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Author Topic: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940  (Read 3245 times)

Offline CrookedStick

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #20 on: April 02, 2009, 05:11:00 PM »
Wade,

I am going to try to copy that clip tonight and get it on this thread. There is another bit of trivia...I remember fondling a bow that Floyd said Errol Flynn used in Robin Hood. Maybe he was pulling my leg, but I had no reason to doubt it.  I thought that was almost as cool as sitting in Fred's chair.

Now I need to work out a trade with a guy in Nebraska for something that has a bit more significance than 'my butt was in Fred's chair'.

Bernie

Offline TonyW

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #21 on: April 02, 2009, 06:10:00 PM »
Wade -

Is that the official "Poop and Young" recordholder clock?

Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #22 on: April 02, 2009, 06:36:00 PM »
Bernie,

The supposed "1938 Robin Hood Bow" is a very lengthy story. Boy, I almost don’t know where to start on the subject. Like you Floyd told me the bow was used by Errol Flynn in the 1938 Robin Hood Movie. There were two plates screwed to the bow that indicated that also. Generally everyone in the collecting community referred to the bow as the Robin Hood bow.

A few years after Floyd's death, his son Rich asked me if I was interested in the bow. I told Rich the bow was undoubtedly worth far more that I could ever pay. Rich then asked me if I would authenticate the bow. Rich and I have been friends since meeting the late 1970s and I told him I would be happy to help him out. I figured it would be fairly easy to authenticate the bow, if Errol Flynn used it in the movie, I only had to find and document the scene(s) in which it was used.

The bow was made of yew and had a very unique shape and several easily identifiable characteristics. So I watched the move, expecting to find the bow. In every scene with a bow, I watched slowing down the movie to frame by frame. To my surprise the bow was not to be found in the film. I watched the movie a few times more, and never did find the bow. While it is entirely possible that the bow appeared in a portion of the film that wound up on the cutting room floor, without that footage, it was impossible to authenticate its use in the film.

After I told Rich the bow could not be authenticated in the film, I suggested that he try to find the letter from the previous owner. Floyd and Joney were religious about saving all correspondence. After Floyd’s death, Rich gave me a folder that contained every letter and list that I had sent to Floyd and Joney over the years. Joney was a professional book keeper, her book keeping and records were detailed and complete!

Rich found the letters from the previous owner of the bow, Bill Jeter of California. Bill was a very well respected old time California Bowman/Hunter. In his letters Bill describes both of the labels on the bow as well as who owned the bow before him, another party with no apparent connection to the movie, but again a well respected person who was well to do. This person reportedly received the bow from Flynn. As it turns out, there was no concrete evidence that the bow was used in the move, other than someone writing in a letter that someone told them that it was. With no real proof that the bow was used in the 1938 Robin Hood, all that was left was to say is what has been said in the brief summary.  There are some serious Robin Hood collectors who would have been more than interested in the bow, if it did actually appear in the move. I know the bow was sold, but to whom, I have no idea.

I certainly wish there was a better ending to this saga.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #23 on: April 02, 2009, 06:41:00 PM »
Tony -

Your one liners are too much.

If you haven't already, you need to compile all of them into a book, "Tony's One Liners".

Do you write material for Leno or Letterman, or both?
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline Stickbow98

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #24 on: April 02, 2009, 08:27:00 PM »
One of, if not THE the most educating & interesting places on the web IMHO.    :notworthy:  

>>--Ron--<>
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Offline johnnyrazorhead

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2009, 08:42:00 PM »
Wade,
  I don't know what year Floyd traded that guy for my clock,but it appears to be an older one.It also keeps perfect time.He made alot of them.

Offline CrookedStick

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2009, 10:14:00 PM »
Geez Wade, what don't you know?    :notworthy:     I'm totally impressed and so glad you started this thread.  I apologize for the quality of this copy, but I wanted to get it on this thread quickly and only had a folded-up clipping from our library to work with.  Someday I'll re-scan the negatives and get them to our online edition, then link them up here as a slideshow--there are quite a few more.

Definitely one of those 'wish I would have known then what I know now' memories.

Hey Rick-there's your jar of nocks on the shelf under the deer head in the small pic.

Top right pic is the arrow shop area just through the doorway behind Fred Bear in Wade's original pic. To the very left in the big pic you can see tips of bows stacked horizontally--I remember bunches of 'em there.  That's where the Errol Flynn bow was laying.

Bernie - aka 'one whose butt sat in Fred's chair'

Article from The Saginaw News, September 18, 1994:

 

Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2009, 10:40:00 PM »
Bernie - Thanks so much for posting the full page Article from The Saginaw News. You have some great photographs on that page. Brings tears to my eyes just looking at those photographs.

Joney fletching arrows is priceless. Floyd with his hands going, you know he is getting wound up.

Just watched two tapes of Floyd last night, so his voice is fresh in my mind. "Archery Shop" sign in an arrow, still cool. Floyd always answered the phone "Archery Shop", then waited for the caller to say something.

Your 1994 Article was probably one of the easiest photo shoots ever for you. Just close your eyes and click the shutter, no matter where the camera was pointed, you had a great photograph of some neat old archery stuff.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline Cody Roiter

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #28 on: April 02, 2009, 11:34:00 PM »
Wade, so I wonder if that yew bow was made by Howard Hill but with out the papers who knows I do know Hill did make some of the bows and arrows for the moive as I read in one of the Hill books....

Cody
We as archer's must keep it alive by helping others into the sport WE LOVE.

Offline Rick Enos

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #29 on: April 03, 2009, 08:00:00 AM »
Thanks John.I cant beleive you spotted the jar of knocks.

Offline Rick Enos

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #30 on: April 03, 2009, 08:17:00 AM »
The jar with the arrow knocks in it.If you were to look at the top lid of the jar there is a kneeling archer shooting an english long bow etched in the glass.

Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #31 on: April 03, 2009, 09:40:00 AM »
Cody - What I said about the yew longbow that Floyd had is pretty much all that can be said about it. We may always wonder about the real story behind that bow.

Yes, Hill made tackle for use in the 1938 Robin Hood, but if a specific piece of tackle can not be seen in the film footage that exists, can it really be authenticated as being used in the film? And without documentation from Hill or Flynn stating Howard made the bow, we will still be wondering forever. Had Hill and/or Flynn actually written on the bow, it would much different. With no writing on the bow, or paperwork from them, it leaves questions. The bow itself looks nothing like a bow that Howard normally made so it would be impossible to identify it as a likeness.

Even though there may be some very specific paper work that states an item was used in the film, if it can not be seen in the film, its value to a that type of collector is significantly less then if the item was visible in the film.

Let me give you another example with a much different outcome. Over 25 years ago, an old employee of Jack Heofer’s gave me a big cast aluminum 3-blade broadhead and told me it was used as a prop head in Cecil B. DeMille's 1932 sound spectacular “Sign of the Cross”. Joe had the same head on an arrow that was inscribed with the movie title, “Sign of the Cross”. In 2002-2003, when I was working on the First Edition of “Broadheads 1871-1971 Identification and Rarity Guide”, I bought a copy of “Sign of the Cross” and watched it from start to finish hoping to find that broadhead in the film so I could actually say these heads were used in the movie. Sure enough the head is clearly visible on more than one arrow in the scene in the grove where the Romans ambush the Christians during their secret gathering. The large cast aluminum heads in the move appear bright and shiny, but now after 77 years, the aged surface of the head is dull.

That is the type of evidence that does not exist for the yew bow.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline d. ward

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #32 on: April 03, 2009, 09:49:00 AM »
Lets get back to those clock's for a minute.There was one hanging in StCharles Northwest Archery for many years.During an earth quake one year it fell on the floor and got the SH&^ knocked out of it.bowdoc

Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #33 on: April 03, 2009, 10:12:00 AM »
Doc - You know what they say, "chit happens"
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline d. ward

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #34 on: April 03, 2009, 11:26:00 AM »
yeah there was little turds rolling all over the place.bowdoc

Offline TRAP

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #35 on: April 03, 2009, 02:03:00 PM »
That's funny SH&^ Doc.  


Trap
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"If you laugh, and you think, and you cry, that's a full day, that's a heck of a day." Jim Valvano.

Offline jcar315

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #36 on: April 03, 2009, 04:56:00 PM »
Fantastic thread and I too thank you for starting it. I don't know anything about anyone in the picture other than Fred Bear. When I close my eyes and imagine what a bowhunter is I see him. Thank you all for the great info!!
Proud Dad to two awesome Kids and a very passionate pig hunter.

Right handed but left eye dominant.

Proud to be a Native TEXAN!!!!!

"TGMM  Family of the Bow"

Offline Stickbow98

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #37 on: April 03, 2009, 06:23:00 PM »
LOL,

Well, that's one story you won't have to authenticate, Wade.... We all know the Doc knows his S**T!!!    :saywhat:  

>>--Ron--<>
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TGMM Family of the Bow

Offline TRAP

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #38 on: April 03, 2009, 06:55:00 PM »
We better stop making reference to that word or the Clock's gonna hit the fan.  ;)  

Trap
"If you don't like change, you're going to like irrelevance even less" Gen. Eric Shinsheki

"If you laugh, and you think, and you cry, that's a full day, that's a heck of a day." Jim Valvano.

Offline CrookedStick

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Re: Fred Bear's Last Visit to a Friend Since 1940
« Reply #39 on: April 03, 2009, 11:23:00 PM »
Boy did this thread get out of hand...and I can see the twinkle in Floyd's eye along with that smart aleck grin loving every minute of it!  :clapper:

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