Why prohibit elevated rests??

[TaterHill Archer]

I have never shot a 3-D tournament, but I keep reading how elevated rests are prohibited at them, but I have never had anyone explain why.  I know some say they aren't traditional, but that's just bogus or is based on a narrow definition of traditional. Can anyone shed some light on this subject?  Thanks.

[A.S.]

I'm wondering the same thing. I have a Silvertip on order now, and it's going to be set up with the raised rest. Guess when I show up at a 3D shoot that doesn't allow it, I'll just have to throw my score card away after shooting!

[Naphtali]

Game or competition rules need not make sense. They can be, and often are, arbitrary. The best example that comes to mind are the rules of baseball. Every rule is arbitrary.

Sorry I cannot furnish a sensible answer.

[Blue Moose]

I have always respected most of the rules in place at 3D shoots. After all, every sport has to draw the line somewhere in terms of equipment performance. However, I believe we've drawn the line in the wrong place when it comes to elevated rests.

The thing that frustrates me is that the REAL traditional bows from the "golden age" of the 60s and 70s–like the old Bears and Shakespeares–had flat shelves and were specifically designed to be used with elevated rests. Why we choose to essentially disqualify such bows is beyond me. I remember hunting with a recurve back in the 70s and almost every bow in camp had some type of elevated rest...usually brush rests or simple plastic ones like the Bear Weather rest.

This summer I'm making it a practice to encourage shoot organizers and 3D committee folks to take a second look at this rule. Polite conversation and solid reasoning can go a long way in getting such rules changed.  

Personally, I'm a longbow guy so the shelf rule only affects me on the rare occasions when I shoot recurve. But it affects enough other people that I think it's time for this rule to be seriously reconsidered.

TM

[A.S.]

BM, I was just telling someone yesterday about the cover of the new Black Widow catalog that shows their bows from the last 50 years. Several of them are wearing elevated rests. SOOO, where does the whole "traditional" thing start anyway???

[Mike Byrge@home]

The two "big" trad 3d shoots that I go to each year allow elevated rests in the recurve class.

[Frank V]

I haven't made up any rules, but what I think the rulemakers are trying to do is to limit the technolegy race. I have seen it in the shooting sports till you won't even see real hunting guns in sihlouette competition & that's what it was originaly designed for. Bottom line is if some technology is allowed someone else will say why not my sights,release,stringwalking,till eventually we loose what we started with. I know people who shoot aluminum arrows at a longbow shoot & just don't turn in a score card. They have as much fun & are fun to be with.
 My thoughts are if you use an elevated rest in a class that requires off the shelf just shoot & have fun & don't turn in a score card. When you are at another club's shoot we need to obey their rules, that's just good sportsmanship. Frank

[Dave Worden]

Personally, I think the rule came from people who didn't have an elevated rest and were outshot by people who had one !!!!  I certainly have to agree with Blue Moose since I'm still shooting one of those 1971 Shakespeares (bought new in 1971) with it's original elevated rest.

[TaterHill Archer]

Thanks for the answers.  I suspect it comes from a very narrow definition of Traditional.  No matter.  I've been shooting off the shelf lately, so if a shoot comes my way, I'll be ready.

[Blue Moose]

Frank:

I have no problem with limiting technology in competitive events. It's just that I don't consider a $2.95 stick-on brush rest to be an example of "technology."

Also, I'm not as concerned with changing rules as with changing mindset. Many people see a stick-on rest these days and view it as untraditional at best and cheating at worst. In actuality, it's just setting up bows the way they were usually set up in the "golden era" of the 60s and 70s.

But I do agree with the spirit of what you're saying...I don't want to see traditional archery become a technological arms race. I just think we sometimes ban the wrong things for the wrong reasons:).

TM

[Frank V]

Blue Moose I do think we should stick to the rules & be good sportsmen & women. I do seem to recall seeing & shooting several original Jack Howard bows with what would be called elevated feather rests as original equipment. I don't think anyone would call Jack Howard bows untraditional. Frank

[larry]

at the distance the trad stakes are at, I can't see the difference between shooting off the shelf or elevated rest amounting to a hill of beans.. having said that, I shoot off the shelf, but if someone else likes to shoot off a elevated rest, I say let them have at it. At 25yrds and less, I don't think where the arrow sets is going to play a factor between 1st and 2nd...

[jhansen]

I think it is a matter for the club or group that sets the rules for their shoot to decide.  "When in Rome..."  Maybe we should all go really traditional and shoot off the knuckle?  Can't get much more traditional than that.

John

[Mudfeather]

I think it is done just for fairness in competition, not because it isn't traditional. Each class causes different trophies and more cost.

Bows do seem to shoot arrows "cleaner" with an elevated rest. They are also associated with olympic style shooting which does not blend well with hunting "style"

MAYBE this makes some small amount of sense..just my take on it

[Bonebuster]

Once I learned how to tune a traditional bow properly, arrow flight was not an issue.

When I got rid of an elevated arrow, and it was closer to my hand, my shooting improved,.. alot.
 
As mentioned, some of the older bows with a flat shelf are much better off with a simple elevated
rest. If anything, I think it may actually be a handicap.

Even the new bows with the metal handles, and adjustments from top to bottom, still require the same skills to master.

 If I miss a target, it has NOTHING to do with the fact that I don`t have an elevated rest.

[HumbleHunter]

That was a good question, got good replies, that was cool.

[Blue Moose]

"As mentioned, some of the older bows with a flat shelf are much better off with a simple elevated
rest"

Yep. That's the reason I wish people would reconsider this rule. After all, why discourage the very bows that inspired most of us to take up archery in the first place?


TM

[aromakr]

I have to agree with what several have said, however there will always be rules! And not everyone will agree with all of them, that's life, live with it. I believe it was Blue Moose that said "Way back in the old days the 60's and 70's" maybe the problem is alot of you guy's are too young to remember the old days! The 70's is when the compound hit the market, not what I would consider the old days. Take a look at the old days the 20's to the 50's, you will notice they shot off their hand or the shelf.
Bob

[SOS]

I think Keith hit the nail on the head a while back.  Many clubs that have trad shoots are Bowhunting clubs.  Part of the limitation is to use hunting bows, not strictly target bows.  That's why our shoots in Georgia have minimum weights on arrows as well.  Likewise, how many classes can set up?  Get's expensive unless it is a huge shoot to have split the recurve class again to bare bow and target bow.  Just a thought.

[dragonheart]

How many classes do you have?  That has been the technology/equipment battle for years.  I believe boundaries have to be drawn.  A club cannot afford to have awards for every differnent way someone could shoot.  I think the biggest factor in the elevated rest ban is not the rest.  It is the guy who shows up to shoot 3-d with a 35 pound hoyt machined riser target bow, gap shooting, and beats everyone.  Does he hunt with that set up?  The original intent of 3-D was to get away fro a bullseye and shoot at unmarked animal targets in hunting situations.  Today many 3-D shoots are target archery with an animal target.  Well if you outlaw elevated rest,it is unlikely that guy is coming back with his olympic recurve shooting off the shelf.  Elevated rest are not the real issue.  People want fairness and someone has to draw a line.