Untuneable Bow? Consistently to the left and high nock point? Help!

[DaneGerous]

Hi there everyone,

I've got a problem that I can't seem to solve on my own or by looking through past threads, so I thought I would reach out for some much needed help, before I go completely insane or buy a new bow!

I shoot a Samick phantom 55lbs @ 28". My draw length is 27.5" so I am probably nearer to 53 lbs, but I don't have access to a bow scale. I have been shooting for about a year and began with 40 lb limbs so I could focus on form and then moved up once things seemed in good order.

I recently began the arrow tuning process only to be completely stymied.

I began using 3rivers traditonal only arrows with a 400 spines cut to 29 inches and 145 gram points, but no matter what size point I placed on them (90 to 250 grams) they always bare shafted to the left and low (stiff & high nock point). I switched to the 500 spines and same problem. Then I tried paper tuning and same problem. I have tried all the tricks I could find, starting with a high nock point moving down slowly, adjusting brace height, etc but nothing changed. In frustration I tried bare shafts through paper as a way to check to make sure that it wasn't a clearance problem. I don't know if this is an excepted method , but I thought it would work and the result was that both spine arrows consistently leave tears with the point left and down. The only difference is that the 500 spine tear is about 3" in length whereas the 400 spine tear is about 4".

I thought about my form and though I don't claim it is perfect I can't find anything consistently wrong with it that would lead to this problem.

Any insight into what would make a bow shoot like this would awesome!

Thanks

Dane

[DaneGerous]

One more thing: I have noticed over the time that I have shot with fletched arrows that if there is anything wrong with my form my arrows tend to hit left on the target.

Also the 500 spines are cut to 29.5" And it probably goes with out saying but they should be to weak for my setup at least by what the arrow charts tell me...

[SAVIOUR68]

Tell us more about the side plate/rest material on this bow and also the nock height on the bow.
Do you have 2 nock points on the string above and below the arrow ?
During your bareshafting you are testing with bareshafts to flectched shafts correct ?
I would think that this bow is cut past center 3/16 it may like a stiffer arrow.
With your arrow length at 29-29.5 i would guess 250-300 gr up frt.

[DaneGerous]

I have 2 nock points, I have gone through a progression of nock heights starting at 7/8 and dropping down  way lo to  0", and seeing no real change. I usually have the brace height at 8 1/2" to 8 5/8", which seems the smoothest, but I also tried as high as 8 15/16" and at 8 7/8". I shoot with split fingers two under one over.  

The rest and plate are the ones that came with the bow. (Very similar to the bear hair rest and plate on 3rivers) The Plate is a leather patch with a small bulge pushing the arrow out about a 1/16" of an inch.

Yes to your question about bare shafting.

I have been shooting with a field point test kit with a range of 90 to 250 grams.

You think stiffer than a 400?

I hae lloked over the bow and don't see any twisted limbs or other noticeable deformities. I have some heritage express 90 which I could try just to see what happens but they shoudl be way to weak?

[SAVIOUR68]

Well just the 500/400s should work fine its just finding your correct setup.
Couple things to try is to remove your current strike plate and build it out slightly more and change to a softer material such as velcro.
Try the 500s  with 175 grs up frt and recheck bareshafts, keep adding weight to see if you can get a weak reading from the 500s.
I think the 400s will work but you will need alot of weight up frt .
Shooting split finger i would think a nock height of 3/8n to 1/2 would be acceptable.
You are right handed correct ?

[Siewho]

I would suggest checking the actual poundage with a scale. Marked weights on bow might not translate to actual #. From what you are describing they are still too stiff.

[DaneGerous]

Yes right handed. I'll see what I got to remake the strike plate. Thanks for the all the tips

Dane

[ivoryhunter]

All good possibilities mentioned, I have never had good luck with the 2 nock points for some reason, I currently shoot 3 under with a nock point above.In the past when shooting split fingers, I could get good arrow flight with several different shafts and a single nock point but the flight and noise were bad when I added the second nock.

Tony

[DaneGerous]

Sorry for the delay on replying, but it took awhile to get to a bow shop and get things straightened out, and then I had to go moose hunting!

I got some 400 shafts cuts about 3/4 longer and with two knock points i was able to get pretty good arrow flight, not absolutely perfect but very acceptable. Ended  up getting the moose with the rifle, but got three grouse with the bow. Thanks for all the help to everyone who posted.

Dane

[gonefishing600]

Sounds like you need too invest in an arrow saw!

[Yogah]

raise your knock till the up down goes away. then move/build up your side plate till the left right goes away or use a harder material on your side plate. If that does not fix the problem then it is your grip. I can make a paper hole move up down left or right just by changing the grip. That is why I believe walkback tuning is the only thing that matters...ie. where is your arrow hitting the target.Look at some arrow paradox videos and see how much your arrow is flexing. This alone would tell me not to make too much weight on paper holes.

[moththerlode]

Does your 3rd finger noticeably come into play where finger pressure is concerned ? This is my one of my largest obstacles when it comes to shooting left and nock high.