Shooting Blues

[Dawnpatrol]

When you are on top, it seems like nothing can stop you. When you hit the bottom its all uphill to get to where you want to go.

My shooting fell apart two years ago. Last winter I hunted in the snowy mountains of Idaho where I managed to make a clean miss at a huge 4x4 mulie at 11 yards, broadside, unobstructed. That experience depressed and inspired me.  Now, I'm determined to fix what’s broken. I'm planning on elk hunt in Colorado in August 2010 and am laying the ground work to be an accurate confident shot by that time. I'm piecing together a daily shooting routine to get me back on top.

This is where you come in. Got any advice for a victim of Target panic (TP) that wants to work through this problem? I'm open to input guys.

Thanks

[string bean]

Ain't got no advice for TP but I know how you feel.  One day I feel that I couldn't miss even if I drew with my toes.  Other days I can't even hit the ground (true) and want to give up.

[Junction hunter]

Unsure on TP many threads here that can help.
Can empathize. Been hunting Trad for 4 years and still haven't blooded my bow. Know I could with wheels. But I love shooting the recurve and some day WILL succeed. Keep shooting and don’t give up!!!!!!!!! Your time will come.

[wmcclendon]

I'm not expert, but I think going to a low poundage bow for a bit should help you overcome your TP much faster.  There's always the clickers too.  Never used one myself, but I've heard great things about them for TP.

Good luck!  Remember, majority wise, its a mental game.  You just have to think positive thoughts.

I will repeat this.  I had TP. I read a post of a technique that I was taught 40 years ago by a PAA pro.  Draw the bow both eyes closed, let down, then right eye closed, let down, then draw right eye closed open it and close the left,let down, do this until the heeby cheebies quiet, then draw with both eyes open, let sown, do this until the heebie cheebies quiet down, then draw the bow tighten up and release, with both hands do nothing and keep your eye on the target.  
   My daughter had terrible target panic and short draws, this past weekend we fixed it in 30 minutes. she finished by hitting 12 heart lung shots on a small deer target at 25 yards with a 35 pound Hill in a row.  The Kidwell thing did not work for me after two years of trying, this worked in 15 minutes. I now shoot mostly left handed because two years of trying and failing wrecked my index finger, I can shoot right handed now but I cannot make a habit out of it or I will get trigger finger in my index joint.

[Dawnpatrol]

Thanks everybody for the empathy and sound advice. Very much appericated. You might think that after 20 years of shooting a recurve I'd be some phenomenal great shot. Not so!

Pavan, I like your idea opening and closing eyes until the "heebie cheebies" go away. I'm gonna hit the bales this evening and will report back with results.

Cheers for the advice.

[NBK]

Been there too.  A few years ago I developed TP in a bad way.  I'd short draw every dang time.  Had to stop shooting with "the guys" because the pressure was making it worse.  Took a whole winter to myself.  Started in the garage at night coming to full draw pointed at my new Silverado.  No kidding! and no way in heck was I going to let that arrow go! Did that every night for a week.  Then went to blank bale, eyes closed for a week.  Started shooting with my eyes open and noticed that I'd let one go a little quick, so I then developed a shot sequence that I go through mentally for each shot.  Mine is: feet, hand(bow), shoulder(rotated), fingers(string), (at this point I stare at my floss nock and take a deep breath), draw, settle, relax.)  That routine does two things; it sets a good pace for my shot process which also aids in concentration, and it also serves as my safety net so that when "the wheels come off" I simply go back to my routine and reset the mechanism.  
Hang in there, this too shall pass.

[Chuck Hoopes]

What you got is LIVE target panic. If it had been a 3D Mulie at 11yds, you'd of nailed it.  The  best way to learn to hit LIVE targets is to shoot at LIVE targets. I spend 25-50hrs a year squirrel hunting w/ the bow to keep me tuned for Deer season.  Most states have some open season on something--i.e. red squirrel, woodchuck,chipmunks,goffers, whatever.-- so you don't have to wait for the regular fall small season-- but regardless  pleasant fall days in the woods flinging arrows at squirrels will prep you about as well as anything.

Humans have a complex wiring system. TP is almost a short circuit, forcing yourself to break TP can help in some circumstances and cause a breakdown in others. There is a technique called 'tapping the healer within'. I learned it to control irregular heart rhythms, a side effect of nsaid pain meds.  It reprograms ones reaction to stimuli.  Curing TP has that same goal,  this what I sought to achieve for myself, another local archer and my daughter, what I have described worked. Anything that efficiently changes that wiring should work, NBK worked out something that worked for him as well. One thing I also do that helps, shoot arrows where you can tell how far you are pulling without looking.  I prefer net length arrows for target and stumping, I cut my broadheads so they become a draw check when they touch my index finger.  My friend who shot long carbons wrapped tape at his full draw as a draw check. this works somewhat like a clicker, but it is not a cure for TP just a little security for knowing when the draw is right.

[newbwithabow]

Get this book.
Instinctive Archery Insights, by Jay Kidwell

There's a great chapter on Curing Target Panic.

  http://www.amazon.com/Instinctive-Archery-Insights-Jay-Kidwell/dp/0963971824/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1271400845&sr=8-13

[Dawnpatrol]

Hey Ya all. Thanks the for the input!

Pavan-
Went out last night and did the close both eyes, close right eye, close left eye, and then open both. It was pretty interesting. Both eyes closed was smooth. Left eye open as smooth too, just a little funny looking sight picture. But when I closed the left eye and had my right eye open (dominate eye) the heebie cheebies came out. I physically flintched at the target, had a hard time holding, my concentratiion faultered, and my sight picture got all screwy. Very interesting! It seems like I've programed my brain to recognize when my donimate eye is on target and I want to let go of the string while at the same time push with my bow hand. I'm gonna keep doing that close eye thing until it gets better.

NBK- Although I don't have a new Silverado to shoot holes in I'll try holding and letting down like you suggest. I've also noticed that when I shoot in the back yard alone I have descent form, but while shooting with the guys at 3D or stump shooting it all changes. Generally I snap shoot with the guys.

[Dawnpatrol]

-Chuck Hoopes
I agree that I should shot at more live game. No dought I'd be a better shot at the hogs and bucks if I shot more rabbits and squirels. However, I don't think that it's "buck fever" I got because I'm usually pretty composed while I shoot at animals, and my shooting is inconsistent even on the straw bale at 15 yards. Right now I could miss the slam dunk on a 3D buck.

NBK-
I'm gonna work out a shot sequence like the one you described. A key issue with my shooting is that I shoot to fast. The shot sequence could force me to slow me down and concentrate on each shot.

Good stuff boys. THANKS!

[jcp161]

I had a real problem with target panic. I think it came from starting with too heavy a bow and bad advice on shooting "instinctively". I tried everything. Lighter bows, books, reading the threads here etc. I just couldn't come back to full draw and lock in before shooting. I finally dragged out an old compound and started shooting it along with the longbow. It reprogrammed me to pause when I came to full draw before shooting. This broke the quick release cycle and improved my traditional shooting immensely. I put the compound away and was able to concentrate again on good technique with the trad bows.

[eric-thor]

shame on you jpc161 jk. yes i see how that sin would work .lol !yet so would a super light bow . like let off weight. or close.i picked up a 12 lb bear ranger was from a old school program.
 hears my own sin : i used a back tension release with that bear ranger and wow! did that make some profound improvements in follow through and breaking the tp/haisty shot.

[SHOOTO8S]

ALWAYS...shoot the bow with your mind,NOT your eyes.

I think TP is perhaps more of a physical condition more than purely mental. A minor bout I had with it years ago came on when getting harassed at a shoot.  The bad one happened when I dropped bow weight.  If you can convince yourself that holding at full draw by the use various stimuli, whether using a clicker or bowsight or the Kidwell techniques or the winking, whatever works for you use it. It seems that one has to rebuild the neurotransmitters that create the jump in control. Trying to force it out of your system by will power rarely works.  For those that do not hold on target, swing draw anchor deep release, that is not really target panic.  TP is when, what ever tempo one shoots at, form completely breaks down when exact aiming takes place. Using the other techniques, I could force myself to hold at a target, providing I performed the trick during the shot.  As soon as I did not do the trick it was still with me. Last night I tested myself with a right hand bow out in the back yard after returning from turkey hunting with my left hand bow.  I could feel that evil TP monkey behind me. I went through the cycle once and then proceeded to shoot in my normal rhythm. My goal is to not necessarily hold on target, or to be able to hold off target and then swing on target just to let down, the goal is to smoothly execute the shot and only concentrate on the target. The idea being that the form, speed, and release of the shot is dictated by aim and not by tempo. I believe that Howard Hill's release was aim motivated and not tempo motivated.  He could get to his aim very smoothly and quickly, but he most definitely was aiming.  It seems that getting stale shooting any technique is where the poison of tp gets permanent.  Hill was always splitting hairs, keeping the finite concentration focused.  Good form is using the right muscles and alignment, good control of that form is a lot more fun when happens without a lot of mental manipulation and baggage.  For me it is that last 6 inches of draw, where my eyes have etched the spot where the arrow is heading, the draw hand smoothly squeezes to the double anchor, the release is nearly immediate, the follow through has my fingers jump back just a little, my bow is still on target and the arrow is spinning over the shelf heading directly to where my eyes are focused. Not a lot of thought and self introspection involved, just focus.
   I feel that I have just given a full Sunday morning sermon. Sorry for the long post.

[jcp161]

No apologies. I, for one, appreciated the read. You mentioned the double anchor. I discovered it on the Tradgang video in Terry Green's section and it helped quite a bit. Having that second spot made me slow down and helped the target panic and my overall shooting. If I didn't hit it, my accuracy suffered accordingly. For me, just another one of the "tricks" you mentioned to overcome the TP.

At I least I managed to leave out the three page short overview of focal dystonia. I guess I could leave that to my friend David Leisner.
 http://davidleisner.com/

[HUNT 24/7]

In my short time with trad shooting (2 months) I've noticed some  similarities with trad shooting & golf. It seems to me that target panic would be similar to the dreaded "shank" in golf, where a perfectly good shooter or golfer suddenly looses it.
 
In golf, it is all mental, you make a few bad swings & it gets in your head & you try to "fix" it, & it just starts going down hill from there, with some people never coming out. I think going back to the basics would be the best thing to do, kind of start fresh & build from there.

 Get back to basics, don't over analyse & keep it fun.  


Hope it works out for you, good luck.

[MRD]

Rod, what do you mean by "shoot with your mind, not your eyes"?  As in, shoot when you are ready, not when it "looks" right?