Longbow vs recurve, Instinctive vs anchor shooting

[feather bound]

Good evening fellow archers,
I have two issues stumping me. a) I'm in love with the longbow and currently shoot a 50# Montanna which I'm very satisfied with. However, being new to hunting with it in a stand I find that the limbs are very awkward in a tree given their length such that I been thinkin maybe I should switch to recurve for sake of shorter, less clumbsy limbs.

b) I'm not sure I quite understand the instinctive aspect of archery. I'm told by many that an archer wants to get to a point where he/she can draw the string and release fluidly without even anchoring or that the longer one holds an anchor the less likely the shot will be acurate. This holds gravity to me because I don't want to spend time practicing the wronge technique. I'm sure this will/has stir many contradicting opinions, which is fine because I might find ones opinion/experience to help guide me in finding my own way. Everyones thaughts  will have my deepest respect and graditude.
Thank you so much for helping me in my journey to reaching my fullest potential as an archer.

[Scott J. Williams]

Shooting instinctive still requires a solid anchor, that is a requirement for any style of shooting. The time it takes to release the arrow is dependent on the time it takes the shooter to focus and get everything together. The shot can be and will be more fluid through practice.

Like anything learned, practice is taken one step at a time.  There are times when my shot appears to be released before I reach anchor or just as I reach anchor and there are times when I hold a full two to three seconds after hitting anchor.  

When you see a person release before they hit anchor, they are snap shooting, which is not instinctive shooting. It is a breakdown in the shooting form, which leads to target panic, and in most cases is due to shooting a bow too darn heavy in the first place.

While there are a large number of people who perfer other shooting methods, I find the instinctive method a very good one for me. I think your question is a very good one, because many don't understand what it is.

Form, form, form, is the key. Don't shoot too heavy, find a good anchor, it is your best friend, and take your time on the shot.  Regardless of the style you shoot, I agree with Byron Ferguson, you should be able to hold your bow at full draw for ten seconds and still get off an accurate shot.

Regarding your longbow, proper preparation is important.  You have selected your stand site, you should trim it correctly.  When I place a stand or blind, I take the bow I expect to shoot with me into the stand to make sure nothing gets in the way.  Learning to shoot your bow in different positions will also help.

Remember shooting a bow instinctive has nothing to do with how fast you shoot.  The advantage in my mind of shooting instinctive is the fact that I don't have to worry about distance, or some sighting system, it allows for me to totally concentrate on the spot I want to hit alone, and to totally enjoy the flight of the arrow.  That flight is why I got into shooting a bow in the first place....

[feather bound]

Scott,
Thank you for your sensible advise. I feel comfortable with your advise because when I shoot the way you advise I tend to feel and in most cases shoot better--I will keep practicing that way. As for the recurve, do you recomend not ventureing at all towards the recurve with the idea of enjoying both types of bows. Or should one just focus on one type?

[Scott J. Williams]

I have owned both until recently, I now own only one recurve, it was my first Black Widow, so I are reluctant to part with it, however it gets very limited use.

After being in this sport for forty plus years, I am a firm believer that if you want to excel to the highest level that you can reach, you should limit your shooting to one method(as long as it is right for you) and one type of bow, such as a long bow over a recurve, or recurve over a long bow.  

G. Fred Asbell recently had an article in "Traditional Bowhunter" where he suggested that you should stick with one bow. He feels that your better off if you don't bounce around, especially during the season. The difference between the grip on most longbows compared to most recurves can be very different. Now if you buy a recurve from the same bowyer that makes your longbow, or similar grip, you can move back and forth with little ill effect.

I have two PL longbows from Black Widow, I will likely in the next year or two purchase their recurve built on the same handle design.

When I had my Selkirk, a recurve, made by Saxon, and my Mongoose, a longbow, made by Saxon, I could shoot either exceptionally well.  They were built on the same riser design.

So in response to your question, the answer would be, yes,  sometimes, if both bows are of the same riser design and grip.

I hope that helps....

[BLACK WOLF]

Scott gave some great advice. The only thing I would add to it is based on your specific goals.

If you are just wanting to hunt and/or limit your shot distance to 30yrds. or under...it's hard to beat Instinctive Aiming when the archer has only a small window of opportunity and the archer has to react fast. Many of the hunting situations a bowhunter may experience is where Instinctive Aiming can really shine.

If you are wanting to be able to shoot at just about any target and compete in tournaments where the distances may reach over 90yrds....I would highly suggest that you learn a couple of aiming techiniques so you can use the different advantages they offer when a shot requires it.

Either way...have fun with it...and learn good form to the point that you can execute it instinctively and know your bow inside and out by tuning it.

Ray    

[Scott J. Williams]

Well stated Black Wolf, I didn't consider that he may not be interested specificly in hunting.

[feather bound]

Thanks Guys,
I'v been shooting target longer than hunting. 'Fact, I just started hunting this season because my source of venicen just moved away. So I decided to venture into the hunting aspect of archery--- MAN DO I LOVE IT!!!! But not better than target shooting. But either way I am  new to instictive shooting (6 mos) and have lots to learn in both activities. By the way I have not bagged a deer yet, and worse I'v had three perfect broadside shots given to me but those limbs(64") kept getting in the way
as well as my inexperience.
Anyway, thanks again very much for the well given advise. I feel I can practice now knowing Im not building on bad techniques.
Kind requards, Jim

[BLACK WOLF]

Jim,

What was your current aiming techinique for target archery? Is there some reason that you believe in wouldn't work while hunting?

Thanks,

Ray  

[Faith In Flight]

A solid anchor held for a sec will produce better results in my experence. You always want to let it go  right as you hit anchor but thats not best. Hold at full draw for a sec, not to long cause then you will waver. But i notice that those fellows at the range that release immediatly upon anchor usually dont shoot to consistant. You need a second to stabilize.

[Terry Green]

I shoot instinctive....and I use a double anchor, and I don't hold.  I never stop pulling.  I creep back tension as I reach my second anchor.

I also can hold there if need be for a second or two.  I only hold when the game moves and dictates that I hold.

   My Shot  

Yes, I am reaching not one but two anchor points, ...middle finger in the corner of my mouth, and my thumb base knuckle slid in behind by jaw under my ear.

Nothing is written in stone on how long to hold, that's up to each individual person to find out what works best for you.....however, proper alignment and a consistent anchor are keys to accurate shooting.

You may tend to hold a bit more and stay like that, or you may start out holding and evolve into a little more fluid shot as your site pictures may come quicker as you shoot more.

Good thread guys!

[feather bound]

Black Wolf,
  I range from 20 to 50 yards using what I assume to be the gap method(looking at the target while keeping the arrow shaft in my peripheral vision and just guesing what feels right for the distance I am shooting. Up close(about 20yds.) I seem to have a straight projectory so I keep the peripheral arrow shaft lower than the point I want to hit.

Hunting: I havent shot at a deer yet but have practiced from a stand up to about 20 yds out. The arrow seems to hit a little lower(few inches) than my anticipated spot. Pertaining to my the advise above from Scott I should get up in my stand and do some tree trimming to obtain more clearance.
Kind regards, Jim

[rnharris]

shoot lot's of arrows from elevated position if your gonna hunt there your anchor will feel differint with downward angle get comfortable with the downward angle and perfect that anchor
Ralph

[carlr2s]

If your longbow is not center shot, or you can't shoot it vertically for some other reason, you won't be able to shoot around the tree, or behind you. This was my experience this year. For this reason, I prefer my recurve. I'm not smart and lucky enough to always have the deer walk in front of me.

[BLACK WOLF]

feather bound,

That pretty much sounds like how I aim. I call it Instinctive Gap where a few others like to call it Gapstinctive or Instinctagap    but it's basically how you described. I'm consciously aware of my arrow and use it for windage but I couldn't tell you exactly what my gap is for a particular distance. I've been shooting for so long it has almost become totally instinctive. I basically feel the shot instead of consciously analizing it.

Like others have already mentioned....trimming the branches around your stand, practicing shooting from your stand, learning to shoot in different positions in your stand and mixing up the length of time you hold at anchor will all help prepare you for the moment of truth.

If you can't practice shooting from your stand because you don't want to spook deer from that area...practice from an elevated position like your roof.

Ray  

[J Buck]

thanks Terry! neat watching that smooth form.

[feather bound]

Thanks for the advise everyone. Terry the vid really helped me out as that is pretty much the way it feels most comfortable for me. But I'm going to incorporate some anchor holds in my target practice sessions. I also went back to my stand hunting again and did some pruning. Feels better but still pretty cumbersome as I do shoot canted. I guess this will take time but I think I'll stick with the longbow(excuse the pun).
Thanks again everyone.