TBM AD - "Push Release" - to Cure Target Panic - Anyone try this???

[Over&Under]

I noticed this ad in the latest TBM and recall seeing it before, but just checked out the website and it looks very interesting.  

Has anyone seen this DVD and/or have any thoughts on it?  Seems like it my help me out a little if any of it is true.

 http://pushrelease.com/index.html

Thanks
Jake

PS.  Mods if this needs moved or is unappropriate please feel free....

[Basic Instinct]

I Have the DVD.  OK approach. Have not spent anytime on the range trying it yet, but plan too.  Not much help here, but interested in anyone as well that has spent some time trying his method.  I kind of already had been trying a very similar approach on my own before I got the video

[tecum-tha]

Cured me and at least 6 others I tought it to.
Best money I ever spent in archery for me!

[Big Sneaky]

I had the DVD, but I gave it to another fellow.  The Push Release is holding at full draw and then using back tension you squeeze your anchor finger just a little further back.  Makes it seem like you are pushing a button.  There is not much on that DVD so see if someone would let you borrow it.  You can watch it once and get the concept.

[Papa]

Hey Cade!  I am the another fellow.  It cured my target panic!     I have since sent your DVD to another fellow!

Mike

[Big Sneaky]

That's great Mike!  I thought I had given it to you but couldn't remember.  Glad to hear the TP is under control.

Cade

[bayoulongbowman]

Its nothing that hasnt been taught before , Ive heard the same thing about 5 to 10 years ago. If it works for ya , GREAT!  

[McDave]

With apologies to Jay Kidwell (and you really ought to read his book, Instinctive Archery Insights, if you have a problem with target panic), target panic is caused by programming the brain to release the arrow as soon as we reach full draw and come on target.  After releasing the arrow a number of times when we come on target, the brain develops a learned response, and begins releasing the arrow in anticipation of reaching full draw and coming on target, which is where the problems start.  Kidwell's approach is to de-program the brain using various exercises, which have proven to be effective.

Linsin's "push release" is a method of turning the release into more of a mechanical process that is controlled by the conscious brain rather than just letting the subsconcious brain decide when it's time to release the arrow.  The problem Linsin has to overcome is that we are taught that the release should be a surprise when it happens or you will ruin the shot.  How can it be a surprise if you consciously decide when to "pull the trigger?"  His solution to that problem, which is clever, is to use one of the holding fingers to "squeeze off a shot" in the same way a rifle shooter would, thus keeping the shot more under the control of the shooter, while also maintaining the surprise element of the exact timing of the release.

If you really want a comprehensive understanding of target panic, get Kidwell's book.

On the other hand, Linsin's method is not described in Kidwell's book, and I found that learning it gave me more confidence that I could control the timing of my release.  Once I got that confidence, I did not decide to continue with his method as my normal release, but I think going through the process improved my shooting.

Linsin's DVD is reasonably priced, and I would not cheat him out of a part of his living by passing around free copies, other than to my immediate family and friends with whom I normally share things.

[Over&Under]

I must agree that any one method is not a cure all for every shooter, and the concept may help the person overcome problems with TP, but his own form of shooting and release might just be improved or adapted after learning to release properly or control the brains decision making process.  

I would like to watch the DVD just for the same reason McDave gave of the possibility of helping me over come the brain wanting to release prematurely, and controling WHEN to release.

I do not see however how a controlled release by pulling the anchor finger back a little further could keep any sort of surprise as part of the shot.  If you are concienceously deciding when to release, the surprise is lost.

Thanks for the input guys

Jake

[McDave]

"I do not see however how a controlled release by pulling the anchor finger back a little further could keep any sort of surprise as part of the shot. If you are concienceously deciding when to release, the surprise is lost."

It works the same as a rifle shot.  You decide when to start pulling the rifle trigger, and by a controlled squeeze, it is still a surprise when the rifle fires.

[Jason R. Wesbrock]

Originally posted by McDave:
...target panic is caused by programming the brain to release the arrow as soon as we reach full draw and come on target.  After releasing the arrow a number of times when we come on target, the brain develops a learned response, and begins releasing the arrow in anticipation of reaching full draw and coming on target, which is where the problems start.  

That is but one form of target panic. In many people it manifests itself as an inability to get on target.

[Over&Under]

Originally posted by McDave:
"I do not see however how a controlled release by pulling the anchor finger back a little further could keep any sort of surprise as part of the shot. If you are concienceously deciding when to release, the surprise is lost."

It works the same as a rifle shot.  You decide when to start pulling the rifle trigger, and by a controlled squeeze, it is still a surprise when the rifle fires.

McDave - I can see that with a rifle, as you do not know when the trigger will release the hammer, but with a bow string, you still have to manually move your fingers or open the hand to allow for release.  This takes a mental decision that is calculated to an exact time that you know is going to happen when YOU say it is.

It is not as if you keep pulling your anchor finger untill some magic spot that you don't know causes your fingers to let go, in fact you could keep pulling till you hit your ear if you wanted, but you still must dicide when to release and that is a set decision and time.

[Over&Under]

The surprise aspect of the release really is a non issue if by controlling the release you are able to cure some TP problems you may have.  I do think I will take a look at the DVD just to see if parts of it help me.

[McDave]

"It is not as if you keep pulling your anchor finger untill some magic spot that you don't know causes your fingers to let go, in fact you could keep pulling till you hit your ear if you wanted, but you still must decide when to release and that is a set decision and time."

That's why you need to see the video.  His method does allow for an element of surprise, similar to a rifle shot.

[Over&Under]

McDave

I agree, I think we may be talking about the same think just don't know it.  I will get the DVD and then see if I understand this concept better.  I will get back to you then.

Thanks for your input.  Nice Muley by the way!  :D  

Jake

[Todd Hathaway]

I wouldn't waste money on it. Everything that's in it has been discussed already.

And you are right, Jake, pushing an imaginary button does not make your fingers let go all by themselves.

The only thing that comes close to a true surprise release for finger shooters is to 1) Gradually relax your fingers so at some point they can no longer hold the string. This is nearly impossible to do slowly with a hunting weight bow because as soon as you start to relax, the string is gone.
2) Use your face to "peel" the fingers off the string as you slowly pull back. This is a the best method to get a truly surprise release that replicates the act of squeezing a trigger. You are still consciously acting, but the shot goes off on its own.

[Over&Under]

Todd

is it basiclly just physically pulling the string back further than your anchor even if just fractions of an inch than letting go when you feel you have reached sufficeint back tension?

[Todd Hathaway]

The whole gist of it was this: pull to anchor, imagine your finger is on a trigger or button, then push the imaginary button by pulling back into it a little more. That's it. Why he needed a whole DVD to say that is beyond me.

He says the release will just happen automatically, but it really is not the same as pulling a gun trigger and letting the mechanisms determine when the shot goes off.

If it works for you, great. But keep in mind, it will tend to make you increase tension in your fingers (because they have to be tense to "push a button").

When I told the author this, he agreed, but said that the mental benefits outweigh this physical imperfection. If it helps you mentally, I'd have to agree.

[Over&Under]

I have tried that very method I believe.  It does help but I would not say it is a cure all.  A person could still not put the same amount of pressure back each time or curl his fingers instead of have back tension to mentally have the same effect.

Thanks for your thoughts Todd

[Tilzbow]

I own the video and it's fool's gold IMHO but it might work for some for a while. The entire premise of this "trick" is to make yourself increase back tension to create the release. That said if you don't know how to maintain and create back tension during your shot sequence you won't understand why and how this "trick" works. Once you figure out the how, why and what of back tension you shouldn't need this trick to make it happen but if it works for you at that point so be it and it's not a bad thing! If you get to the point that you know how to shoot the perfect shot (via blank bale shooting) the only challenge after that is making it happen when it counts EVERYTIME which is an extremely difficult Mental PROCESS. If I said I've figured that out I'd be lying otherwise I'd have a video of my own and would be the King of archery..... We can all shoot great shots and some can do it more regularly than others but others are great and can do it more often than not. If anyone says they can do it everytime they're lying or are a fool and need to wake up. Tiger may have shot a couple near perfect rounds but I can promise you he would admit he's not perfect either and has never shot a perfect round.