Rotational drawing technique

[njloco]

Dogboy, I use the same glove, but I am finding that it is very hard to get a truly smooth release so I went to a Damascus glove, big difference !

[Gorbin]

Thank you sir- its good to know I'm not the only one making goofy faces coming to anchor!

-Gorbin

[chromedome]

"I am shooting with a big shot glove and have tried to anchor on a tooth rather than the corner of my mouth but I can't feel my tooth through the glove".


Hey Dogboy,  I have the same problem,  and i really don't like using tabs.  What i did was to cut the tips off the fingers on my glove. Don't cut much off,  just enough so the tips of your fingers are through.  then either sew the edges or dab some super glue on  the seams so it doesn't come unstitched.  Give it a try with an old glove, if you have one.  I think you'll like the feel.    Jon

[Mazz]

Moebow,I watched your video on rotational draw,and was excited and pleased so far with the results.shooting a traditional bow for 50 yrs or so,Ive always had trouble with tp.Using this type of draw and getting into and holding with the back muscles seem to help alot.I still have to find the ideal anchor for me,and my follow through is not always complete,but I'm going to keep working at it.Thanks so much for sharing a most informing video.

 Mazz.

[moebow]

That's good to hear Mazz! The rotational draw takes some practice but it DOES work.

 TP can be a hard thing to break but the NTS (basically what I'm promoting) doesn't want you to aim until you are at full draw.  That way, you can concentrate on the form mechanics all the way to anchor.  That breaks the subconscious' ability to try to short circuit the process.  Now when you "aim" (by whatever process you use) you can allow the subconscious to execute the shot (all that's left is the release and follow through) while you are now consciously concentrating on aiming. Not everyone will agree with that but in my experience it seems to work for "most."

[Mazz]

moebow,thanks for the prompt reply.I guess I got a little over exuberent today and shot beyond twenty yards.still hard for me to find a solid anchor and holding without the subconsious taking over prematurley and end up short drawing etc. Guess I'd better take it in small steps.Do you have any particular aiming method?

[moebow]

I am unashamably a split vision/gap shooter.  If I need to I can shoot instinctively like on moving/aerial targets but am more deliberate in most shooting.

Also, when learning a new process, blank bale at very close range (5-6 feet). Concentrate on the form steps and DO NOT TRY TO HIT ANYTHING!!!!  Just use the bale to catch your arrows.  

Think ( emphasis on CONSCIOUSLY THINKING about each step) Raise the bow, draw, anchor, relax string hand, follow through.  When you have gotten totally and completely bored with that, then go to the step of aiming (still on the close bale) and put that step in AFTER anchor.  THINK and do each step through anchor then and only then look at what you want to hit, line up and let your subconscious take over.  If you regress, start over.  This is also a really good "eyes closed" exercise through the "anchor step.

DO NOT,DO NOT try to hit a distant target until you can control the steps leading to anchor!!!  this leads to falling back to the old way!  One student I had always wanted to "check" to see how he was doing by shooting at a distance.  It slowed his progress in a major way.

If you are serious about this, work this for a good month BEFORE you start "getting fancy."  It will take that long for you to convince your subconscious that you are in control!

[Duggaboy]

Moebow, perfect timing. I have actually been working on these same issues the last few days, and your vid has definitely shone some light. I've been experimenting by trying to eliminate the downward portion of the draw prior to my "back anchor", and go straight back into a hard anchor instead of down and then slightly back up to cheek bone...and it has been very inconsistant. What your demoing above has in the past felt like a little too much wasted movement and less "smooth" than I would prefer, especially in quick time hunting scenarios. But it is Definitely a more consistant method for me and I do shoot better this way...so I will continue to work at it. Thanks for your time - great stuff!

[Forn Man]

Moebow, I noticed in your video that your bow hand drops when you release.  Is that deliberate, and what value does that bring to your shot?  Thanks for offering your help to us.

[moebow]

Forn Man,  If the back is used, your bow hand will move SLIGHTLY to your left and SLIGHTLY down (right handed shooter).  I work hard on reducing that drop, but it creeps back once in a while and IS something I struggle with.  The NTS does teach (they call it a "sit down") where the bow arm stays steady and straight and at the shot the bow hand flips down.  You can see this in current top level archer's videos and their bow swings down and around, with the lower limb of the bow nearly hitting them in the chin.  I'd like to say that is what I'm doing, but it's NOT.  Just one of my flaws.    

I went back and watched the video again as I really hadn't payed much attention to the bow hand as I made this video.  I do have a couple shots where the hand drops too much, but have to say that most of them are OK.  If you watch closely ( I have the advantage of having the original and can watch it in slow motion and frame by frame)  You can see the bow jump directly towards the target then drops.  In MOST ( but not all to be sure) the arrow is well gone before the hand drops.  There is NO advantage in dropping the bow hand and usually it is a BIG no-no because it usually starts about the same time as release and has the bow moving before the arrow clears.  In any case that bow hand drop of mine is NOT intentional, it just happens for me.

[reddogge]

Moebow, I like this drawing technique but one small problem I'm having is I'm pulling the arrow off the rest half the time if I have both the bow and string hand slightly high in the beginning. I have short fingers which may be the cause and do use a deep hook.

[Forn Man]

Moebow, I appreciate the detailed reply.  I've noticed that movement in other archers before, and have wondered if it mattered or not.  I can't imagine an action like a drawn bow, with all the stored energy in your body, and then having no movement in one arm when all the weight is released at once.

[Sirius Black]

Great video! Thank you. I have taken to drawing my bow this way, and I really do feel my back muscles engage sooner than with a straight-line pull. My shoulder is thanking me too!

[moebow]

reddogge, The trick to that is covered in my video on "release tips."  Look especially closely at the segment where I show and talk about that wrist! Relax the wrist and the wrist will bend your hand in toward you (your wrist will bend out).  When you start to draw, the weight of the string will straighten your wrist which will actually turn your fingers in a clockwise direction ( for right handers).  That turn will rotate the arrow against the bow naturally.  It is not something you have to do if you set up correctly.

Forn Man,  That is right.  you cannot stay still as a bronze statue ( it would be nice) but you WILL react to that energy release in some fashion.  The trick is to react as close to the same way EVERY time as possible.

Sirius Black,  This form (BEST/NTS) has been studied very closely and scientifically and it has been determined that it is as good as it gets for REDUCING injuries common to archery.  There is NO way to eliminate injury if you are doing anything at all but REDUCING injury to any degree has to be a plus.

All,  Thank you for all the kind comments They are all appreciated!  I hope you are seeing the relation between the "release tips" and Rotational draw" videos.  They are a package deal!

[trad_in_cali]

Thank you, this is (as always) really informative.
Marco

[Okie man]

I watched the video at least 5 times. I am a little slow but I finally understood what you were telling me.  It is really helping with my back tension and that is something I have been working on with mixed results for a long time. Thank you so much for taking the time to post this video.

[fmscan]

Arne,
Saying Thank You gets old after a while. I am a guy who followed your instruction on practice form ONLY w blind baleing. Then when you have the right form, enjoy shooting. It has paid dividends and I enjoy shooting more than I ever thought I would. I think your new vid. will help more w the finer points of higher elbow. Here I go again Thank You.

[statedriller]

A big thank you to moebow...  I've been using this rotational draw and it has helped me immensely...

[tuxdad]

Great vid !!

I have to ask, and hope this doesn't come across wrong.. Are you mouthing your odd feather as part of your anchoring ??

I'm still trying to get confident with shooting my bow for hunting with my longbow, but for now I'm shooting my recurve with a single pin for hunting season.. Not wanting to wound an animal if I can help it..

Thanks,

Tux

[moebow]

Tux,  No, I'm not.  That is a totally unconscious "foible" that I have -- looks stupid doesn't it.

Most coaches will tell  you that we don't really like the word "anchor" very well ( the word implies a stopping point).  The real "anchor" is the bones in alignment and the back muscles engaged.  The "references" that I use on the face are the "C" of my hand cupping the rear of the jaw bone, the base knuckle of the index finger pressed FIRMLY (hard) into and under the cheek bone below the eye and the middle finger in the corner of the mouth.  What works for you may be different but you need to find a repeatable reference for you.   Some do use the feather as a reference and it works well for some of them.

Sights have been used in one form or another for about as long as we've (humans) shot bows and arrows.  Absolutely NOTHING wrong with it!  If it helps you put the arrow on target, that's really all that counts.