Floating your thumb and pinky.....

[Loosenock]

I've a copy of John Schulz "Hitting 'em like Howard Hill" laying around for years.  I picked it up and fanned the pages and the words "careless or sloppy" caught my eye as the pages flipped by.  I went back and found the statement again.

John wrote "..., if the thumb and little finger are allowed to "float", the first three fingers will produce a careless or sloppy release."  As many times as I have read or looked at this book it seems like it was the first time I noticed this.

I've have seen pictures of Fred Bear at anchor.  He was deffinately a floater.  I am a floater.  My hand seems spastic about this.  I cannot make the Vulcan "V" with four fingers like Spock does either.

I dont know if I can totally buy into Mr. Schulz satement that floating causes a careless or sloppy release.

I would be interested in hearing your comments about this.

Thanks

[KSdan]

Holding down the pinky physiologically does make the three fingers more rigid.  I too do the float thing though.  May try to work on the hold-down this year.

[lpcjon2]

Howard way was the way I learned and it is hard to keep the thumb and pinky together.It takes a lot of work and stretching to get them comfortable in the anchor,but I feel that it makes a big difference with me and If you draw the way mentioned it the book (straight back for the last 6" to anchor) you will see how it helps.I feel it brings it all together just before your shot.your hand doesn't move left to right it is perfectly locked in the anchor.IMHO

[Buckeye Trad Hunter]

I just started locking my pinky and thumb together fooling around one day.  It did actually make me more consistant.

[gordie]

it takes practice...and stretching, but is worth
the effort.
the "old" ways are alittle harder, but have time tested benefits

[vtmtnman]

LOL..I actually had to go get my bow and come to full draw to see what my pinky does.Everything has become just that automatic for me.

Seems I tuck it in to my palm but don't touch my thumb with it.I curl my thumb to my palm and use it as a second anchor point under my jaw.Always good to have another anchor point for consistency.

[tackhammer]

I anchor my thub on my jaw bone but I have no idea about my pinky, So I must be halfway there!  

[xtrema312]

I anchor my thumb to jaw also so no way to get the pinky finger in there.  The pinky just tucks up into the face.  So not under the thumb, but not floating.

[LP Kelley]

I gave the pinky and thumb thing a good try out after reading the book years ago. At full draw and squeezing my shoulder blades together I couldn't relax the back of my hand to my satisfaction. Discontinued doing it.

[dragonheart]

I have tried both ways.  If you watch some footage of Howard shooting and look at the illustration in his pamhplet on "My Method of Shooting", he does not place his thumb and pinky together.  you can watch some video of Hill on this site.  He holds his pinky back and the thumbs curls like he is cocking a trigger as he comes to full draw.  I have been experimenting with this.  You get a real sense of control when you touch the twp together, but I get a great loose when I cock my thumb and hold my pinky back without the two touching.  have to keep my fingers on the string "well curled" around the bowstring.

[PSUBowhunter]

I have tried both and settled with locking my thumb and pinky together. I anchor my thumb bone under my cheek bone, so my thumb and pinky just naturally go together.

[freefeet]

My take on it from the little experience i have...

Isn't the point in all this to keep the thumb and pinky consistently in the same place every release - thumb on pinky nail being only one way of achieving said consistency?

If your thumb or pinky is floating - which i take to mean as in going wherever they feel like whenever they feel like, your string fingers will not be consistent.  Try moving your thumb and pinky into different positions and notice how your string fingers will move, or if they don't you will feel tension within them to stop them moving.

I can't see that it matters what you do with your thumb and pinky just as long as you do the same thing with them each shot - we're all made slightly different.

[TSP]

Realizing what John S. said in his book, it's also true that everyone is built differently and that must be taken into account when building form.  I shoot Hill bows (among others) and after trying that approach for a season concluded that my hand/wrist build simply doesn't work as well that way...it creates more tension in the draw hand for me (the dreaded 'claw').  I shoot much better and feel more confident in my release by simply using a deep hook and not worrying about thumb/pinky placement.  

It's always possible to take shooting instructions too literally and ignore what works best for your own situation.  Sometimes you just have to simplify.

[Rob Fin]

I started placing the end of my thumb onto the base of my pinky (where my pinky meets my palm). It feels natural to me (now) and helps keep my thumb bent in towards my palm. This keeps my thumb knuckle out of the way when I am on target for the last 6" of my draw. Other wise my thumb knuckle is in the way when I'm just about at anchor. Works for me!

[SammyIamToday]

Would it be considered floating if you place the thumb and pinky on certain parts of your face?  

I'm rather new to trad shooting and it seems very comfortable for my hand this way, but perhaps not as consistent as curling them in.  Which I'm not even sure I could do as my hand isn't very flexible.

[Loosenock]

For the last 4 or 5 days I have probably looked like a boy scout about to give the scout salute.  But I have managed to stretch out my hand.  Actually it feels a little more flexible.  I notice that when I place my thumb on my pinky (I place the thumb print tightly down on the middle segment of my little finger) and my first 3 fingers straight out, it seems like that locks all of the bones in the back of my hand.  When all this is going on, I can actually get my drawing hand closer/deeper into my face.  I've been able to put the knuckle of my thumb in a depression under my ear lobe and behind my jaw.  I now have 2 anchor points, the tip of my middle finger at the corner of my mouth, and the one I described with my thumb knuckle.  It deffinately helped me.

My only problem now is forgeting to do it.  After shooting a while my focus wonders and so does my arrows.

Just my humble observation.

'Loose

[Renaissance Man]

It was a matter of tension, across the back of the hand especially. Adds to a cleaner release and less of a tendency to pluck the string off arrow line.
It is really part of a shooting system, draw the arrow straight back, hit your first anchor point, finger on the corner of your mouth, then continue drawing back hitting your second anchor point with your thumb along your jaw wherever it feels best to you.
Continue the push, pull back as you release in a close to straight line with your arrow.
The slight head tilt lays your arrow directly under your dominant eye and closes the gap between the angle your eye is looking at the target and what angle your arrow is at.
It really is an incredible but simple system, beautiful in execution and deadly accurate.
It can be used as a instinctive type of shooting or with whatever type of aiming you desire.

[Renaissance Man]

Also in regards to what Mr. Hill did I think he was a continuosly evolving archer. I have seen shots where he did anchor the pinky with the thumb and many he did not.
I also saw him shooting recurves and various other changes from film to film and book to book.
One thing is for certain though, when he taught others to shoot he taught him to do it like Mr. Shultz describes. I had fellows who were lucky enough to be on the line and get instruction from Mr. Hill when he was a t the PA Bowhunters Festival and they told me that is how he showed them to do it.
If you think about it it is like asking Rembrandt how do you paint. people like that are so far removed in their abilities from the majority and their style is whatever their mind sees and feels at the time it happens. At moving shots sometimes you would see him bend at the body in an odd torque of movement with the target and do a dramatic pluck back of his draw hand upon release.
Sometimes he looked like the bow arm was locked in a concrete case without the slightest movement and his string arm came back in an almost perfect line with the arrow just like Mr. Shults describes and demonstrates on his video.

[bshunter]

started out shooting that way, seemed to tense up my whole hand, but I do believe in keeping them in the same place for every shot, we gave up the peeps, kissers, etc...but we still need to find ways to keep our form the same every time.

[elkhunter752]

I personally really like using my thumb as an anchor in my jawbone which really helps me with a constant anchor point, and then I float my pinky.