ashbys arrow

[Andy Cooper]

Sooo, is anyone shooting as much as 500 grains up front? Seems like there would have to be a point of diminishing returns. There certainly is with big bore rifles. At what point does weight up front affect velocity so much that it is no longer worth adding?

[calgarychef]

Andy that's been thouroughly discussed in other threads.  I'm particularily interested in what specific shafts have worked well for others using high EFOC.

[Rattus58]

Showing my ignorance as well... I'm using wood arrows and learning to taper and trim to bring spine into range and weight down from 1000 plus grains to around 700. FOC on this is totally dependent on the broad head with straight taper, rear taper and shaft diameter otherwise. Barrel taper, I'm assuming that is what front and rear is,cancels FOC.

I'm doing this for grins mostly because the shaft is so heavy to start with, that to move the moment forward is really difficult without putting a half pound weight up front... which...        

But here is what I'm trying to improve on... and that is penetration. I'm finishing up today in a target to test penetration with a tapered shaft forward... which so far seems to be an improvement... but so far that is just an impression... which in my case sometimes is its own reality...        

It is interesting to me on the spine issue of EFOC... which I'll probably never have to worry about with wood shafts, but I'd think that the more weight, the heavier spine shaft. Now when i used to fuss with aluminum, you could get good spine with wider diameter shafts that were very light... over 100 grains against my 2219's.

This wider diameter, might counter increased penetration ability of EFOC a tad, but with the right broadhead might not be significant. Ive had great luck with 700 grain plus arrows over the years with on a couple of occasion, length through length penetration.

Aloha...    

[Rattus58]

quote:Originally posted by Andy Cooper:
Ok, showing my ignorance, but that is nothing new for me. Why do weak-spined arrows with the side plate built out work better for this application than stiffer arrows in a closer to center-shot bow?      

Aloha...    :cool:    

[Andy Cooper]

Originally posted by calgarychef:
Andy that's been thouroughly discussed in other threads.  I'm particularily interested in what specific shafts have worked well for others using high EFOC.

Ok, I'll do a search. I'm currently working up EFOC arrows using AD Hammerheads. I have yet to be able to add enough weight to get the Heavyweights to fly well outta my 69# Eaglewing, but 400 grains up front does pretty well with the HH Trads, FWIW. Haven't used any of them on game yet.

[JimB]

If you really want the most FOC you can get,you have to start with the lightest GPI shaft you can find,in the spine you need.That's why I mentioned the Victory V Force shafts.I've been playing with this for 4 years and it's the best I have been able to come up with.

[Andy Cooper]

Originally posted by JimB:
If you really want the most FOC you can get,you have to start with the lightest GPI shaft you can find,in the spine you need.That's why I mentioned the Victory V Force shafts.I've been playing with this for 4 years and it's the best I have been able to come up with.

Given the amount of weight that can be stacked on the business end of an arrow, why does 1-2 gpi matter that much? All of my bows are center shot or cut past center. I'm not too interested in building out the windows on them. What am I missing?

[calgarychef]

You're missing the point about having the weight on the end of the arrow not on the shaft.  

I don't like the idea of building out the window either, it's only necessary because there aren't shafts stiff enough to take that amound of front weight.

[Andy Cooper]

CC,

That's what I'm trying to understand. There are .200 shafts available, but they're heavy, compared to the 7 and less gpi shafts. They weigh 2-5 gpi more than the lightweights, but they'll also take quite a bit more weight up front.

[JimB]

When adding a lot of weight up front,you can quickly get an arrow way heavier than you may like.

Also,as you get into the upper levels of FOC,reducing weight on the rear of the arrow by X grains has way more effect than the same amount of grains would on the front.When FOC gets in the high 20% range,10 grs removed from the rear of the arrow can be the equivalent of 40 grs added to the front.

The farther the balance point moves forward,the more pronounced this affect is.You can't get to the highest levels of FOC without keeping the rear of the arrow as light as possible.

[Andy Cooper]

Ok, I understand that. I'm not, though, convinced that I need to get the very max FOC to have a reliable and deadly combination. The Hammerhead shafts are heavy, but I really like them. I'll gladly settle for a bit less FOC, as long as I can keep it @ 20+%.  

Andy

[Friend]

Confidence is 90%.

[Andy Cooper]

Originally posted by Friend:
Confidence is 90%.

Absitively!

[187BOWHUNTER]

Im thinkin of puttin 315g bh on a 400g shaft for about a 725g complete arrow for pig huntin, is this too heavy for a 50# bow? I a real noob to trads

[JimB]

I shoot 700 gr arrows out of 50-55# bows and they work really well.

[Andy Cooper]

My 50# bows are quiet as a church mouse with arrows in the 700 grain range.

[parr]

I know everyone uses carbon nowadays (me too) but another option I have been playing with involves putting a 6 inch tapered laminated  birch shaft inside aluminum shafts.  I just cut the 6 inch piece, taper the broadhead end, glue on a field point and put it in an electric drill - putting the field point in the drill.  I then use 60 grit belt sander paper in my gloved hand to reduce the diameter to a size that just fits in the aluminum shaft.  I hot melt it in then remove the field point and glue on a broadhead.  I have used 2314, 2315, 2317 and 2419 shafts depending on the spline I need.  I think the wood shafts were either 11/32 or 23/64 but don't remember exactly.  The wooden dowels are about 110 grains and are easily removed.  The greatly strengthen the end of the arrow and give a large FOC.  The 2419's are stiff enough for nearly any bow.