HH bug got me ... Part One!

[Charlie Lamb]

Charlie,
What do you use to grind your limb profile?  

Most of my shop tools are multi purpose for economy sake... space and monetary. I have a belt sander mounted on it's side on a bench and do the heavy grinding off the end of that. It's very agressive with a 36 grit belt. Then I true things up on the side of the belt.

You can see it in a post I made earlier about tapering arrow shafts.

[Green]

Thanks for that info Charlie.

[2treks]

Matt,
James Buchanan is the bowyer credited with building proud, or thickening the handle of English long bows sometime in the 1880s, this eliminated most of the bending of the bow through the handle area. "Buchanan dips" are frowned upon by some "true" English warbow makers, but they are much needed to get to the American glassed version.
CTT

[Green]

Thanks for fleshing that out Chuck!

[2treks]

I was working on my first ELB years ago, and an Englishmen came by and said I was making a nice Garden bow, with them dips in there. I got a big lesson on Buchanan that day. That gent turned into a good friend and bow building mentor for the ELB proper.

[Mudd]

Thank you Chuck!!!

I never gave the "no-handle" ELB to handle American longbow transition much thought until this very moment.

When I was much younger I tried my hand at building a few ELB's with some successes among a bunch of what I considered failures.

I should have tried using hickory for a "workingmans" version but because of the woods desire to soak up moisture I went instead to Osage Orange.

It doesn't take a lot of Osage to carry a whole lot of draw weight so I wasn't overly satisfied with my efforts results.

Yew wood, especially good yew wood was not easily come by her in the midwest but over time I was able to scrounge a couple of pieces that satisfied my desires for a true ELB.

I still own one ELB "John Jr." 80" tip to tip and drawing around [email protected] to say, I now use the bow as a piece of wall decoration...lol

Danged rabbit trails...lol

God bless,Mudd

PS Thanks again Tradgang folks for thought provoking topics. Now I am wishing I had another sweet pulling, slow casting ELB in my draw weight...lol

[2treks]

Hey Mudd, not to side track from the HH to far but, I think there is relation to the transition from ELB to ALB and/or AFB. Once the laminating started to become common, the "dips" became inevitable I think. It takes little material to make weight once you start gluing things together.

As to your slow casting remark, I have a 55#@30" ELB made of Hickory that might change your mind. I won a "shoot across the pond" with it earlier this spring. 90yds distant. That bow was made by my Late friend who informed me of the "Dips" that day I spoke of above. Nice bow it is.

Pig nut hickory if it is tight and very dry has way better cast than some would think. I am surprized that it does not show up in laminated bows. Birch is getting used and that soaks up moisture about the same or worse, but birch does not make a a good selfbow.

[Charlie Lamb]

I only had a little time to work in the shop this morning. Checked the alignment of the limbs by sighting along the string. (sorry for picture quality).
     

Then because of the difference in tiller between the limbs (bottom limb was 1/8" weaker) I measured width at the fades and found lower limb was wider by a 1/16" so I ground it down to match which brought it to 3/16" weaker in the top limb. Positive tiller.

Next I measured down from the nocks 8" and drew a line square across the limb. Then I measured from the center line again 1/4" each way at the nocks. This makes for a 1/2" wide limb at the nocks.
I then connected the nock marks with a line to where the 8" mark touches the edge of the limb.
     
After that I ground the limbs to those lines.
Since the nocks were ground away, they'll have to be recut later when I've got more shop time.

The arrow shafts have been tapered, stained, clear dipped, cap dipped white and as of this morning crested.
   

Now I'll be chasing weight on this bow which at the moment is a beast but too wide by nearly a 1/4".

[Mudd]

You are rocking right along Charlie!

I bet we see an arrow fly out of it in the not too distant future.

God bless,Mudd

[mikebiz]

Love the look of that new Berry, Mudd.  I have to say that even though I've been silent here for a bit, one of my favorite things is to watch your videos and hear the hardly perceptible "wheet" of your bows and the thud of your arrows hitting the bale.  I'll bet your foaming at the mouth waiting for that MorningStar to arrive.  Good luck with both of them.  

Well, after several months of thought I sold the first Hill I ever purchased.  My LE "Sirocco" will be going to a new home early next week.  It's a bittersweet moment, but I just didn't shoot her much over the last year because of other bows and some shoulder issues.  

That said, my shoulder is feeling much better and I actually shot a little today.  Trying to build the muscles back up.  I've also switched from three under to split.  For those of you who shoot three under as I did, try split for a few shots.  If you don't immediately notice the DRASTIC decrease in sound at the release I will be surprised.  For me it's night and day and is definitely worth the time little bit of time it will take to adjust my aiming point.  Do I actually aim?  I don't know anymore.  It's an argument that has been beaten deader than the proverbial horse around here, so I just go out an shoot the way it feels best.  As we all should.

[bsv]

Question guy's,I now have two hill style bows,a Dave Johnson 66"50@28 and just received a Wesley special 66"50@28 carbon and lamboo,I draw both to the same weight 52# on my scale,the arrows I have been using for the D.J are 55spine P.O.C.29.5 bop,I draw 28.5" they are perfect (or near to it )out of the D.J. but hit 3-4" left out of the Wesley, could they be to stiff for it and not flexing enough?

thanks Burt

[khardrunner]

Is the shelf cut the same for the two bows? Are you shooting RH or LH?

[Charlie Lamb]

Got into the shop again this evening and made some progress on the bow. Took it down to 1" wide at the fades. It's starting to look more like a bow.
     
Removed some material from the tips to make it easier to get the string on and off and cut in the new nocks.
   

I made some templates from plexiglass a long time ago and they are used to lay out the handle contours.
     
   

It's 15 pounds heavier than I want, but I'm not finished working the limbs to shape and will finesse it to finish weight as I go.

[Bud B.]

Nice bow build Charlie. Thank you for taking this non-talented non-bow builder along. I could only dream of doing what you're doing. I appreciate you taking the time to show us your progress.

[Linwood Hines]

Well, y'all have done the evil thing, and gotten me hooked...I sent a check today for a nice HH (used but not abused), hope to see it next week!  This thread is awesome, epic, and how the heck am I going to read thru 945 pages?  So, now that you've sent me on this path, send me some HH mojo to shoot straight, and a deer or two in my path.  

Charlie, your build pics are awesome - I wish I could get THIS one!  Can't wait for your book!

[Butch Speer]

Linwood,
HH bows come with mojo pre-installed!  

[mikebiz]

Hey Linwood,

As I've told you you're going to love the bow you are receiving.  The bow is in (in my opinion) darn near immaculate condition for being four years old already.  Basically it looks exactly as it did when I purchased it.  

And like Butch said, mojo comes with the bow.  As long as you do your part to learn the proper grip that feels comfortable to you you will shoot straight and true.

[Linwood Hines]

Thanks, Mike.  I'm stoked about it!  and yea, I understand the mojo, and my "responsibility" toward it.  I'm definitely looking forward to it!

[mikebiz]

I know this has been posted before but with nearly 950 pages to sort through I thought posting the "Hitting 'Em Like Howard Hill" video link would be helpful to many (including myself).  I've seen the video multiple times and read the book several times.  Always good to see John's technique in action.  

There are four parts to the video all found here:

 http://archeryduns.webs.com/apps/videos/videos/show/14895607