water buffulo with a selfbow and stone points, now with testing results

[Don Thomas]

Of course it CAN be done. But that's not the point, or it shouldn't be. No problem with the selfbow, but stone points have too much unpredictable variability to be a good choice in this situation. Even the best knapper can't tell exactly what a given point will do when it hits a hard rib. Shooting a bison under controlled conditions doesn't really mean much. If things go south, just roll it over and go home. But wild buffalo are dangerous animals. Shatter a stone head on a rib and you may cost some innocent bystander his life a month down the line. It's not worth it just to prove a point (no pun intended). Asiatic buffalo are tough enough with the best steel heads. if you don't believe me, ask Ed Ashby. Cheers, Don

[knife river]

As the guy who made the point that Andy pictured, I have serious reservations about the effectiveness of stone points on water buffalo.  Stone is incredibly sharp, but that sharpness comes from it's brittle nature.  I think it would penetrate the tough hide easily enough, but not the overlapping ribs.  My feeling is that it would break in one or more different ways.

Another problem with stone points is that the hafting area has a cross-section that's appreciably thicker than on steel broadheads.  That heavier cross-section might inhibit penetration.

My $0.02's worth.

[NorthernCaliforniaHunter]

No sir, wouldn't do it! There's always bungee jumping if you need that kind of adrenaline! Now if you do attempt such a crazy thing, please film it! Oh, and do have a tall tree to climb nearby, o.k.? I don't care to see YOUR blood!  

[ozy clint]

okay can anyone show me a cross sectional photo of some ribs and where they sit in relation to each other.

[Benny Nganabbarru]

You could always try it on a cow buffalo first. I'd be happy to come along on the walk with the .416 incase things don't work-out. Sorry, I don't have a photo of the ribs.

[ozy clint]

yeah, if it doesn't work out.... shoot me!  

[ozy clint]

[hunt it]

I'd be more afraid of the 80# self bow blowing up and taking your head off!    

No offense Rick, but that little .416 Rem is one notch up from a self bow if one them critters is comin atya. You can borrow my .458 Lott and getr done.

[Bob Sarrels]

To me that point is kinda like the piece of rock candy on Josie Wales   "its not for eatin,  its just for lookin thru".

[calgarychef]

I suspect that in ancient times the ribs weren't the target for bows.  A gutshot animal can be tracked until it drops, especially if you're as skilled a stracker as some bush people are.  It just seems to make sense to shoot for the softest part of the animal with that kind of setup.

the chef

[TomMcDonald]

I'll agree that testing on a freshly downed buff is the way to go.
Don't let romanticism get you trampled or get a buffalo unnecessarily injured.

[josef2424]

It would be interesting to see what happens. Go for it! And as already said....FILM IT.


.......heheheh

[ozy clint]

okay you knappers, show me what point you would use. i'm thinking more of a rounded point.

[knife river]

If you want a stone point that's in line with Doc Ashby's research, you might think about something like this.  It split the femur of a 100 lb hog and kept going.  The damage to the point was minimal and may have occurred when it exited the hog.  I think it weighs about 270.

 

[tradtusker]

Woody i remember seeing that single bevel head at the sweat and thinking how on earth can someone make a single bevel stone broadhead! Outstanding sir!
as i said before if there is anyone that could knapp a head that could bring down a Buff it is you!

[otis.drum]

Rick,
thats a great and practical idea there.
nothing will give a more precise indication on how it will go than trying it on a real buff just downed.

Clint,
you've got me keen for a go at this selfy stone and stick buff challenge. your going to have to come back over here and get it done so i can have a go. don't want to steal yyour thunder so i'll let you go first.

clint i saw somewhere blokes learning to nap flint. they used porcelin from toilets (new one that broke in transport not old ones).  they used pieces from the toilet tank walls as they are thin and flat.  good cheap way to get a handle on it before heading off into the bush for some flint.

otis...

[JohnV]

Using a knapped head on dangerous game that is  difficult to penetrate does not seem like a good idea to try.  Seems like an unacceptable safety risk to both the shooter and back up gun.

[Benny Nganabbarru]

I have to disagree on the risk being unacceptable, John. Sure, there is a risk there, but it is an acceptable one, provided the back-up has a good amount of trigger time on heavy calibres against heavy animals (pick me, pick me!).

One thing I will concede, though, is that to be a good back-up, you really do need lots of experience with the heavy stuff, so that it is second nature. You can't hand a back-up rifle to a fellow who's shot a few pigs and goats with a .243 and feel too safe and secure.

[hunt it]

Your dead on, on that one Ben. If it is attempted one would be wise to choose a mate with lotts of experience and a .458Lott to boot.

[ozy clint]

you might have to come hunting with me ben. you've got a .416