need for a finished BOP length, so I'll leave it at that for now.

My wife shoots a 40# Whip and I can get the specs you're looking for with spruce, if I shop around... once in a while with fir.

[the rifleman]

Thanks Joe!  Any suggestions on vendors from this site?  I haven't had a lot of experience with wood and when I had tried to bareshaft I ended up breaking shafts (I had been warned) so I shot fletched and then put on broadheads to confirm that arrows were acting right.  I ended up with 50/55s in my 42 pound bow---a friend had told me that with wood you generally go up in spine above your bow's weight--it seemed to work...  I had tried 45/50s and they seemed too weak.  With carbons this bow wants very weak arrows so I'm a little perplexed when it comes to woods.  Any advice is appreciated.

[slowbowjoe]

A Whip likes a dynamic spine 4# heavier than the bow weight. (Per Dan, and true for my wife's bow).
Hildebrand for shafts - but be prepared to be patient. Or, Raptor has some Hildebrand spruce in stock, usually.

[snag]

I'll check my stock and see what mass weight I have in 50/55 spruce. If I can help I'll post the weight range.

[snag]

I've got 1 doz 341-347gr in Hildebrand spruce 50/55

[slowbowjoe]

I went out with a few of my wife's arrows a couple of days ago. Sitka spruce, 29"BOP, 125 grain points; weighed one on my digital, came in at 414 grains total. Want to mention that I switched from using water based pole to Tung oil as a sealant a few years ago, saves me a good 20 grains on the finished arrow. It works perfectly well as a sealant, and is easy to apply.
Those 45/50 spruce shoot perfectly out of her 40# Whip, and my 45# Thunderstick. I forget what the weight range was on that set of unfinished shafts; I might be able to tell you later on - I've got notes somewhere.
Suggestion: I don't always find that desired weight range. I call around, and sometimes have to wait a while until they're in stock somewhere, but it can definitely be done. Might want to get a couple of sets when you find the right ones.
Oh and forgot to ask: what length  do you need to BOP?

[the rifleman]

I shoot my carbons full length, but bop w wood could be cut shorter.  I draw 26.5 at most so-- what 27.5?  

Thanks Snag I checked your site out but couldn't find shafts.
Not sure now what spine I'd need...  Would 5/16" shafts shave even more weight.

Thanks for the guidance.

[snag]

Yes, if you can find them in your spine range.

[slowbowjoe]

Not sure why the bow seems to like 50/55's if it prefers weaker spines, But it doesn't really matter:I do find my broadheads sometimes make the arrow show weaker than field points. What length are the 50/55's you're trying?.
Anyway: For 27.5 BOP, you'd cut 'em at 28.5. To be on the safe side, I'd cut one at 29" first, and tune from there.
A set of shafts right around 300 grains, full length, should end up with a 28.5 BOP finished arrow very, very close to 425 grains finished.
 I'd get premiums in whatever you choose, to get a close spine and weight matched set. Snag is a great source here, as you can read by his posts. I didn't know he was still selling shafts. Raptor also carries spruce. Must be others, but those two come to mind. Also, keep in mind that if you have a set of shafts tapered,it'll bring the weight down by around 20-25 grains per shaft (and lower the spine a pound or two).

Depends what you are hunting, but I have lost track of how many deer that I have been involved with that were cleanly killed with arrows 450 grains and under, and all of those were with less than 27" draws.  With wood arrows I favor enough feather to straighten the arrow when things don't go as perfectly as planned.  A wide three blade may not be the best choice for an arrow that light with a less than 28" draw, but  an  cedar arrow of that weight with a  Zwickey, Bear, or Hunter's Head will come out the other side more often than not, in out experience.  In the last two years I have shot two deer, both had rib contact. With a 50 pound longbow at 26" of draw, one went clean through a rib going in and going out and the arrow shattered on a sapling passed the deer a few yards. The other was with a Hunter's Head on a cedar with a total weight of 452 grains, I cut a slice in rib long Johnson grass with fluffy snow well past the hit ate my arrow.  I looked for a long time for that arrow and will go back and look again one day, I want that head back. Both of these heads were diamond honed very sharp and then a light serration was added with the jutting  file teeth from a file with a safety edge. I cut all of my arrows to be bop net.

[SCATTERSHOT]

Check with Tom at Rocky Mountain Specialty Gear. They could probably fix you up.

[McDave]

I like to shoot lightweight wood arrows in longbow tournaments, and the lightest ones I've found are port orford cedar.  They might be heavier than spruce on the average, but not specific bunches of them.  I buy my wood arrows from Dan at Wapiti Archery, and if he understands that you want a dozen lightweight POC arrows, he will send you a bunch that might be 50 grains or so lighter than average.