Canon VS. Nikon

[Dave Stein]

I want to purchase a new digital SLR and am torn between the Canon 5D and the Nikon D200. The camera I have now is the entry level Canon digital Rebel and I hate it. Does anyone here have any experience with either and can you please post your opinion based on your experiences? I realize I am opening a can of worms with a question like that and I know that "OPINIONS" are like as-h---s and everyone has one but I really need some help on this one.


Dave

[Phil Magistro]

To be up front about it, I'm a Nikon user.  

If you're only comparing these two cameras it's probably important to know what you want to use the camera for.  The 5D has a full frame sensor so you won't have the "advantage" of crop factor for wildlife or other telephoto work.  On a 5D your 200mm lens will be 200mm.  On a D200 because of the sensor size you'll get an image from your 200mm lens that is equivalent to a 300mm image from the 5D.  It's a cheap way to gain mm's in focal length.

Beyond that there are other differences that may be significant or not.  From what I'm told by Canon users, Nikon bodies are more ergonomic.  I know that the Nikon flash system is far superior to Canon's.

Some folks talk about the difference in noise between Nikon and Canon but I can point to my own experience with noise and several websites explanations that show little difference.

Neither company has a big advantage for most users when it comes to lenses.  You can find the lenses you need in both models.

The D200 is a fine camera.  I use one a lot of the time.  It focuses well, takes a great image, offers the ability to save settings in four shooting banks and additional settings in four custom banks, letting you adapt to any situation quickly.

[Dave Stein]

Phil,
Thanks for your input, it helps a lot. I like what you said about the 1.5 sensor in the Nikon. The additional focal length would be a nice surprise. I have held both and I agree with the Nikon just feeling better in the hand. The view finder is a little nicer in the Canon. The speed of the Nikon is better. My problem is I like some of both but can't afford both. Another way to look at this is I have relatives that have the Nikon lenses and I could borrow them and save some money in the long run:)

Dave

[JBiorn]

In my humble opinion, I would stay with the Nikon(I'm a Nikon guy), and I would go with something more like the D80. You will save a bundle from the D200, and you could use the extra for the pricey little peripherals----lenses, filters, software, teleconverters, lensbabies, etc., etc., etc.

 Thats just my two cents.

 Jeff

[Dave Stein]

Jeff,
Thanks for your input as well. I very familiar with film cameras but this digital is kicking my rear end. You make a good point on the cost of the additional goodies.

V/R,

Dave

[dad3*3]

Well. upfront, I shoot Canon.  When I switched from film to digital I looked at both makers.  I went with Canon for the Digic II processor and the incredable low noise levels at higher ISO especially on the 5D.  I have been using the 5D for nearly a year now and I hate to say it but I often reach for the 5D over my 1Ds MKII.  The 5D produces great dynamic range and Canon's DPP Software is excellent when shooting in RAW which I would strongly recommend.  

Now which model is right for you?  Well it would be difficult to make a mistake with the two you are looking at.  Cropped camera's have certain advantges depending on what you are shooting.  Both Nikon and Canon make cropped camera's.  If you are going to shoot certain sports and or wildlife, a cropped camera could have an advantage but not much as you can always go longer in the focal length of the lenses you add.  I will add, once you use a full frame you may never want to go back to a cropped sensor.  

If you have the chance, go to a good camera store and try both on the same subject.  Many shops will rent you the camera for a day for a modest price especially when you consider the price you will pay for your final choice.  Look at the extremes and see how the processor handles them.  Certainly lenses will come into play here as well.

Or, just look at the sidelines at any major sporting event and see how many White Lenses you see verses Black Lenses.  Canon's the winner here.

Just curious, what don't you like about the Rebel?

Good luck.

[Dave Stein]

Henry,
First thanks for adding to this discussion, I really appreciate everyone’s opinions. To answer your question, I didn't like the feel of the camera to start; it was too light and just felt like a toy. Second I could never get the multi frames per second to operate properly (whatever you call it). Noise levels were very high in low light conditions and it just went downhill from there. I like to photograph my kids’ soccer games to get action shots and the lag time between frames was slow so I’d end up missing the picture I wanted. Now in all fairness to Canon I’m sure most of the problems I was having were due to my own inabilities but it’s just hard to explain my feelings. It’s very much like when you try a bow and it just doesn’t feel good to you, even though the bow might be one of the best on the market, if it doesn’t feel right you will never shoot it good. I hope my rambling made sense.

Dave

[paleFace]

Dave,  i am a nikon man from over 25 years ago and i currently shoot with the D2x, D1x & D200 on occasion. am i saying to buy a Nikon, nope. they are both great cameras. what i would do is to go to this website and compare the two.
 www.dpreview.com
right off i see a difference in cost with the 5d costing as much as $500. more. the 5d has more megapixels which means larger file sizes. honestly once you get over 5-6 megapixels for the average photographer they would not be able to tell the difference. as an example i shot an image using my D1x (5.7mp) and the image was used on a billboard. the D200 has a higher flash sync. the D200 will shoot 5 frames per second vs. the 5D's 3 fps. being able to fire off a group of consecutive shots may not be important. the only other big difference that you might notice is that the D200 has a built in flash and the 5D has none. of course if you plan to shoot a lot of indoor or night shots you will want to buy a nice flash.
here is the link to the Nikon D200, Canon 5D as well as the Canon 20D comparison:
   DP review
truth is you won't go wrong with either camera. one other thing i would consider, is if you have good canon glass already, you may want to go with canon  to save with lens expenses. the camera is important, but the glass is paramount. a cheap camera with awesome glass can take a great image.  the best camera on earth with cheap glass is worthless.

[paleFace]

ooppppssss, the link to the comparison didn't work for some reason.  here it is...
   web page

[JL]

I tend to agree with paleface. I recently bought a mint Nikon D70 for a couple reasons. One-price. With a new baby coming and my other half being in the hospital for the last 3 months, I have to be carefull how I spend my $$$. The D70 is an incredable camera and I'm still getting use to shooting with it but I really like how it performs. I bought it from a fella in NM for $475 with a 28-105mm Nikon lens. I also picked up a clean 18-55mm Nikon lens for $75 for wide angle work. I also had a Canon Rebel XT and I also found it to be a bit lacking on build quality. I had a brief relationship with a Sony R1 and found it to be well made and take great pic's, tho a bit slow to focus in low light situations and the burst rate it pretty limited. The D70 just feels good in my hands. When life get back to normal, I plan on investing in some  good 2.8 glass to see what the D70 is really capable of.

I think a lot of folks who make the switch from film to digital make their decision based on what they already have on hand. If I had a ton of Nikon lens already, it would make my decision pretty easy. I pretty much came into the DSLR market at ground level. I would give the used market a close look. Some folks are always "upgrading" and are looking to move clean used camera equipment at rock bottom prices.

If you can buy good equipment at a price that you can resell it for, you really airn't out that much if it turns out that it doesn't float your boat.

JL

[Dave Stein]

JL,
Good points and I do appreciate the feedback.

Dave

[Tim Schoenborn]

Well Dave the answer is quite simple.

I make my living with a camera. A good analogy would be it's the indian not the arrow...........

I can make money using either brand and so can any Pro regardless of the color of his lens. At the level I shoot at, and the level the guys on the sidelines shoot at as an example we get most of our stuff for next to nothing.  

To much time is spent trying to figure out which is a better camera and this n that. Bottom line is it the guy pushing the button that makes the image. Also a real consideration is the line up of glass that the brand you choose has. There are some standouts in both the Nikon and Canon arena.

My biggest pet peeve as a Pro is when someone asks me what type of camera I shoot? Like that matters. It's the final image that my clients pay for is all that matters. How I get them is through knowledge of how to use a camera and my high end clients could care less what I used to get it. A lousy photographer can't take a good picture with a $5000 camera and a good one can blow you away with a $500 dollar one.

Bottom line is buy the one "YOU" like the best for whatever reasons seem to make the most sense in regards to capturing an image and then learn how to use it.

Good Luck...........

 www.timschoenborn.com

[Dave Stein]

Tim,
Thanks for adding to this post. Your thoughts make very good sense. I have read and understood everyone’s comments. I have taken a little from all and have decided to go with the Nikon D200. I am going to sign up for a digital photography class at the local community college to learn how to use the camera properly. Ritz camera also has a 16 session class specifically on the cameras functions which I’ll be attending as well. Thanks to everyone for the assistance.

V/R,

Dave

[Tim Schoenborn]

No sweat Dave..........

Put a Nikon 17-55  f/2.8G ED-IF lens on that body and you will cover a lot of ground.......

Going to cost you a bit, but it is well worth the money........

Good Luck with your new venture and learn all you can and do yourself a favor since digital is new to you. Make use of shooting in Full RAW mode. Nikon NEF. Don't let anyone tell you any diffrent.

Tim ;-)

[Dave Stein]

Thanks Tim.


Can I call on you for camera advice in the future?

Dave

[Phil Magistro]

Since you've decided on the body.....Congratulations on making a fine choice.    

The 17-55 is a great lens.  For all but sports and wildlife I use it probably 80% of the time. It stays on my camera ready for use.

But I'm sure you'll find that one lens isn't enough.  Of course everything depends on what you want to photograph.  If you want to photograph wildlife and don't have an extra $4500 laying around for a 300mm f2.8, a 300mm f4 is an excellent lens to look at.  Often you can find them used at KEH.com for half the price of new.  One lens that I would never be without is the 70-200 f2.8 VR.  For all of my weddings and sports photography I keep the 70-200 on my D200 and my 17-55 on my D2x.  With those two lenses you can cover everything except the very long range stuff.  And one other lens to consider is an 85mm.  The f1.4 is superb but the f1.8 will cost you a lot less and still give good quality.

Unlike years ago when I had a dozen lenses I've pretty much settled on these four lenses for everything I need.  

Best of luck!

[Tim Schoenborn]

Sure Dave anytime ...........

248.863.6407

 www.timschoenborn.com

[Phil Magistro]

Dave, another forum where you'll find lots of valuable information on Nikon cameras and technique is here -

 http://www.nikonians.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi

[Dave Stein]

Tim & Phil,
Thanks to both of you for your insight and wisdom. Not to leave anyone out...I thank all those who responded to my post.

Dave

[Steve Kendrot]

Dave,

As someone who took this plunge a year or so ago, be prepared to spend a pretty significant amount of time in front of the computer. Especially if you shoot in RAW mode. I wasn't quite prepared for the time it would consume and as a result, I have thousands of RAW images dumped on my computer waiting for a rainy day to get sorted, culled, processed, and filed. Hopefully the course you take will give you some pointers on filing images. Think I'll start a thread here come to think of it.

Have fun with it. How's the bow butt business going?

BTW- if you were really smart, you would'     ve bought a Canon...