back tension release help

[TexasStick81]

Hey Guys,

I've been working on my form recently.  Specifically, I've been focusing on drawing with back tension, coming to my double anchor, and using back tension to pull through the release.  I feel pretty successful with the first two.  In fact for the first time I have to use tape on my nose because I'm actually getting into my anchor every time.  I've been using a DIY formaster and have no problem drawing with back tension.  My problem is that I get into my anchor, feel solid, but then feel stuck.  I want to pull through but I feel like I'm just sitting there and then letting go of the string.  I'm not torquing the string and I must be keeping the tension in my arm low because I'm getting very little windage and my arrows are hitting straight.   If I try to "never stop pulling" and not pause at least briefly I end up rushing it and I start getting right and left.  I just need some help with strategies to keep pulling through with my back. Thanks in advance.

Zane

[skilonbw]

While I ma no expert at the release. WHat I have hear and that works for me is to think of relaxing the whole forearm and fingers and the string will naturally pull out from your fingers. I think moebow on here said you could pull your string 2-3inches and then relax the hand and see what it feels like to release. The other big one I try to do occasionally is take a semi-full gallon paint can that is closed and hang from the same points on your fingers where the strings goes. Places this 6" above the ground and relax the fingers and hand. The can should slip out but not fall over if done right.

[moebow]

Zane,  Once again this is easier to show than to write -- but...

When you get to the point you describe and are ready to release/follow through, You need to continue to pull your string arm shoulder back.  The thought that works for me is to THINK "stick my chest out a little as I relax my fingers."

  This is not a real visible movement and it can really only even be seen in frame by frame video.  It is also something that will take practice to get the timing and feel correct.

Get to anchor with your good alignment, aim, begin sticking your chest out and simultaneously relax your string fingers.  You will know when you do it right if your follow through leaves your string hand on the back of your neck just below and behind your ear.

What skilonbw describes is an exercise to learn the feel and reinforce the relaxed finger release and that is important to the overall shot.

On a close blank bale get to full draw position  and just focus on relaxing your string hand as you press you shoulder back or your chest out.  See what tactic works best for you.

[McDave]

If I try to "never stop pulling" and not pause at least briefly I end up rushing it and I start getting right and left.

What you may not understand is that there can be pulling without movement of the arrow.  What Rod Jenkins calls "balanced pulling" is the pulling that occurs during your pause.  You can pause as long as you like, in fact, and continue pulling in order to avoid collapse and creeping forward of the arrow.

This is a skill that needs to be learned.  During my recent class with Rod, he noticed a slight creep when I reached anchor.  Nobody else could see it, but when he videoed me and played it back in slow motion, you could see that when I reached anchor, I relaxed very slightly, the arrow would creep forward infinitesimally, and then I would regain back tension.  I was unaware of it, but when I corrected it, my shooting improved.

After the pause, you consciously begin to increase back tension to conclusion.  The pause is important to stabilize the arrow, and adjust your sight picture, whether instinctive or gap.  When you increase back tension to conclusion, your arrow may begin to move backwards again, but not very much, as your drawing elbow is moving in a "J" shape around toward your backbone, and not directly backwards.

For most of us, the release will happen naturally, without conscious effort to relax the string hand, during this increased back tension to conclusion phase.  I know it doesn't happen naturally for some people, and I'm not sure what to advise you if you fall in that category.  But I am sure that you should be able to pause while continuing to "never stop pulling."

[TexasStick81]

I'm appreciating the feedback.  Moebow - I like the image of pushing out the chest and I seem to have difficulty with the "closing the door with the elbow" once I've paused.  McDave -  the release feels pretty natural to me if that makes since.  For the most part I don't find myself plucking the string, it's just that I don't feel I'm pulling through.  When you talk about the drawing elbow in a "J" motion what do you mean?  I've thought about pulling it directly backwards and maybe thats where I'm having trouble.

[McDave]

The "J" motion is the "closing of the door with the elbow."  When you start your draw, you're drawing the arrow back, the straight line portion of the J.  Full draw is where your shoulder blade starts to move toward your backbone.  That is when you pause.  Then there is more lateral movement of your drawing elbow in an arc around the backbone than backwards movement, which is the bottom part of the J.  At some point during this last movement, the arrow should release.

I found that my movement in the bottom part of the J was restricted because I held my drawing forearm too low, in line with the arrow.  When I raised my drawing forearm, so my elbow was higher than the arrow, it allowed me to bring my drawing arm around to complete the J.

[JamesKerr]

The best way I can feel my self pull through the shot is to come to a deep anchor and then try to pull my elbow straight back in line with my shoulder and back. This allows me to pull and release with back tension.

[Javi]

see my pm

[TexasStick81]

Javi,

Responded to your PM.

Zane

[Dan Adair]

The best way to cure these little form problems is to never talk about them on the internet  :D

Here's a couple tidbits though.  I've never really been a fan of "release problems"  I honestly don't think they exist.  Next time you're doing some blind bale, or general practice.  Try not to let the bow hand and bow arm to get "static"  Keep pushing that bowhand through the target, and have a little speech with it about how it needs to be the Iceman in the equation...  Keep it rigid and rock solid, and pushed towards the target, and if the rest of your form is good, you'll never have a release problem again.

As far as using back tension....  If you feel like you're "winging it" upon release, you're in too deep.  "Plucking" usually means you're not far enough around (provided you followed my advice on pushing with the bow hand and not getting static)

[TexasStick81]

Little update - shooting went well tonight.  I continue to feel that my draw arm is staying relaxed, I'm drawing with my back, and getting solidly into my anchor.  I do believe I'm continuing to pull or expand at release and I feel more conscious and in control of the shot.  At slightly longer distances there is an anxiety that creeps in that causes greater tension overall but I think as I just relax into the shot it will become more consistent.  Thanks for the help

[Osage61]

Originally posted by McDave:
The "J" motion......I found that my movement in the bottom part of the J was restricted because I held my drawing forearm too low, in line with the arrow.  When I raised my drawing forearm, so my elbow was higher than the arrow, it allowed me to bring my drawing arm around to complete the J.

Excellent advice!! Thanks!! I have been trying to ensure that my elbow and forearm stay down and in-line exactly with the arrow but it was restricting my movement. By raising my elbow, I now get the freedom to move much better. Thank you!  
(I thought I had to do everything to keep the arrow, wrist, forearm, elbow in perfect linear harmony       )

[Green]

Zane/Todd....I've been dealing with the same issue.  Arne taught me a rotational draw starting nose high.  This works beautifully for me to get as much back tension as I can as I draw and bring my draw hand in to anchor.  I was purposely pulling around/down and found that I couldn't get completely around either. I was trying to continue pulling/rounding into back tension but it was like I was hitting a wall and I thought my bow was stacking. At one point Arne advised I not worry too much about my elbow and I'm now able to continue to rotate with my back muscles and my shooting has once again improved.  So many details.....muuuusssstt maaassstttteeeerrr theeemmm aaallll.            

[Dan Adair]

I agree completely about the elbow.  I'd love to have that textbook perfect form with everything in a line, but my bicep gets in the way of that.  When its not high, my draw is like 26" and I'm a ways from "getting around"

But then, the last big 3D shoot I was at I took 3rd out of 100+ guys...  So I believe that you need balance in life (thanks to my buddy Troy)  Shooting a trad bow isn't rocket science...  Your brain knows how to do this.  Grip it and rip it...  That little bit of doubt that creeps in will ruin your ability far worse than minute form errors.

Work on having faith in EACH arrow you shoot and run 2 dozen good ones in a day.  It takes discipline to just put the bow up for the day when you're not feeling the love, but on those days its the best thing you can do.

I've seen guys on the circuit that do EVERYTHING wrong with 100% consistancy every time they dump the string.

[Osage61]

Originally posted by Dan Adair:
  That little bit of doubt that creeps in will ruin your ability far worse than minute form errors.  

Oh ya, don't I know it!! Lots of good advice on this forum. I went out the other day, did some blind bale stuff; did some close-up shooting to check my "feel"; then competed against my buddy and his compound bow. We both shot on the roving range from 30 yards on every bale target. He beat me 6 targets to 3 winning the "target shooting championship". When it was over I put up a brand new deer target at 30 yards on the static range and told him: one arrow each for the "bow-hunter championship". His arrow from the sighted compound bow struck the deer in the genitals. My shot is shown below after I just stared at the deer and let her go without much thinking about anything. He said to me, "bet you can't do that again." I told him, "I don't have to. The deer is dead!" We had a good laugh and wrapped up our day    
 

[Terry Green]

Originally posted by Terry Green:
[QB]
Please be aware...The elbow doesn't just 'come back farther'...it comes around in a 'J' shape.  Do not be afraid to 'cozy up' to your anchor.

       

[Dan Adair]

Originally posted by Osage61:
[  

That is an extremely dead whitetail  :D   In fact, I don't like heartshots like that because its harder to trail them if they get the death sprints with no pump station left

[TexasStick81]

Still working on getting the feel for the "J" move down but I can say I feel like I'm staying strong in my back tension through the shot.  When I don't I really can tell a difference.  Like any other physical activity, the more I regularly shoot the more it all slows down.  I feel more aware at my anchor if I am starting to creep forward, I can stop and pull through the shot.  When I've finished working on my form at a short distance I give myself a few shots where I'm trying to hit a deer's vitals.  I just get out of my head and focus on a spot.  I can tell it's starting to become more automatic.  Starting to have more fun these days.

[Dan Adair]

Keep pushing that bow hand forward, and you might also think about blind bale shooting for a couple hundred arrows just to tell your brain what to feel.

[PaddyMac]

I gave some advice to somebody about this a couple of days ago and went home and could barely land on my target, let alone the post-it note bull. Too much thinking.

I do know this though, when I do it right, it feels really good and when I do it wrong I detect a subtle little wobble or wow or wiggle in either arm right as I release. That's one of them collapsing I think. When I do get it right, the bow stays up, the string hand springs back and the arrow hits the paper and not the foam (or dirt) and it doesn't seem to matter if I'm at 15 or 30 yards. Also, I get pinch when I do it wrong and feel nothing of the sort when I put my back into it.

My head calls is "roaring". When my draw feels like I'm roaring, I am deadly. When my draw feels like "oh wait, is that up or back, don't forget to ..oh and ... " That's when I'm a danger to myself and others.