Target Panic- Please Participate

[McDave]

Originally posted by BWallace10327:
I don't disagree Mcdave, but I do agree with some points you've raised more than others.  I submit that only some personalities are susceptible to target panic, and if those types encounter an anxiety inducing factor, such as a hard to control bow-overbowed- they will become frustrated. I'd be willing to wager that these types of people are not easily deterred, and may not know when its time to quit.  They will keep shooting the too-heavy bow until they have bad physical habits, bad metal habits, thereby giving rise to target panic.
 So, I cannot conclusively say that heavy bows definitely do or do not cause target panic, but rather an unfortunate  interaction with the right type of person nudges them in the wrong direction.

Totally agree with everything you've said.  I could apply the same words to obsessive practice that you've applied to being over-bowed.  What you're describing is MY personality.  I believed that by practicing X amount, I should be able to achieve Y results.  Could be the same with heavy bows (which wasn't my thing):  by putting in X amount of time pulling heavy bows, I should be able to be proficient in shooting Y bow weight.  What I needed to learn is that with trad bows, we have an opportunity to enjoy the execution of a beautiful movement, at whatever level of proficiency we have, without an expectation of increasing that level of proficiency by a defined amount in a certain period of time, even though we constantly strive to get better.  I think the disappointments that inevitably happen when one has unrealistic expectations are certainly a factor in bringing on target panic, at least I believe it was with me.

What I would not like to do is to discourage anyone from exploring heavy bows, if that's the direction they feel motivated to explore, for fear of developing target panic.  I would encourage them to do it as safely as possible, the same as I would if they were beginning motorcyclists, recognizing that both activities involve risks, and as long as people understand the risks, they are free to decide to accept them.

I have referred to one friend before, but.    If you would watch him shoot now, you would say that he does not have TP.  Can he hold a bow back for 4 seconds and still have a good release?  NO.   He bought a recurve, then he went to an archery shop to buy arrows.  They gave him a pvc pipe with a bow string and a captive yard stick, to measure his draw.   The guy told him 'you are not stretched out yet pull, pull further.'   He ended up with full length 2317s with 125 grain points for a 54 pound recurve.  He was told that he should have a 31 inch draw, he is 5' 10" tall.   His efforts to make those arrows fly,  frustrated the hell out of him.   He came to me for help, I use to shoot lots of target bows, but I only teach one shooting style for hunters, John Schulz.   It is my choice and I am sticking to it.  He learned it very quickly, but then later, he got online and read about long holds and all kinds of other things.  It all got his wires crossed and he could not come to anchor..   One day he tried something just the same but way different. He took those 2317s, they never did work and they for sure were not going to work out of his new, my old, longbow.   He went out to his concrete silo and proceeded to blast them as hard as he could into his silo.  The effect of destroying those arrows until they were unshootable allowed him to get to anchor.  He still could not hold for four seconds and hit my deer target, but he didn't care.  He outshot me, shooting with the same one second tempo as John Schulz.  He said that when he visualizes shooting a deer, that is the shot that he has in his head and that is the shot that he is going to take.   Trying to do anything else messes up that visualization.   Part of the form is being on target when approaching and reaching anchor, it needs to be practiced separately when things are off.   For some, forcing a hold after anchor is simply not in the programming.   If someone is consistently shooting good out to 30, maybe there is nothing to fix, then possibly a maintenance routine of keeping the individual pieces and parts of the total form in working order is all that is required.  He has become a very successful bowhunter.

[ChuckC]

My own personal feelings regarding a certain aspect of target panic, inability to get to full draw, or hold at all for anchor, is that it might be exacerbated by a quick, Hill style of shooting where there is no real separation of steps and where you are pre-aiming.  

As you ( McDave) stated earlier, many, maybe most of those with that sort of target panic can easily draw to anchor and hold if they close their eyes, or if they are not focusing on a target.  Put that aim in the picture and your brain takes over ( for some....).

Separating the steps in draw / aim / release cycles goes a long way toward helping, IMO.

I believe, in all cases, target panic is simply the brain taking over a portion of the shooting cycle and not allowing your conscious mind to perform what it knows darned well it can do.

Why ?  Who knows.  Why is a friend an alcoholic, or an addict ( ANY kind... drugs, other things) and I am not ( yet) ?  There are folks who are hard wired and more apt to develop a certain situation.  If a person never had alcohol, no matter the genes, they would not become an alcoholic... something else maybe, I'm not smart enough to know.

Regarding cures.  What is a cure ?  I switched to lefty and have no target panic.  None.  Didn't from the very first shot.  I am working very diligently to keep it that way.  

Am I cured ?   I still can't easily draw to full anchor rightie, even with a 35# bow ( I try every once in a while).

They say that the right side of your brain controls the left side of your body, and vice versa.  I guess I am in my right mind now ( lefty).
ChuckC

What worked for me and a couple of my local friends was the eye closing routine, followed by a quiver full of arrows and a large empty field with an open sky.  It goes from a 'yes I can' mode, to 'of course i can' mode.   It is a rewiring, a shut down of improper mental tension.  If one can keep their skepticism under control, a variety of things can hit that 'see the light' switch.  Mandating one form style or  another is not really part of it.   Some shooting styles can work around it in one way or another.  If one can get to anchor but cannot hold, the Hill style can help with that.  If you cannot get to anchor, perhaps a clicker will control the explosion.  In the long run a different pathway needs to be developed so that crossed wire that causes the explosion needs to be like a memory that no longer has an overwhelming   influence.

[crazynate]

Pavan. I liked that link you posted for that video.I used to fling arrow after arrow not thinking much  at all and I didn't improve on accuracy even after 4 years.  Once I read Archery Insights by J. Kidwell  my routine began to change and I started  to learn through accelerated learning as he describes in his book. Not only did his teachings cure my target panic it gave my a way better understanding of how the brain works in relation to doing a task like archery.If you could learn with 2 arrows what normally would take 80 by USING trajectory feedback  that's accelerated learning and IT WORKS.  This video reminded me a lot of his teaching because it really is HOW we practice and what actions we take in our shooting that makes us better. I can consistently group arrows within 5" @40yards now. It is amazing. To anyone struggling with ANY form of target panic or anyone that wants to improve on their skills I suggest that book.

[BWallace10327]

Dr. Kidwell's book is on my very short list of soon-to-reads.  The way he approaches things align with how I like to do things and his being a psychologist and my being a psych major graduate make me appreciate how he depicts things associated with brain/body/behavior that much more.

[Draven]

True

[Draven]

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