Word of Advice about Stump Shooting

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Boy you guys back on the east coast got it rough in the regulations department. i haven't even seen a game officer in 10 or 12 years in Oregon....No I'm wrong....we did have a little encounter a few years back. we had a late season cow elk tag down on the coast in an area we hadn't hunted before. We we driving around scouting the area, when we spotted some elk on the edge of a clear cut about 200 yards away. there were two bulls out there we could see moving their heads around. One of them had a nice rack too! So we pulled into a turn out, grabbed our bows and back packs, and were just heading towards the woods....When a white pick up pulled up right above us on a spur road. this guy rolled down his window and started yelling at us....boy i was sorely tempted to knock an arrow right then and there....this guy just ruined our chance on these elk.....then he got out of the truck and i saw his badge and side arm....yuppers! Smokey bear playing game warden in an unmarked truck... Come to find out....these were those fancy decoys you hear about. these things had real elk hides on them and heads that moved. I'll bet you couldn't tell the difference in a rifle scope at 200 yards either.....Well this guy checked our tags and told us to get out of the area. i guess there was a late rifle hunt in that area going on. and he was writing tickets for guys stopping and shooting off the road. i thought to myself that this was entrapment if i ever saw it....i told my hunting buddy we should circle around through the timber and have us some 3D practice....but we decided that probably wouldn't be too healthy. besides....that smokey bear didn't have much of a sense of humor anyway.....

other than that I've never even had my licence checked....

[homerdave]

man, am i glad i live up here!!!! hardly ever see a warden, and they got better things to do then check "stump tags".

[Tim Fishell]

Steve, thanks for the invite.  I will keep that in mind although it would cost me a fourtune in gas to run to your house everytime I want to shoot.  Like I said I enjoy scouting and stumping at the same time as I am sure a lot of you guys do as well.  I will just purchase my small game tag and go about my business until I am told otherwise from the next CO I run into.

[Jerry Jeffer]

The state game land I stump shoot on has signs that say no target shooting or, "plinking" with fire arms or bows. Since Coyote season is open every day and no orange required, that's what I say I'm doing. Never been questione about two different types of heads.

[AnointedArcher]

Tim, it's a good thing you bought your tag because I have seen Jason's truck and I don't think it could pull the bars out of the window anyway  

[Jeff Strubberg]

In Missouri.....


Never mind.  This isn't the place to go off.

[Dave Worden]

Tim, I asked the DNR about stump shooting a couple months ago and it is absolutely not allowed on State land.  I asked for distinctions between State Parks, State Recreation Areas, and just plain old State-owned land and they couldn't find any.  If you're stump shooting on state land, have a hunting license and tell them you're hunting, not stump shooting.  You also need to be careful about saying you're hunting, as some State land is posted no hunting for most of the spring and summer.  I know this pretty much sucks as it's difficult to find enough land to stump shoot on, except for state land, but there it is.  You just can't do it.  One more harmless, fun activity legislated against!!

[ChuckC]

Chris (Str8shooter)  In Wisconsin you are allowed to carry 35 different weapons at the same time if you so choose.  I can legally carry a .22 handgun and rifle and a bow and tell the warden I am deer hunting and also squirrel hunting.  I guess if I want a shotgun too for grouse...so be it.  You can only shoot the deer with legal equipment, including legal broadheads.
Chuck

[hockeyref]

Jerry,
Do you need a furtaker license for yotes? I gave up trapping\\furtaking years back (what was it, mid 1980's?) when they mandated classes and a seperate license. Besides the fur prices really sucked then - dunno what they are now.

 I support the WCO's, and can understand some of the reasoning, but man do the laws need simplified and then rewritten with a healthy dose of common sense - no wait - Most PA politicians and all liberals seem to lack common sense...

Chuck, NO WAY that would fly in PA.... Would require the use of judgement and common sense..... we have to choose if we're hunting the kings squirrels, the kings turkeys, or the kings deer.....

At least a bow is legal for pretty much everything as long as you have a broadhead on the end of yer stick....

[ChuckC]

Naphtali.  

 No law enforcement officer in the US can make a warrantless search that I am aware of, even the Conservation wardens.   They CAN enter your private land without a warrant, but cannot come into your home for a search without a warrant.
ChuckC

[whitebuffalo]

AnointedArcher

Trad Gang Member
Member # 6746

  posted July 23, 2007 03:14 PM                        
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Tim, it's a good thing you bought your tag because I have seen Jason's truck and I don't think it could pull the bars out of the window anyway  
 

ALRIGHT THIS IS GONE WAY TO FAR NOW,,My truck aint too bad,,a little rusty but kinda trusty,,I think it could pull some bars out,,Maybe,,,,It says bronco on it DHHAAAA,,But it does have that awfull blue oval on it,,Should've never left my GM<

[nanook712]

ChuckC are you sure about that? I've heard the same thing. My reasoning would be that "probable cause" is interpeted far more leniently for game law violations.

[ibohuntwhitetails]

In Missouri a game warden with "probable cause" can do a search of your property including your home and vehicle without a warrent. Just as any law enforcement officer can search your car without permission if there is a plain sight violation giving them "probible cause". "Probable cause" can be any simple thing they can find. While on that subject they can also seize your property and any property they believe was used to commit the violation from the truck to the pocket knife. I had a goodie two shoe animal lover neighbor that called the CO on me last deer season stating I must have illegally taken the deer since I didn't get home till midnight with it. Truth to it was I didn't harvest the animal till just at dark and then a half hour wait to trail it led to a 2 hr drag and then a 2 hour drive around and brag to my buddies. Anyway when he showed up he caught me on a "wantingly wasting commonly edible portions of meat" violation because I didn't take all the meat I could from the neck and part of the ribs. After that "probable cause" he entered my house took all guns, bows, racks, turkey feathers anything related to hunting or fishing to his truck and searched my freezer. Then after going thru each story of each harvest and verifing that I had tagged it properly in their computer each thing was returned to me. At the end of a very long few hours turns out I didn't do anything wrong after all.  

In Missouri you also have to decide what you are hunting as you can only have one weapon in your possesion. And "taret shooting" with any weapon on public land has to be on a "range". But hunting is allowed.

Tom

[aromakr]

I had a warden try that with me in Calif. several years ago, and you just have to call their bluff, I did. I told him to either write me a ticket or leave me alone, he left me alone.
Bob

[James Wrenn]

You can not stump shoot on public land here either unless it is during hunting season and you have a hunting license.

[TRADITIONAL ONLY]

i dont care what they say, im still a youth so they ain gonna say anything to me. if they do oh well, work harder to avoiid them!

remember: its only illegal if you get caught!

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by ChuckC:
Naphtali.  

 No law enforcement officer in the US can make a warrantless search that I am aware of, even the Conservation wardens.   They CAN enter your private land without a warrant, but cannot come into your home for a search without a warrant.
ChuckC

They'd be looking down the wrong end of a 12 guauge side by side if they tried that around here....i'c tell em to go get a warrant, or piss up a rope....

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by TRADITIONAL ONLY:
i don't care what they say, im still a youth so they ain gonna say anything to me. if they do oh well, work harder to avoiid them!

remember: its only illegal if you get caught!

Bad attitude son....better regroup...this is a sport we are all proud of here. if you break the rules, you are cheating....that is what they call unsportsmanlike conduct....bad dog! No gravy....

[Brian Krebs]

whoa!!!!!!!!!
A law enforcement officer CAN search your house without a warrant in a few circumstances!!
 One is in hot pursuit. If an officer is chasing a criminal and he runs into a house- the officer does not have to have a warrant to enter the house and effect the arrest- and any illegal thing he might see in the process: is legal evidence.
 In the case of an escaped convict; or lost child; it can fall under hot pursuit.
 If you run into your house or garage - your domicile- and are being pursuited: don't think you can shoot it out because the officer doesn't have a warrant!!
  I once as a deputy sheriff; I approached a man carrying his 3 month old baby by its wrist- swinging it around; in an argument with his wife.
 I showed up and he took off with me in pursuit; and I chased him into someone elses house- a total stranger!
  My concern was for the little girl; and the home owner agreed to take the girl at first opprotunity and run. I got the guy to hand her the child: and well the lady took off with the kid; and I took off out the door with an unconcious suspect.
  He went to jail for assault with intent to committ great bodily harm; he pulled a knife on me outside the home and my partner took him down; and he ended up with a host of charges.
  If anyone had gotten in the way of this deputy while chasing that guy- he would have met my attention- and the ground.
 The little girl had a broken humerous;dislocated shoulder etc- but lived.
 And the lady homeowner who grabbed that girl to safety....well her house full of marijuana plants - I turned my back on- but that was my decision!!!
  So- you see how 'hot pursuit' is an exception.
So is 'allowing the vampire in'. If you tell the officer he can search- well you forfeit your right not to be searched; as its reasonable to search with permission.
  Thing you all need to look up and find out is about the officers authority.
  By that I mean is the officer a sworn officer of the law; or just an officer.
  Used to be; that game violations were rules; not criminal acts. So; officers that enforced them did not need to be certified police officers. And with that lack of certification; they did a lot of searchs that were and continue to be illegal without consent; probable cause; or a witnessed act by the officer.
  Now; most 'conservation officers' or 'fish and game officers' are certified police officers; as values were put on game animals; and game violations became crimes.
 As a certified officer; the officer MUST obey his oath; which is to respect and defend the constitution--- which includes searches!!!
 A fish and game officer used to be legal searching your car; but now; they need probable cause; or a warrant; or permission.
 If they say they will arrest you if you don't let them search- hey- let them arrest you. All evidence with a GOOD LAWYER will be "fruit of the poisonous tree"; and not allowable in court.
  There are officers here that issue tickets - knowing people will not fight the ticket...even though the person is not guilty... and the officers think it is funny: that they plead guilty !
  WE are all in a transition stage on the recognition of this; we can see how one officer says you need a license to shoot a bow on public land; and another says you don't.
  I bet the officer that is wrong would not accept YOUR argument of 'ignorance of the law'.
   You should not accept his or her 'ignorance of the law' either.
  We need fish and game officers; but too too often; these officers do not know the law; are fish and game officers because they cannot get a regular 'cop job'; and are working to that end- to get a 'real' cop job; and they will take prisoners to do it.
  Check your laws; and know if your in the right or wrong. Don't fight the officer if he or she is wrong; but do make sure the situation is resolved to your satisfaction -legally!!!!

[ChuckC]

Your car is not your house.  That has been established in law over the years.  If there is evidence in plain view, that can be used as probable cause TOWARD a search warrant.  As I recall, the only way that a law enforcement officer can legally enter your home without your permission is if he is in HOT PURSUIT of a felon that committed a serious crime that he witnessed, that means.... I am chasing you, you run into your home, and I run in after you with intend to arrest.  This typically does not include taking a deer out of season, but rather a murder or some such.

We do still have some rights here in the USA, but it is our job to know what they are.

TRAD ONLY.  Illegal is illegal.  Has nothing to do with getting caught.  Sounds like you are on your way to a troubled life if you really think that way.  No, it is not "cool".
ChuckC