Waterbuffalo Setup Advice

[pdk25]

That is true unless it is a different type of steel than is used in the standard inserts.

[pdk25]

I guess those other posts/pics made it up before I made my reply.  Interesting setup, Clint.  Let us know how it works out for you.

[hybridbow hunter]

Clint, standard adaptaters flex upon hard impact because metal used is soft. With those type of hard steel insert it never happens and when an external alum footing is used along it is extremely strong,arrow is virtually unbreakable for several shots, at least against plain concrete with a low 60+# @31+" Border hex6 bb2 bow like yours, as I couldn't get a shot to buff at this time   :(  
The set up you show is interesting though but very heavy point !!

[Muz1970]

Hi Txnrog, I'm curious if you've settled on a arrow set up for your Buff trip. I'm in exactly the same vote as you. With the same poundage longbow and draw and I've got a 5 week trip planned in Sept/Oct chasing Boars and Buff.

I've been tuning full length Goldtip Traditional shafts in 75/95(300). I'm using the Outback 220 FE broadheads, 100gn brass insert, 3 x 50gn weights and 5" of 2213 footing for 520grains up front. This gives me 26.5% FOC and 910gn total weight.

Adjusting the length of the footing once I got the weight up front I wanted was the only way I could tune the spine. Due to the fact that I cannot shorten the 32" arrow length.

I really like the idea / concept of Ozy Clints super adaptors. It would also give you the opportunity to shorten your arrows if required for tuning.

Cheers Muz

[Txnrog]

I'm still working on it. Just got a pair of 66# A&H limbs and a riser and was at the shop last night playing with it. Getting pretty good performance out of it.

Got Gold Tip Kenetic 200's shooting well with it and 300gr heads. I am also ordering some Easton FMJ big game 250's to play with - I like those slick narrow shafts.  

I really like the insert on the Gold tip's but they are aluminum (they also fit the Easton FMJ's) - talking to a guy about having some similar machined with steel and an extended length to act as an internal footing, Then going with an external aluminum footing.

I want the FMJ's but with their gpi weight, think I am ultimately going to have to go with the lighter, stiffer gold tips to get the FOC without creating lawn darts in the process.

Shooting for 800gr or so, but we'll see what works- my 915 gr CX 350's dropped about 2 ft @ 15yrds compared to the 720 +/- Goldtip 200's - which zipped out quicker than my deer/elk setups.

Muz - good to know that 5" of footing can have that big an impact on spine.

[Muz1970]

I found that for every inch of footing I could add approximately 50 grains in point weight. The 300's bare shafted at 250 grains with out a footing. I can also shoot them at 400 grains with 3" of footing. And like I said they shoot great at 520 grains with 5".
The extra penetration from the 910 grains verses the 780 grain arrow shot into the end of a tight bale of hay is sum 4-6". I've only shot them out to 15 yards but are spot on. Now I have to make a matched field point set to practice with.
Not that it matters but I'm curious to find out the arrow speed out of my bow at that weight.  Will hopefully borrow a mates chrono.

[hybridbow hunter]

Googleing a bit you can find in USA strong steel custom insert not that pricey:

  http://traditionalarcherysolutions.bubbaspc.com/traditionalarcherysolutions/shopping.asp

[hybridbow hunter]

Double post

[Txnrog]

Originally posted by hybridbow hunter:
Googleing a bit you can find in USA strong steel custom insert not that pricey:

   http://traditionalarcherysolutions.bubbaspc.com/traditionalarcherysolutions/shopping.asp  

Just placed an order - eyeing getting something like Ozzy Clint's made as well.

[ozy clint]

i would sell them but i think it would be too niche a market. mine work for my choice of BH and shaft. change either and the dimensions of the adapter might not be optimal for different shafts or heads. i wanted the best i could get for my setup. to have a more universal adapter will mean comprimises.

even spine differences between axis shafts means the 1st step needs to be a different diameter to suit the OD of the shaft.

it's something that needs to be custom made.

impossible to come up with a totally universal one while having the most optimised design for any given combo of BH and shaft.
what's the point of going to the trouble of making bombproof buff arrows if it isn't the best design possible.

[Txnrog]

Well, I am not totally set yet, but probably pretty darn close.

Goldtip Kenetic 200's (.200 spine)
100 gr insert
250 gr head
7 inches of xx75 2016 footing

dummied up the insert with screw in weights to practice while I have some steel ones made - half-in-half out screw ins. I really like the idea of a screw in since it gives me some optionality and is a bit easier to travel with.

A tad over 800gr total weight.

Would like to be at 300gr on the broadhead, giving 850gr total weight, but I'm a tad weak with those, and the 250's fly like darts. Could always go a tad longer on the footing, but that feels like overkill to me. Pretty decent selection of broadheads at 250 as well (abowyer, VPA, etc.)

[ozy clint]

which bow are you shooting that out of? that's an amazingly stiff arrow, .200 with 7" footing.

[Txnrog]

66lb A&H ACS but I am probably getting more like 70lbs out of it at my draw length.

Correction xx75 2013 footing

[Fanto]

Have you read Ashby? He is the no.1 authority on these matters.

His internal footing is a 7" long 1/4" Ida dowel, sanded down a little from the middle back, glued in  behind the insert and only glued the first 3.5"

[calgarychef]

I agree with Clint that arrow is darned stiff, if you're determined to use them I'd shorten the footing and go with more upfront weight.  I've got 63# ACS and shoot 350 carbon heritage express, 100 gr. inserts, 350 gr heads (I think, it's been awhile and I'd have to weigh them to be sure) and footings are about 1 1/2"

Have you bare shafted them and tested your  groups? Don't forget that arrow flight trumps everything, and an arrow that looks like its flying nicely might not be striking nicely.

[Txnrog]

Bare shafted them before even putting feathers on and building a full set. Fly like darts - if I put a 300 gr head on them, they fly weak. I was surprised too, but it is what it is. I am drawing to 30in, so it definately adds a bit of oomph behind them.

Grouping is so-so, but I am still working myself into the bow. Group fine when I do my part. The A&H shoots to the right on me, but I understand that's a common problem since they are more center cut than most.

I am getting 170fps or so, actually want to get the arrow weight up a bit, but think it'd require me to extend the footing even moreso to do it.

[calgarychef]

Did you shoot some with feathers and some bare at the same time?  Or all bare?  If you're shooting to the right something is haywire, an ACS should definitely shoot where its looking unless you've been shooting bows with no or minimal cutout.  Do you mind my asking how tall you are?

[Al Kidner]

What sort of total arrow weight are you running with that set up Clint?

[Al Kidner]

G'day Tracey, I'm still coming to CA in June mate !

[ozy clint]

they are around 1075gr at the moment. Yet to finish tuning.