HH bug got me ... Part One!

[Ben Maher]

Mmm

I am waiting on
My Robin Hood # 13
My T/d Rhino
My Belcher T/d Union Jack [ all yew
My Belcher 1 Union Jack Maple

all these are string Follow
66" 52# /-54 # @ 27 "

[Raging Water]

Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
who's still waiting on a delivery from craig, david, nate, etc?

i be waitin' on ...

big 5 from craig
ol' tom from david

Rob, Which Nate?

[Raging Water]

Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
matt, i'm hopeful that both of our wood/glass composite string follow hills will not only have that good feel on draw and release, but also won't lose much cast at hunting distances.  

there could be, should be, some serious difference 'tween the all wood longbow string follow dogs of my youth and these fancy schmancy, high tech, space age, modern composite hill string follow longbows produced here in the 21st century.   :D  

hope to hear about your testing today!

Rob, I shot my new HH Robin Hood String Follow today from 17 yards and 22 yards.

As you mentioned, past 20 yards the arrows started to run out of gas. However, I was just tickled with the 17 yard performance.

Boy, that Robin Hood feels really good!

Also, I shot 16 arrows lefty today. Very pleased with the way it turned out. See my Dual Shelf Robin Hood Post Page 3 for Pictures.

Matt

[Rob DiStefano]

Originally posted by Raging Water:
 

Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
who's still waiting on a delivery from craig, david, nate, etc?

i be waitin' on ...

big 5 from craig
ol' tom from david

Rob, Which Nate? [/b]

nate steen (sunset hill) - what other nate?

[Rob DiStefano]

Originally posted by Raging Water:
 

Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:
matt, i'm hopeful that both of our wood/glass composite string follow hills will not only have that good feel on draw and release, but also won't lose much cast at hunting distances.  

there could be, should be, some serious difference 'tween the all wood longbow string follow dogs of my youth and these fancy schmancy, high tech, space age, modern composite hill string follow longbows produced here in the 21st century.    :D  

hope to hear about your testing today!

Rob, I shot my new HH Robin Hood String Follow today from 17 yards and 22 yards.

As you mentioned, past 20 yards the arrows started to run out of gas. However, I was just tickled with the 17 yard performance.

Boy, that Robin Hood feels really good!

Also, I shot 16 arrows lefty today. Very pleased with the way it turned out. See my Dual Shelf Robin Hood Post Page 3 for Pictures.

Matt [/b]

good 'nuff!

what arrow weights?

[leatherneck]

Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:


be interesting to see how much customer traffic is going to howard hill archery via way of this forum and thread ...      

Well,along with checking out longbowbens bow and this thread I have a new Wesley Special on the way.

[Raging Water]

Awww? Man, I knew you were going to ask that!

Don't ask me about FOC. But the wood arrows were 532 gr. The bow is 55# at 28" so 9.67 GPP.

I did shoot some lighter carbon arrows (I guess 430 - 450 Gr) They flew real well at 22 yards.

Matt

[Cookus]

I sent my Black Bear in this morning (add a laced wrap and inlays / modify dished grip to a locator)and Craig confirmed via email the turn-around time for my bow was 4-5 weeks.   The boys are REALLY busy but as TW stated they're taking the time to talk with all of us...   I appreciate that and their cordial customer service   .   I will shoot the Wesley in the meantime!   Life is GREAT!

[SpankyNeal]

I'm waiting on:

1. Sunset Hill Natural (no belly glass) 65" [email protected] which should be here shortly.

2. Two other Sunset Hills on order for later in the year.

[RC]

Spanky, I got a birthday coming up and you got wwaaayyy to many Hills...RC

[SpankyNeal]

That's not possible RC...you can never have too many Hills!!

Spanky

[Nate Steen .]

Now, now Kelly....no tempting! no leaking.....lol

Spanky,  why don't you tell the guys how 'slow' and out of gas your Sunset is?  This cracks me up......( it is my humble opinion that a well designed String follow bow shouldn't run out of gas...there are other factors to be considered when designing a string follow bow. If the bow is 2 - 3 feet per second slower than a conventional longbow, it wouldn't run out of gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)

[Ben Maher]

If the bow is 2 - 3 feet per second slower than a conventional longbow, it wouldn't run out of gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)  

[Rob DiStefano]

Originally posted by sunset hill:
Now, now Kelly....no tempting! no leaking.....lol

Spanky,  why don't you tell the guys how 'slow' and out of gas your Sunset is?  This cracks me up......( it is my humble opinion that a well designed String follow bow shouldn't run out of gas...there are other factors to be considered when designing a string follow bow. If the bow is 2 - 3 feet per second slower than a conventional longbow, it wouldn't run out of gas until you shoot somewhere arond 50 yards...)

are there any issues with holding weight (and/or perhaps draw length) for string follow longbows?  

is there a threshold of sorts with a string follow longbow where to get decent performance/efficiency you need at least some specified holding weight?

iow, with a pair of string follow longbows that are as identical as possible but of different holding weights @ 28", say 45# and 60#, each using 28" 10gpp arrows, find that the heavier bow has a more than compared higher percentage of efficient performance (call that cast, arrow speed, lowered trajectory, etc) than the lighter bow?    

i know the heavier bow will perform better, but will that performance be proportionally better because string follow longbows "work better" at higher holding weights?

i ask this question to better understand if string follow longbows are worth having for lighter holding weight longbows.

[Mudd]

Originally posted by SpankyNeal:
That's not possible RC...you can never have too many Hills!!

Spanky

I gotta say.. he's gotcha there RC...lol

God bless,Mudd

[SpankyNeal]

It's funny, Nate and I were discussing this just the other day on the phone. Guys, after shooting "White Dragon" now for a few months I have proven to myself that what Nate says is right on! I've also had this same conversation with Steve Turay a couple of years ago, and he said basically the same thing. I have no experience with Craig's version of string follow, but after owning several straight and reflexed Hills, Kramers, Mists, Shultz's, and string follow Shultz's, Miller's, and Mists I can tell you that a good string follow design will be right there with, if not faster, than the other profiles...the Dragon is faster for it's weight than all of them! It's [email protected]" which is my short stubby draw and with a 600gr arrow there is NO drop out to a measured 25yrds which I shoot at my local indoor 3D range. After shooting all of these different bows for some time now, I can see no disadvantages at all to a properly designed string follow bow. Add in the advantages of low shock, increased stability, and quiet release and you have the best Hill design ever IMHO!

Rob, I think that bow length in proper proportion to draw length is maybe more critical with string follow than it is with the other profiles. You can get away with a 68" reflex profile for a 26" draw, but the string follow may suffer a little for that draw at that length. The string follow however will feel just as smooth at the shorter length as the longer bow does!

Spanky    

[Ben Maher]

Rob,
i began using my string follows specifically for FITA and IFAA field rounds ... i felt that they performed a bit better and 'easier' when taking those 70 yarders etc on a four arrow end .

So yeah ... I'm sold on them , especially at the lighter weights .

[Nate Steen .]

Rob,

I don't own a chrono,  never saw the need.  However, many customers of mine have stated over the years that they are really surprised how fast my bows are, from 45 - 80 pounds.  They are ordering bows that are comparable with the weights they were currently shooting and are comparing arrow speeds with bows that are reflexed or straight.  Most customers are shooting arrows at least as stiff or in many, many cases they are shooting arrows stiffer than they are used to in their other 'hill style' bows.  I think that if the bow is tillered and timed properly, it will shoot well regardless of the weight.

To clarify my previous statement (not to put anyone down, especially other bowyers of whom I send many customers)  I believe that Hill's bowmaking principles have been lost on many people.  Hill also was constantly tinkering with his bows to make them better while still keeping their original form and function.  A good string follow bow shouldn't follow the lead of a backset bow...they are different bows and should have different design attributes, while still conforming to Hill's original principles. This means that a good string follow bow can shoot very comparable with a straight or slightly backset bow for speed, but be much better in terms of shootability. These are my thoughts on the subject based on years of research and bowmaking and aren't in any way meant to demean anyone's bows or bowmaking abilities.  I for one am over the top excited to see such an interest in Straight End longbows, and the renaissance of their popularity.  I have limited bowmaking time available and therefore send many potential customers to Miller, Ekin, and Turay who in the past few years have enjoyed the resurgence in string follow design, carmelized bamboo, and visible-fadeout risers.

[Rob DiStefano]

spanky sez ...
 

Rob, I think that bow length in proper proportion to draw length is maybe more critical with string follow than it is with the other profiles. You can get away with a 68" reflex profile for a 26" draw, but the string follow may suffer a little for that draw at that length.

i don't understand - a 68" hill style and 26" draw is a mistake no matter what the limb set, or lack thereof.

if the bow length is apropos to the draw length for a 45# string follow and a 60# string follow - let's say a 68" bow and 28" or 29" draw length - which bow will be the better performer with a 10gpp arrow.  do you see where i'm going with this?

[SpankyNeal]

The reason I said that is because alot of guys like the bow longer than Hills formula, i.e 70" bow and 28" draw, and that's a mistake with string follow bows! I do have a 47@27 Sunset Hill as well and it seems just as fast at the same gpp as the heavier one. I don't use a chrono but I can pick either one up and hit spot on with it at range with no adjustments so they must be real close!