Super Wide Zooms...Anybody got one?

[Steve Kendrot]

Any DSLR shooters out there have an ultra wide angle zoom lens they like? I am researching the various super wide angle zooms available for the digital cameras and am having a hard time deciding between the few available that fit the Canon EF mount. I am looking at the Tokina 12-24 mm F/4, Tamron 11-18 mm F/4.5-5.6, and the Sigma 10-20 mm F/4.5-5.6. The only Canon option is an EF-S which won't fit my 10D. Any recommendations for or against. Is 10mm vs 12 mm something to weigh heavily? They all get pretty good reviews, but the Sigma gets knocked for inconsistent quality...good copies are great and bad ones terrible.

What are you all shooting your landscapes with?

Steve

[Phil Magistro]

I have a 17-55 f2.8 that I shoot the majority of my photos with and have been considering a wider lens.  I've been looking at the Nikon 12-24 and the Tokina 12-24.  I belong to a local photographic club where I've heard a lot of good things about the Tokina from both Canon and Nikon shooters.  So much so that I have a hard time justifying the additional cost for a Nikon lens that's twice as much.  The photos I've seen from the Tokina are beautiful.  I don't know anyone that uses the Sigma.

Phil

[Frank1107]

Steve:

The Canon 17-40 L is a great lens. It is not an EF-S mount and works well on the 10D. You will not get the benifit of a true ultra wide angle lens due to the 1.6x of the 10D sensor. Check fredmiranda.com classifieds you will find them and others as well as good information.

Good Luck

Frank

[Steve Kendrot]

Thanks fellas,

I've also heard good things about the Tamron 11-18. Given the 6 year warantee and they stock it at a local shop I am going to give it a try. Sigma and Tokina need to be special ordered and are not returnable and I've heard a couple horror stories about bad copies, at least for the Sigma.

Steve

[Don Thomas]

The widest lens I own is a Nikon 20mm amd I don't use it often -- mostly in boats where space is cramped. Anything with a smaller focal distance than that beomes very tricky to use so I would advise some backyard pratice before shooting anything important. It's a great way to make horns look bigger... but do you really want to go there? As far as knock-off brnds are concerned, I have been very happy with Tamron -- and special use lenses like this are a great place to save on the money. Just my 2 bits worth... Don

[Biggie Hoffman]

Will a wide angle zoom allow more light to enter?
My zoom is a 80-200 Canon but seems like I can never use it unless it's bright sun or snow.

[Phil Magistro]

Biggie, Wide angles won't necessarily let in more light.  The "fastest" (lets in the most light) lens I own is a fixed focal length - 85mm f1.4.  My wide angle lens is a 2.8 or two stops slower (lets in less light).

It's the maximum aperture that determines how much light a lens leaves in.  If you have a f2.8 (maximum aperture) 80-200mm lens that's about as good as it gets in that size.  If it's an f4 lens then it's one stop slower, lets in less light and requires a slower shutter speed. Many zooms are variable where they may be f3.5 at the wide focal length and f5.6 at the longer focal length.

You have some choices to make your lens work. You didn't say but I'm guessing that you shoot in program mode.  You can change to aperture mode and set it at it's maximum opening (f2.8, f4, etc.). You can bump up the ISO to 400 and gain some shutter speed. Or you can use a tripod to minimize hand shake (unless your subject is moving then it won't make a difference).

There's some good information here -   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photographic_lens  

Phil

[Biggie Hoffman]

great link Phil, thanks....

The 80/200 f/2.8 is the best glass I have by far, it's a shame I can't use it more often.

[Biggie Hoffman]

Phil, again thanks. I know this is simple basics for some of you guys but I've never been much on photography althoughI really do like it.
The page on basics you linked for me helped immensly.
Here are two images from this morning. The 1st was on SLR and the second on Program mode with a remote shutter device. It's given me a new perspective on my camera and lenses.
 

 

[Phil Magistro]

Biggie, I'm glad it was helpful. The neat thing about photography is that you can make it as simple or as complex as you like.  And with digital you can burn thousands of images to experiment with no additional cost.

I shoot nearly all of my shots in either Aperture Mode or Manual Mode.  In Aperture mode I pick the lens opening I want to use to either let in enough light or control my depth of field.  I use a hand-held light meter quite a bit but the meter in your camera will work well too.  I adjust the ISO to get a reasonable shutter speed.  With Manual Mode I set the aperture and the shutter speed based on my light meter or on teh results I want to get.  This is helpful to control the exposure of the subject when there may be other light sources in the frame that will fool the camera's meter, such as sunrise and sunsets.

Program mode works fine too but I believe over time that you may come to like having a bit more control over the exposure instead of letting the camera choose the settings.

Looks like you're growing a nice buck there.  

Phil

[Steve Kendrot]

I'm rethinking my decision to buy an ultrawide after reading or talking to several sources who say they seldom use ultrawides.... Hmmm. I know I'm often frustrated with the angle of view with my 28-105 EF II. Seems limiting on those big panoramic shots. On the other had, I don't want to plunk down $500 on a novelty lens I won't wind up using much. Too many choices.

Steve

[Phil Magistro]

Steve, while a few mm on the long end doesn't seem like much, a few on the wide end can be huge.  With the digital crop factor your 28mm lens is closer to 42 in performance - not very wide at all.  I know that I use the wide open end of my 17-55 enough to make me seriously consider a 12-24.  I don't expect to use it nearly as much as the 17-55 so, like I said above, I can't justify the price of a Nikon 12-24 but I do think it would be quite useful in many situations.

Phil

[Steve Kendrot]

I picked up a Tamron 11-18 today. I've got 30 days to decide if I like it. Unfortunately, my skills to fully evaluate the lens are lacking... i.e. interpretation of poor lens performance is as likely to be lack of photgraphic ability...   :confused:

It is a wide sucker though!

[Phil Magistro]

I'd suggest using a tripod and shooting at all the f-stops in different light.  You may want to use the hyperfocal distance to eliminate depth of field softness.

Most lenses have a sweet spot for focus and you'll probably find it is sharpest closed down a stop or two.

Best of luck with it!

[Steve Kendrot]

"You may want to use the hyperfocal distance to eliminate depth of field softness."

Could you explain that in a bit more depth Phil? I'm not familiar with the term. Thanks for the advise. I am going to experiment with the lens this weekend. If I'm not really hyped about it, I may return it and upgrade my tripod.

Thanks for all your advise.

[Phil Magistro]

Hyperfocal distance is the focus distance that provides the greatest depth of field.  It's how people can take a low-level shot of some flowers in the foreground that are sharp and have the mountains in the background still in focus.

There's a discusion about it halfway through this article -

 http://www.vividlight.com/articles/1503.htm

Phil

[Weasel]

I have the Tokina 12-24mm and love it!!  I also love my 17-40 L, but when I want the BIG scenics I use the Tokina.

Jerry

[Biggie Hoffman]

I got a 300mm f2.8 Tamron last week and ama still struggling with depth of field. It's an incredible lens and waaaaaaay more sophisticated than I am.
Can I get focus to infinity on auto mode?

[Weasel]

Infinity from where in the frame?  Remember, the longer the lens, the shallower the depth of field.

[Biggie Hoffman]

See I'm too cherry to even use the correct terms :-)
I guess I need Photography for Dummies :-)

What I mean is...the center of attention is in focus but the background is not. Sometimes that's cool but not always.

I read the atricle that Phil linked above and it says how to do it manually.