Desperate for your help!

[Paradox.c.moron]

Hi folks!  I'm new to the forum and forums in general so bear with me.

I am really struggling and can't figure out what is wrong.  I am shooting uncut GT 3555 expedition hunters from a Ben Pearson cougar at #40 with a 100 gr brass insert and 100 gr tip.  Drawing 28", split fingers with a tab anchored with my index finger to the corner of my mouth and thumb hooking my jaw.

For the life of me I can't figure out why my shots are impacting high (8-10" at 20 yds and 4-5"at 5 yds).  I have adjusted nock hight and tried anchoring with middle finger to corner of mouth and it still hits high,  even tried different bows.  I have been shooting for months and thought my subconscious would have corrected this by now.  What am I doing wrong?

Sounds like it's time to take control of the situation--for a while.  Bob Wesley teaches (In Indirect Aiming) to put a pie plate (somewhere) below the target where the tip of the arrow is in the center it while hitting the center of the mark. Always concentrate on the mark and see the plate and tip in your periphery.  Start at about 10 yards, then back up and move the plate. It won't take long for you mind to get the idea.  :^)

[olddogrib]

PCM, If you're pulling a true #40 at your draw length I'd try .600 spine. You did good to leave the .500's full length and you've got lots of weight up front, so I won't say they're necessarily stiff.  But I will share this, I  shoot .500's, 29", with 175gr. and was going to experiment with a heavier arrow for hunting season. Bare shafting indicated I'd need 250+ up front to tame them.  the odd thing was they impacted way high, even with a high nock set. But the stiff shafts had an obvious ricochet effect off the shelf, no matter where I moved it. Just something you might try.  If you need a few, PM me.  I always keep some for tuning.

[McDave]

If you're impacting high and grouping, then you're doing just fine.  If you have occasional high hits or skattered high hits, then it's probably one or more form issues.  I wouldn't worry too much about arrow spine at this point.  Your setup can't be that far off.

If you're grouping high, then I would either take Jim's advice or if you're determined to remain an instinctive shooter, just bear with it until the ol' mental computer makes the necessary adjustments.  If you're not grouping, then you need a class or coach to help you improve your form.  Or, send us a video for Arne to analyze for you.

[ANick]

Tuning matters, so keep that pursuit active.  As not much more than a semi-illiterate novice trad archer I have found myself in similar straits.  I have some 500s that are decently tuned for my 45 - 48 lb bows.  I also picked up some 600s as a sanity check on those same bows as my draw length and the bow weight puts the arrow selection on the edge of the selection charts.

The 600s didn't help that much on the 45-48 bows, however, they turned out very nice for my 35 - 40 lb bows.  Tuned by Lady Luck, on my 40 lb. Bear #3 T/D limbs (A riser), they shoot like a .22 squirrel rifle, or as close to that as I currently shoot.

Until I stumbled onto that combination, I was fully in the limbo land where consistency and accurate do not coexist.  Bareshaft wasn't really showing me anything consistently different, I could 'sometimes' group 3 and too, I got to the point where if I pulled or pushed the shot, I was aware of it.  

I got out the video camera for form observation.  
Oh duh.  
Shooting close at a ground target, I'm standing straight, bow arm is pointing down to the target and my string arm is pointing up at the clouds. Squaring up the back and arms and then bending at the waist helps.  I continue to battle the bad habit, but keeping that part fixed is helping Mr. Consistency.

The video also let me look at my release, which seems decent enough, and my follow through... which.. no.  No, it does not look at all decent.  Does, or did, is being worked on.  It is now another point in my 'sequence', after the release, to ask 'self', "Where is the bow pointing?"

I probably still have some things to fix with what's going on the string, but I have more, bigger things to work on behind the string.  

Set up the video to see how you are doing, it is a little surprising the difference between what you think and what you are.  

G'luck
Nick

[Paradox.c.moron]

"Just bear with it until the ol' mental computer makes the necessary adjustments."

Ok, yes I truely do want to get to the point of instinctive.  I am willing to put in the time.  Now if I just bear with it how long should I continue the same thing before I should worry something is really wrong?  Thanks

[mahantango]

Listen to McDave. If you are grouping consistently, you're OK. At the risk of getting bashed by the  instinctive crowd, try paying attention to where your arrow tip is pointing in relation to your group, then lower it just like the sights on a rifle. I've found that new shooters progress much quicker with some form of gap shooting because it gives them a frame of reference to make adjustments. Later on instinct and muscle memory take over and the gaps become less conscious.

Originally posted by mahantango:
... try paying attention to where your arrow tip is pointing in relation to your group, then lower it just like the sights on a rifle. I've found that new shooters progress much quicker with some form of gap shooting because it gives them a frame of reference to make adjustments. Later on instinct and muscle memory take over and the gaps become less conscious.

Exactly.  Just take control of the situation for a while and it will all come along--quickly.

[gonefishing600]

Originally posted by Jim Casto Jr:
Sounds like it's time to take control of the situation--for a while.  Bob Wesley teaches (In Indirect Aiming) to put a pie plate (somewhere) below the target where the tip of the arrow is in the center it while hitting the center of the mark. Always concentrate on the mark and see the plate and tip in your periphery.  Start at about 10 yards, then back up and move the plate. It won't take long for you mind to get the idea.  :^)

Huh?

Originally posted by gonefishing600

Huh? [/QB][/QUOTE]

Perhaps Mr. Wesley can describe it better for you.

  https://weshood.wordpress.com/category/aiming/

[bigbuckmalik]

This may not be your problem but i will tell you what i deal with. If i start grouping high, i slow down and make sure i am putting most of the pressure with my string hand on my middle finger. It always seems to bring me back down and hit where i look. I do this by wrapping my middle finder around the string first and then the other two. Worth a try...

[Paradox.c.moron]

Alright guys just for an update.  First of all thanks for all the help/replies!  I have followed the concept that Jim shared from Bob Wesley and I think it is working!  Granted at only 5 yds or so I am hitting within 3" of my POA consistently.  Where before it was more like 8" high and 2" left.  That's a pretty big difference in my eyes and it seems with practice I will be able to dial it in even further.  Also, I finally got some GT TRAD WGs with a 600 spine.  Bare shaft ing with a 125 gr field point is much closer to "tuned" than I have been able to get before.  Thanks Grib for giving me the push to spend the dough.  I am excited again about the prospects.  Thanks all.