CROSSBOW BILL IN MICHIGAN.....ALERT!!

[2-BIG]

Please contact your state Rep and the members of the "Tourism, Outdoor Recreation, and Natural Resources" and urge them to vote "NO" on HB 5741.
HB 5741 was introduced by Rep Sheltrown and it was originally worded to remove the authority to issue crossbow permits from the NRC/DNR to the Legislature. It also had included for those 69 and older to be able to use a crossbow in archery season.
It was heard before the Tourism, Outdoor Recreation, and Natural Resources Committe last week and the wording had been changed to include crossbows as legal archery equipment for all to use!
Here is a link to your state legislators including the Committee members:   http://house.michigan.gov/find_a_rep.asp  
Thank you for your help everyone!

[Arwin]

Well money had it's way and now this state is plagued with the crossbow virus!  :mad:      
 I cannot beleive this has happened. I always thought of myslef as an open minded individual, but I know the mind set of a perfectly able bodied person toting one of those pieces of crap! It's all about point and kill! No practice, no sense of tradition and what bowhunting really means. Just a bunch of slobs who want to put a hole in something.
 AHHHHHH!!!!!!!! Sorry if I am ranting but I HATE crossbows!! I can see if you are handicapped, then thats cool. But come on!! How did they sneak in using them for general use? My head is going to burst!

[2-BIG]

Arwin, it only passed Committee. It has to pass the house and then be signed into law by the Govenor. We've got a lot of fight left in us, they don't know it but they've woke a sleeping giant. Many guys I know that are everyday bowhunters that don't keep up on this stuff have got their feathers ruffled now!  

[Arwin]

Thanks 2-Big, I feel a bit better now. I just hope our governor doesn't follow along with the rest of the house.
 People, this is why it is so important to belong to a state bowhunting organization, that fights for what we believe in! It is also desperatly important to contact your states Reps and tell them what you think! I know I'll have several e-mails out today.

[tomwatson]

I contacted Rep. Sheltrown and I called him out on it. This was his reply:

Tom, The crossbow manufacturers haven't contributed any money to any legislators that I'm aware of.  The certainly haven't to me.  And I haven't asked.  My original motivation for this bill was three older men at my Baptist church in West Branch asking for automatic permits at age 69.  Since then, many other hunters have contacted me in support of full inclusion including many bow hunters.  The three organizations you mentioned speak for a very small minority of bow hunters in this state. -Joel

By the way the three organizations that I mentioned was Michigan Bowhunters, Michigan Traditional Bowhunters and Michigan Longbow Association. This guy won't listen, we need to vote him out in November. Also, we need to start a Petition to present to the Governor.

Tom

[2-BIG]

Kinda funnny that 3 older men at his church asked him to do this but since then "many" other hunters have asked him for full inclusion.  :rolleyes:  Why did the "many" hunters wait to come forward until after the 3 older fellas?   :confused:  I guess they were just being politically correct and letting the old guys to the head of the line!    When do we get to hear the "women and children" excuse?  :p

[owlbait]

I contacted my Rep and he replied he would consider my comment when it was time to vote.

[Redeye]

Owlbait, the vote in the House of Reps is over.  We need to concentrate on the Senate............tm

Michigan Bow Hunters ACTION ALERT!!!


The Michigan House of Representatives has just passed a substitute bill for HB5741 that would make the crossbow a weapon of choice during the archery deer season. If the bill becomes law, it will end bowhunting as we know it in Michigan, the nation’s top bowhunting state.


Michigan currently has more than 400,000 firearm deer hunters who have never taken up the challenge of bowhunting and who would flock to the bow season if they could shoot arrows with guns in October. The resulting social and biological impact will, in all probability, force the DNR to dramatically reduce the length of the archery deer season. The crossbow is not archery equipment, requires no archery skills and is much more user-friendly to firearm hunters than a conventional hand-held bow.


Bowhunting in Michigan faces its greatest threat in 72 years and the future of the sport rests in our hands. We all need to call our State Senator ASAP and urge him or her to vote AGAINST House Bill 5741-S2.


If you are not aware of who is your State Senator you can find out by going to
 http://senate.michigan.gov/FindYourSenator/michiganfys.asp

and enter your street address, city and zip code. Click on the "Submit Query" button for the information you'll need to contact your Senator. By phone is best especially since their emails are not read individually because of the volume which they receive.


Bruce Levey

President, Michigan Bow Hunters

[owlbait]

Sent a message to my Senator also. The point I want to make about my Rep. Hansen District 100 is that he replied he would "rely on my comment" yet he was a co-sponsor of the bill! What a gutless wonder!

[last arrow]

Owlbait,

I think your are getting the standard form reply sent by a staffer for your representative, I bet your senators will be similar.  The Representatives' and Senators' staffors will keep a tally of comments and they will generally only be influenced if the talley is very one sided.  Our problem isn't crooked politicians, although they exist.  The problem is that most people, hunters and non hunters alike,  see no difference between compound bows and cross bows in effectiveness or difficulty to use.  I was told by a salesman at the local Gander Mountain that they can have a new archer shooting a compound well enought to hunt within 2 hours of buying thier equipment. From what I have seen of high let off compounds and the associated accessories, I believe him. Thats not much of a barrier to entry into the archery season.  

The reason more gun hunters don't bow hunt is because the perception that shooting a bow takes lots of practice persists.  The addition of the cross bow will allow those that want to hunt during the archery season to participate even if they have the perception they cannot learn to shoot a bow.  Unfortanatly, with the combination license, this will not result in additional revenue for the Department (except a tempory influx of excise tax mony from cross bow sales, if the Feds decide to return it to the State).

[Dark_Timber_Ghost]

Men,

Is this really that big of an issue?  I am not from Michigan but I don't really see why having a few more hunters is a bad thing.  I would be more upset about baiting than crossbows.  I believe that baiting is allowed in all but 7 counties in Michigan.  Why is this not as big of an issue?  Maybe I am all wrong in my thinking, but I guess I just don't get it.

R/

Jason

[Redeye]

Yes it's that big.

[bc]

Hi Jason,

It's a big deal in this context:

In Michigan, our long archery season is premised on the extra effort involved in taking a whitetail with a "hand drawn, and hand held at full draw" bow. It's a fair chase fact that the movement of drawing one's bow inside the hyper zone of a whitetail is a lot harder than simply squeezing the trigger of a loaded crossgun, that can and often is resting on a limb or the sill of one's hunting shanty. These are hardly the semantic issues as the crossbow arms manufacturers propagandize.

Now, in Michigan, bowhunting stakeholders worked hard and did the heavy political lifting to assure any crossbow aficionados had an open season; crossbows are legal in gun season. We worked with the special needs hunters Orgs and with the NRC to establish liberal access to archery season. I even floated the proposition that a severely handicapped person could get a permit to use a firearm with the help of an enabler. Of course the crossbow lobby was not for that!

One must also realize, (and this is important) there is not now, nor has ever been, a grassroots crossbow constituency petitioning for inclusion in Michigan's  archery season. This whole affair, as with Pennsylvania, is driven by crossbow arms dealers who have bought  adroitly targeted politicians to do their bidding. It's that simple and that corrupt.

One last thing, Jason, could you ever in your wildest dreams imagine that a speargun fisherman would be allowed to snorkel the Madison or any other hallowed river, for brown trout rising to the hatch? I mean, what's the big deal, a dead fish is a dead fish. Of course one would have to believe that the concept of fair chase is just another traditional institution whose time has passed.

It's a big deal in Michigan and that's why bowhunters with fair chase core values are outraged by the blatant corruption of some of our politicians.

best,

bc

[Dark_Timber_Ghost]

BC, First of all good post, and thanks for sheading a little more light on the situation.  I guess I can understand the situation a little better.  Anyway, good luck to you Michigan boys,(but not in Foot Ball, Go Tigers) I hope you get it all worked out for the best.  Happy hunting

R/

Jason

[owlbait]

My State Senator replied that he was against opening seasons for crossbows but would allow/vote to extend its use to more hunters with disabilities.

[Daddy Bear]

I will make a few posts to showcase my thoughts and the marketing strategy that was developed by the ATA after Georgia:

(how will this affect YOUR season? Please specify.)

My thoughts:

A crossbow is not a bow. Hunting with a crossbow is not bow hunting. A crossbow has no more business in a bow and arrow only season than does a handgun, shotgun, or a rifle. Every major bow and arrow user organization and every major bow hunting organization across the entire country is against this move. Tax dollars(sales and excise tax), commercialism, and greed are the only driving force behind this manufacturer national lobby effort. Your local officials are being courted with dollars, tackle, and hunting trips. There is no regard for archery, the future of archery, and all the hard work of so many who helped establish special archery seasons.
Crossbow use in archery season is nothing more than an advertising push of the crossbow manufacturers, facilitated by the Archery Trade Association and other surrogate marketing agents. No sportsmen’s groups are petitioning for this legalization of crossbows, only the profiteers. These backdoor deals between these groups and your local officials gives the good name of archery a black eye. How in the world could 100% of the bowhunting organizations in my state compete against the big dollars in such dealings when our state officials were being given equipment and hunting trips to Africa. When our local businessmen were given exclusive deals with the crossbow manufacturers if they showed support. Just look at our current game regs book which is now partly funded by this group and has turned into a commercialized sales pitch for the lobby group with multiple full page color adverts for the various crossbow makers. Read the minutes of the meetings and note how the local hunting expert who was used to pitch the move has since dumped all bow and arrow archery tackle from his outdoor sports store and now is an exclusive dealer of crossbows through the ATA.
I have no dislike of the crossbow itself and one should be able to hunt with such a weapon. But not in a bow and arrow season.

later,
Daddy Bear

[Daddy Bear]

Motive as to why Lee Zimmerman and the ATA group developed a 50state strategy to target local state officials. This is straight from the ATA:

That bright spot was the ever-controversial crossbow. Why? The No. 1 reason was that Georgia passed a law to allow crossbows during its four-month archery season. As a result, the crossbow market picked up in 2002. “The crossbow market was hotter than a pistol,” said Erik Watts, CEO of Easton Outdoors. “It’s all tied to new seasons and new opportunities. Anytime you have a special season, there will be huge potential. Without special seasons, it’s just another product category. For areas with new seasons and new opportunities, there’s talk that crossbows will be archery’s next growth spurt. For areas where the seasons are unchanged and there is no special opportunity, it’s no big deal. “Crossbows are here to stay, but let’s remember that growth centers on having a season. That’s the way things have always been.”

Lee Zimmerman, vice president of sales and marketing for Horton Manufacturing Co. Inc., in Tallmadge, Ohio, agrees. He said Horton had an exceptional year with “extremely strong” growth. He credits the Georgia decision for his company’s success. “One shop we heard about in Georgia sold eight crossbows in 2001, but in 2002 that shop sold eight to 12 crossbows every day all summer,” Zimmerman said.

Daddy Bear

[Daddy Bear]

The ATA 50state strategy was revealed during an ethics violation probe of Ohio officials who took discounts, gifts, and trips from the ATA. This was reprinted by permission from the Columbus Dispatch newspaper:

Crossbow discounts defended:

(Company gives ODNR employees break on prices; department officials say no ethics rules violated.)

The world's largest maker of crossbows offers deep discounts to every employee of the Ohio Department of Natural Resources, the agency that regulates hunting.
An official with the company, Horton Crossbows of Tallmadge in Summit County, said it's part of a national effort to support states friendly to crossbow hunting, such as Ohio, and to win over states that aren't.
"It's a national program that we offer to all 50 states," said Lee Zimmerman, vice president of sales for Horton.
The Ohio Ethics Commission, which interprets conflict-of-interest questions for state agencies and employees, generally recommends against accepting gifts.
State employees have been prosecuted under the ethics law or fired for receiving golf outings, meals and other valuable freebies.

Daddy Bear

[Daddy Bear]

This is an example of the behind the scene wheeling and dealing with the government officials who hold the vote to change the regulations in favor of the ATA group. I have a photograph taken of this "unofficial planning meeting" by corporate Horton that I would gladly email to one of you if you could post the picture on this thread. The below description of this "unofficial planning meeting" came directly from the Horton Corporate Newsletter:

"The Horton Company hunting camp was the scene for an unofficial planning meeting between the ATA and the Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies (AFWA). Representing AFWA was John Frampton, executive committee chair and South Carolina Department of Natural Resources director; and Carol Bambery, legal counsel for AFWA. ATA attendees included Mitch King, director of government relations; and Jay McAninch, CEO/president. Horton attendees included CEO Rick Szekelyi; Lee Zimmerman, sales and marketing vice president; and Ottie Snyder, Horton's crossbow educator and media specialist."

Daddy Bear

[Daddy Bear]

Here is a recent (June 23, 2008) example of the fruits from the gifts, hunting trips, and lobbying efforts of Lee Zimmerman and the ATA folks. This came from the Horton Corporate Newsletter:

The Louisiana Department of Wildlife and Fisheries regulations for bow and arrow will now read: Longbow, compound bow and crossbow or any bow drawn, held or released by mechanical means will be a legal means of take for all properly licensed hunters.
Jimmy Anthony, Assistant Secretary, LDWF, said, “ This change gives the hunter (or potential hunter) more options on how they would like to hunt. We would like to say, ‘Thank you,’ to the legislature and the governor for getting these acts signed into law.” - Horton

Daddy Bear