Humor me, my dream is Africa.

[razorsharptokill]

I'm a Correctional Officer in Oklahoma and the pay isn't the greatest. I'm not hurting for money but it takes about all I make to make it. I retire with 20 years in about two more years. I also retire from the National Guard in a few more years, I'd like to reward my wife for dealing with my deployments and being so supportive and reward myself as well!

My dream is to hunt Africa at least once in my life. I know very little about what it takes to make this dream a reality. I've never even been out of the state hunting let alone on another continent! I may not even up to the challenge. I need to find out though.

From what I've read here I can see it costs around 2K just for the flight. What other costs are there? Trophy fees I guess, cost of getting your mounts back home etc...

Can some one break it down for me? I need a "What it takes to get to Africa, hunt, and get back" list.

This will help me decide whether to pursue this dream or not.

[artistryinnature]

Yup, anywhere from $2200.00 up for airfare (I'm assuming you are looking at South Africa as it is the most cost effective and easiest)and I'll let you know now that coach is almost torture on a 17+ hour flight. Your safari fee will vary from outfitto outfit and what is included trophy fee wise in the package. Anything outside the package will incur an additonal trophy fee so know what you want before you go. Figure 100-$120 per day tip to your PH. $100 to $200 to your tracker (not per day but in total) $100 - $200 to the skinners depending on how many you kill and $100 - $200 to the camp staff. Getting your stuff home will depend on how much you kill. About $150 per animal for dip, pack and crate. Around $500 for air freight. Customs bond, Cargo Import service charge, airport transfer, customs entry service, fish and wildlife entry service warehouse handling, messenger fees and delivery to your door will be another $500 if you use a broker (which I recommend), save a couple of hundred if you do it yourself but be prepared for a ton of paperwork and a day or two of hassle if you do it yourself. The there's the taxidermy work. No matter what people tell you an African trip is not as cheap as an elk hunt.

Good luck and it's worth every penny, believe me. There are ways to cut costs somewhat but cheaper safari and trophy fees usually mean small high fenced ranches.

Mickey

[artistryinnature]

One thing I forgot to add. Try attending Rocky Mt Elk Foundation or Safari Club banquets. Not only will yo be helping a good cause but they usually auction off one or more African Safaris and you can usually pick up a deal if you know what you are looking for and what is being offered. A friend of mine got a 10 day safari for 2 hunters and 2 non-hunters that included a free impala, warthog and duiker for each hunter for $3000. I've seen 1 hunter  safaris go for as low as $800.

[Wile E. Coyote]

There are lots of variables that can affect your cost. I think that Mickey is being extreemly generous when it comes to the tips he is suggesting.
My cost in 2004 included:
 
                         Airfare    $2000.00
       Daily fees for 10 day hunt   $2500.00
Trophy fee (Kudu, 2 Gems,2impala)   $3000.00
Tips for PH (10% of trophy fees)    $300.00
Tips for Tracker,Skinners and Staff $200.00
  Pack/Dip/Ship Trophies            $800.00  
              Souvineres            $300.00
                            Total   $9100.00

Your trophy fees will vary depending upon your "Wish List". I think that packages are a good way to go if they include what you want, and you will save some in relation to dining "a la carte".

Taxidermy cost were not included as I do my own. You can save if you choose to do skull mounts v.s. full cape mounts on some of your trophies.

I think that 10K is a good figure to shoot for to cover the whole ball of wax.

Best of luck, it was well worth the money and sacrifice for me.

[cch]

I went this year with my wife and I was figureing on 12,000 for me and 5 for the wife and that is what we came out to. I haven't got the trophies back yet so I don't know what the shipping is going to be. You could go cheaper with a package deal they sound good but you can get screwed if you don't shoot the animals on your list but some outfits will give you back money for animals not taken. You have two years to plan start putting away money now and you will be ready to go when you retire. It is worth it. My wife and I had a great time. We went for 14 day's of hunting but 10 was plenty. You could also go for a 7 day hunt and spend a few day's sight seeing. Good luck.

[artistryinnature]

$100 - 120 per day is fairly standard for a PH unless he is also the outfitter or he is salaried by the outfitter. The outfits I have hunted with have PHs who are independent contractors. They provide their own vehicle, fuel and tracker(s). My last trip we hunted 5 different concessions that were up to 400km apart. I don't think $1000 is too much to pay someone for ten 14 to 18 hour days of hard hard work.
Of course my actual safari fee was only $1500 and included 3 animals. Of course if the PH doesn't do a good job his tip would be adjusted accordingly. As far as the trackers, skinners and camp staff I may have been "over" generous but I tend to pay well for good service.

Just my 2 cents worth,

Mickey

[Wile E. Coyote]

Mickey,
I think we are on the same page. I absolutely feel the work my PH did was worth 100 to 120 per day. In my case, my PH was ALSO my Outfitter, the total fee you and I paid was approximately the same just a different method of paying it. It was my misunderstanding not knowing that you were paying the PH seperately from the outfitter.

[chrisg]

Please come, we may be a crazy mixed up bunch but we love our country and you will see why! Take time out to do some touristy stuff it's worth it.

The value of our life is in the dreams we live and the relationships we have, not in the 'things' we 'own'
 
P.S.I'm not an outfitter but an ex safari guide. Just my two bits worth!

[8th Dwarf]

I'm not in agreement with most of what I have seen here.  I have been to Africa 15 times.  I have learned the hard way that you get what you pay for.  I believe it was Ben Franklin who said, "Quality is remembered long after price is forgotten."

If you are going to go all that way, spend the money on airfare, and hope to get a QUALITY hunt, you go for 14 days, DO NOT BUY A PACKAGE PLAN HUNT, and find the best operation there is.  I have seen way too many photos of guys with a 40-45 inch Kudu and a dink Impala!  There is no call for that.  Many of these places are set up with blinds 30-40 yards from the water.

I am going for my 13th or 14th hunt next July with Greater Kuduland Safaris.  They were the first game ranch in South Africa, I believe.  They OWN all their land, which is two HUGE ranches.  They manage for trophy quality animals.  They are, in my opinion, if not the best there is, certainly in the top two or three.
Kudu bulls, for example AVERAGE over 54".  Many are taken over 57"!  They have over 22 huntable species.  It's a CLASS operation.  They even have Rhino and Elephant roaming their area.

The CLASS operations are going to cost you a minimum of US $325 per day for hunter and $150 per day for observer.  Less than that, and there is something that ain't quite right, IF you want a quality experience.

Now, note that I am NOT a booking agent!  I'm just telling you what I have learned from years of research and hunting there.

It will be the greatest trip of your life if you do it right, Razor!  If you do it wrong, you will have a bad taste in your mouth for a long time.  With airfare, daily rates for 14 days, trophy fees for 7-8 animals, and incidentals, it will run around US $15,000 for both of you.  I reckon this is one of the best "buys" in hunting today.  I remember going on a Stone Sheep hunt for $4,500.  Today that hunt will cost a minimum of $30,000...probably more.  Heck, a good Moose hunt is close to, or equal to, the
cost of an African hunt.

Should you wish more information, photos, stories, my wife's views, just email me at [email protected]  I'm currently in New Zealand, but get email just about every day.  I'd be happy to put you in touch with other bowhunters who can give you their views on South Africa and Namibia.

If you're going to do it...do it RIGHT!

Too Short (Paul Brunner)

[artistryinnature]

Paul,

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you on some accounts. My last hunt this past June I paid 150 per day. Now this was a hunt purchased at a RMEF banquet and split between 2 hunters ($3000 total $1500 each). I hunted not only the 30,000 acre ranch that the outfit owns, but 2 other ranches of equal size, trophy managed, one of which sees very very limited huntung (less than 20 hunters per year) has never had animals introduced, been farmed or ranched agriculturally. In short this property is like Africa of 100 years ago. The owner has had it in his family since 1919. I also hunted a macadamia/avocodo/eucalyptus operation in the Soutpansburg Mountains that has NO fences. We also hunted outside the border fence on the Limpopo River (South African bank). In short I hunted many free ranging animals and saw wild elephants (on the Botswana bank), wild hunting dogs and a leopard. Anyone who has hunted South Africa realizes what a unique experience hunting free range animals can be there. Between the two of us we took 13 animals, 8 of which are book animals 1 of which was a gold medal one a silver. Now I'm not a horn hunter but we saw a lot of "quality" animals, many of which were free ranging (including  33"+ waterbuck on the Limpopo. A warthog, impala and duiker were included in the package. All else were trophy fee animals. 2 of those six "package" animals were book animals. We saw plenty of 53"+ kudu and 1 over 60". I hunted on foot the entire time I was more than satisfied with my hunt. I don't think you can blanket state that package hunts should be avoided. What can be said is that you need to know EXACTLY what you want and EXACTLY what you are being promised. Though the daily fee was low for our hunt, the trophy fees were a bit high, but we had many opportunities at high quality animals. There was NOTHING "not quite right" about this operation or this hunt. I am not a booking agent. I am a taxidermist and a hunter so I have no bias in this at all.

Respectfully,

Mickey

[8th Dwarf]

Thanks for the comments, Mickey.  I am delighted that you had what sounds like a great hunt.  Personally, I think you were darned lucky!  I have talked to dozens of bowhunters who came back very unhappy...almost all because they bought a packaged and/or cheap hunt.  One thing I don't even pretend is to know everything about the hunting in southern Africa.  I learn every time I go over there.

Your experience sounds like a really great one and it may be that Razor needs to research your outfitter and his areas.  I can tell you one thing, though, and that is there are some real dirt bag outfitters over there who will take your money with all sorts of grand promises and then turn you loose in a terrible hunting situation.

I ain't here to argue.  I'm here to learn, teach, share information, and help other bowhunters.  I just learned something from you.  That's what's cool about this site.  

Years and years ago, Paul Schafer, the Wensel boys, and some other old timers taught me a bunch of neat stuff about traditional bowhunting.  They also taught me that it was my responsibility to do the same for other bowhunters and I take that pretty seriously.

The offer is still there for anyone to pick my brain.  Africa is in my heart!

Cheers...

Too F. Short

[artistryinnature]

I agree Paul. That was my point. Research research research. Ask people. I was lucky enough to know some people who have hunted with this outfit and who I have great respect for. I also spent a lot of time on the phone with the outfitters questioning them. Rip-offs abound everywhere. I just had some friends get ripped off to the tune of $2000 each on a Missouri whitetail hunt. They had a horrible time but they didn't do any leg work other than contacting the Better Business Bureau. I understand the Africa in your heart comment. The place really grabs hold of you.

BTW where in Montana? My dad lives in Hungry Horse and this is the first season in many many years that I haven't gone out to hunt with him. We hunt out by Judith Gap, down near Dillon, over by Drummond and all over the Flathead. Sometimes out in the Cabinets and the Yaak.

Mickey

[razorsharptokill]

Thank you all so much! That is exactly the kind of info I wanted. Not sure if I'll ever be able to afford it but I sure still want to go!

Maybe I'll win a lottery!

[hunt it]

Razor,

Paul is right in his facts. I have spent over three months on African soil to date. In todays climate you want to hunt with a well established outfit. Yes, there are a number of them and a good safri can be had in more than one place. There are alot of bad deals and unlimited horror stories on trophy shipment problems. I recommend you get yourself an SCI membership and use it. SCI can give you hunt reports on most good outfits free at your request. As mentioned there are some good deals at SCI dinners/fundraisers. If you go this route ask people at the function who has hunted with the outfitter. Most SCI clubs have running relationships with outfitters who donate each year and there should be a number of members present who have been there. In my SCI Chapter we will only sell/auction hunts that we can vouch for based on members being there. We will introduce you to these members at your request. This works great and makes sure all are happy. Not all chapters do this, but is the case at most. ARTS daily rate is cheap but this is because he got a bargin. I'm sure if he paid the outfitters rate it would have been more than what he paid. Get lots of advice on taxidermists and shipping. I would never have anyone in Africa do my taxidermy!!

[razorsharptokill]

It sounds like you guys should write a guide about booking an Aftican hunt! There's so much experience and knowledge here.

[8th Dwarf]

Mickey...my wife, Karen, and I ranched on the Blackfoot River, near Ovando for 30 years.  We finally got so overrun with city folks moving in that we sold out totally and now live half the year in New Zealand in a fifth wheel trailer and half the year in Montana in a fifth wheel.  No house, no lawn, no hassles.  I spend a lot of the American summer hunting...Australia, Africa, and then Elk and Deer in several western states.

I used to hunt the Ovando area a lot, the Big Hole Valley, and upper Flint Creek.  Used to bugle up to a dozen bulls a day and see NO other hunters.  Now it's overrun with guys on ATVs and they have trained the Elk to run at the sound of a bugle.  Times change, but it pisses me off!  I had a vasectomy after two kids!  But somebody out there is popping babies out at high rates!  Heck, I remember when the U.S. population was 140 million!  Now it's 300 million and climbing! Where are our grandchildren going to hunt?

Aaarrrggghhhhhh!!!  See...you got me started!  I'm 63 and I really don't tolerate change.  Why can't it just stay like it used to be?  Maybe that's why I love Africa so much.  Whether in a blind at a waterhole, or stalking a high ridge, I'm all by myself and I KNOW no one is going to pop up and ruin my hunt.

Hasta la Pasta!

Too F. Short

[John3]

Email or call Too short.. He knows of what he is speaking.

Speaking of money... Spend it. This is Africa!!
I played with numbers as well. Figure around 10 to 12K after everything, (tips, hide prep and shipping home). My girl is going for her airfare and $150 a day to sight see, hunt with me and hang out with Pauls wife. A great value !! If you want to "shop" call Neil at BSC, he is a straight up guy that is a professional.
Money-- add up what you waste on eating out, tobacco, adult beverages ect...(lol) in a year.. Africa is "doable" for most people...  I am not a weathly guy, but I work a part time fun job and save my pennies. We fly out to Africa next July.

John III

[8th Dwarf]

Hey John....

Are you getting excited????  I am.  The only thing that keeps me from peeing myself in anticipation is the fly fishing here.  I landed two Browns this morning on dry flies...one was 6 pounds and the other was 8 1/2 pounds.  Not bad for an hour's work.  That's the only thing that keeps me sane until I get to Africa.

You can't even IMAGINE what it is going to be like, mate!

Too Short

[John3]

Paul, You know I'm crazy excited about going. I also believe my dreams cannot do Africa justice.  We will find out next July.  YES !!!

Has razorsharp contacted you?  People just have to decide to make "Africa happen".. Thats what I did.

John III

[8th Dwarf]

John...  A few years ago this school teacher called me.  He had a pile of kids (I said nothing about that...remarkable restraint).  He wanted the details and was planning on joining me a couple of years later.  

I sent him photos (this was before I could say, "digital") and a write up.  Two weeks later, he called me up, said he had gone to the bank and borrowed the money, and wanted to go that same year.  He had a BLAST.  He turned out to be a really fun and funny guy and shot some nice stuff.  He said it was worth getting in debt.

My dad always told me that you walk this path only once.  He said you never know when the tap on the shoulder is coming, so you better live life flat out, as fast and as far as you can go.  I always listened to my dad.  When I'm gone, no one will be able to say, "He didn't do anything!"

Dang...philosophizing this early in the day after only one cup of coffee?????

Too Short