Is it going to blow?

[Str8Shooter]

I'm hoping that I can get some opinions from some of you guys that have had this problem. Maybe even some bowyers could chime in.

I just got a really nice Martin Vision off of the big auction site with my hard earned Christmas bonus. It was described as being in new condition but when I recieved it I noticed a problem on the tips. On the belly side of the limb where the string grooves are cut in it is developing some small (1/4" -3/8"), white cracks in the glass. Two of them you can feel with the finger and the whitish lines. The upper limb has the worst of it but the bottom limb looks like it has a couple of lines starting to form. I haven't strung it or shot it yet because I've already had a bow fail on me at full draw and I don't need to reexperience that.

It's definitely not what I was expecting for like new bow so I'm pretty upset.I've tried to contact the seller with no response so I have a feeling I'm going to get stuck with it. I did contact Larry Hatfield of Martin and he thought it would'nt be safe to shoot. But he did suggest something like a cyanoacrilate glue to seal the cracks if I couldn't return it.  I was hoping some of you guys could chime in and give me some suggestions. I was wondering about maybe sealing the cracks with glue and then trying to put a phenolic overlay on it to strengthen it. Might work?

It's also a 70# bow if that makes a difference.

Here's a couple of pics...
 
 

Thanks,
  Chris

[mooseman76]

Personally, I'd listen to Larry.  It sure looks scary though...Mike

[horatio1226]

Sorry to hear about your misfortune.Hope you didn't leave positive feedback. Brian

[horatio1226]

Is it possible to cut the tips off and lower them?

[Scott Smith]

BOWDOC! Well he is the first thing that came to
mind. I bet he can fix it better than it was when
new. Good luck.. I just remembered Check Mate
Longhorns have phenolic both sides of the lib tips.

[insttech1]

I'm sick of #$%&%*% on the auction site misleading people, or in this case, stealing, since the bow's junk...or at least junk compared to "as new"...with those potentially fatal flaws...

If you paid w/ paypal, I'd file a complaint and try and get your money back...screw the seller--he SAW those flaws when he unstrung it to ship it!!!  (Unless--and HIGHLY unlikely!! that the tips were damaged symmetrically in shipping!!).

Listed to Larry...don't shoot it; pursue your money back!!

Just my two cents...

[Str8Shooter]

I thought about checking with Bowdoc, but I'm still waiting to hear from the seller to see if he is willing to make things right. If I end up having to keep the bow I don't know if I want to invest a bunch of money trying to fix it if I'm uncertain that it will actually hold together. I had thought about having a bowyer cut the tips and redo it but that would probably push it into the 80# range... little more than I want to handle.

I did pay with Paypal and if I don't hear back by Sunday I will file a complaint. I'll still be out some of the money though.

Chris

[Sixby]

Use glass without scrim and thats what happens with fast flight. I would fill it with epoxy and overlay it with 1/16 phenolic, better than new/ the bow is not yet structurally damaged from what I'm seeing but it could be . It can also be fixed two ways but the shortening way will give you and 75 to 80 lb bow.

[Sixby]

If yo decide to fix it before you fill the grooves with epoxy take the thin superglue which is cyronarualte and fill the cracks with it. It will prevent them from spreading.

What you have there is another reason to use padded loops on fastflight string. This is technically Martins fault and honestly they should fix or replace the bow.

[Cherokee Scout]

How long have you had it? If you just got it and it is like that, email the guy and give him a chance for a refund. If you have been shooting it for awhile, and shooting arrows that are way too light, maybe you did it. But since you just got if since Christams, email the seller and demand a refund. Maybe he never saw the cracks. Some people are not detail minded and he did not see the cracks. If he is honest he will offer you a discount or full refund. Otherwise, give him bad feedback and contact Paypal if you used Paypal.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I had problems on the site.... the seller won't give me any info , well not till after the auction & I won... I sent 3 emails before telling him to take me off. anyway, I have a bad mark with them... Owell I'm way better off ... That E-Bay gives money to help the Anti-gunners/Hunters..Plus I have heard they support peta (Animal rights ppl)... So I'll never get anything from them or sell anything thru them

[d. ward]

I bet some loc tite will bond those splits back together forever.Loc tite or any good super glue will penatrate better then epoxys.LT is thinner then water and will even in most cases be stronger then the original matiral.But as mentioned above.When purchaseing any used bow ask all the questions you can think of before makeing the purchase.About 75% of the archery tackle sellers on peebay would not know a recurve from a long bow if you shot them with one.bd

[traditional beagle]

Wouldn't bother me one bit to do the overlay with 1/16" phenolic. Black will even make it look good. It would be different if the cracks were across the grain. I've had this happen when the file grabbed the edge of the clear bo-tuff while making the string grooves. Never had a problem with any of the bows. But you are no me and you may never feel comfortable with it.

[Bodork]

I think the superglue and a phenolic overlay would fix it. It almost looks to me like the grooves could be re-filed at more of an angle there. Maybe the loop on the string was too big or the braceheight was way off. It looks like the string was riding on the very outside of the limb instead of in the grooves. Just my uneducated guess. Mike

[bowdude]

This is also common in the fast flight or stretchless string bows.  The amount of bows that have this that have the extra wood layer on top of the glass on the belly is amazing.  Next time you are at a traditional shoot look at them.  The wood on the belly does not cause the problem but hides it.   T. Beagle is right that it can be caused by the file.  But that would mean it happened at Martin , not likely.  Personnaly I think the tips are too thin and it was shot with a stretchless string too often or dry fired.  Either way in the future if you get it fixed you should only put B50 on it.  PM me if there is no working with the seller.

[d. ward]

I gotta guess that FF string helped do the trick on that one too.If that were originaly a problem Martin would have discoverd that by now.FF is somewhat safe for that bow,but also could be as mentioned above...shot 20,000,000 times with the same string.One fiber of the FF string will kinda work it's way into the smallest crack or file groove.But normaly the FF damage is on the back of the bow rather then the belly.......bd

[Gene Roberts]

Get your sweet mula back.

[Str8Shooter]

Thanks for all the opinions so far.

I bought the bow with the desciption of a "flawless bow, shot less than 20 times". Told me he was the original owner of the bow and just never used it. Pictures all looked good so I thought it was a good deal.

As I said, I haven't shot the bow yet. I noticed it before I strung it. I contacted the seller right away... no response. Second email I requested he get back to me to work out something... no response. So, chalk this one up as my first poor buying experience on a bow. Anyways, enough with the negative stuff.

If I can't get a refund with the buyer I think I'm going to try and repair the bow. I've been wanting one for a long time at this weight. And, I don't make enough to eat this purchase. I'll keep you guys posted.

Chris

[gordonf]

I'd carefully sand the fiberglass belly down at the tips and install hardwood tip underlays. I think that would take care of it.