How have land leases affected hunting?

[Arkansaslongbow]

I lease 200 acres every year and the landowner only gun hunts; I am the only hunter allowed on his property because he knows I will take care of it and police it as the same time;

To answer the question, it's becoming a rich mans race for sure; the "big boys" who are able to shell out the dough are getting most of the land that's out there; but here in Arkansas there are literally millions of acres(yes I said millions) that are public land and some pretty good hunting as well;

[Morning Star]

That being said, how does everyone else feel about it?

Leasing = limited / exclusive

There's a lot more people loosing out than winning with this trend.
 
When our working class no longer has reasonable access to quality hunting areas, we will loose a huge foundation of support for conservation and our hunting heritage.
I feel it will eventually erode the hunting establishment in this country.  You just need to look at some of the European countries to see how it has already played out.

Obviously, I'm not a fan of leasing.  One of my pet peeves are guys who get on these hunting forums and whine about loosing their lease to another hunter.  If ya play that game......be prepared to loose.

[Bonebuster]

"There`s a lot more people losing out than winning in this trend"

That pretty much sums it up.

A slippery slope.

[jcar315]

Working class? What exactly does that mean? I go to work every day and work hard for my paycheck just like everyone else on this site does.

Every year I am happy to pay for access to hunt good quality farmland close to home. Does this make me a bad guy? Does this make me some sort of "big guy" stepping on the "littles?" I'm somehow hurting the sport of hunting???

Leasing does not always = big money.

[Don Batten]

Not many folks gonna pass up that basket racked 8 on public land, or the cowhorn for that matter. At least where I live. Only way to have a chance at seeing some decent bucks( I say that with tounge in check, cause out area has never produced any) is to get into a situation where there is some control over what is taken. I know it's expensive, but some folks golf, bassfish, motorhome and what ever. I paid my club dues this year,almost with aluminum cans (most picked up on public land roads). That said, I got out of another club i was in when the dues went up. I think I'll be fine hunting wise though.

I often thought that the money Ive spent on club dues would have been better spent just to take one big trip away every year. Don

[varmint101]

Lost my best turkey ground to it and all they do is deer hunt gun season.  BUT maybe if I'd made different choices I'd have had the cash to do the same.  I don't dislike them for it.  I still have good turkey ground and half of that is public so hopefully it won't go anywhere!

[Davt]

"the hunting is better but less enjoyable" Now that is an interesting statement and to me really gets at the core of what is wrong with hunting these days. We measure the success of of being outdoors in pursuit of game by what and how many we bag. In my book the above statement is an impossibility. I think that the business of hunting has caused far more damage to hunting than a thousand PETA's. We have lost our way in an attempt to turn a lifestyle into a sport. I think it is sad that a guy of modest means cannot take his kid hunting because of the cost of a lease or lack of public funds. Sadly I don't think there is much we can do about it because I think most hunters would rather count a score than the hours of being in gods nature.

[Traditional-Archer]

Wow this is a good one. I lease 300 acres me along with 8 others started out at 1$ an acre 15 years ago it up to 10$ an acre now. Why am I a bad guy for wanting a good place for my son to hunt, yes us leases’ can take are kids hunting we only turn into monsters after they go home. We also post the land, oh wait we are told by the land owner we must post, so as he doesn’t get sued again.
Come on guys enjoy the sport for what it is, I hunt our lease. I hunt NY, MD, PA, private land, did I have to hunt? oh yes land and permission. That is it, was it hard no not really. Knock on some doors it can be done I did it. Hunting is what you make it, but I wanted my son to see some game. State land here what a joke just ask anyone who hunted state land last year a week, 3 to maybe 6 deer that’s crazy. How will that keep my son hunting with me? I know some of you are saying your son would have to hunt and not just kill then. Think, what do you want, this is what I want, we are truly not the same not all of us. Does it help the sport? It makes a difference to my son and that is what I want him to do hunt.
Would he hunt if we went out and hunted for weeks and saw little amounts of deer? We hunt archery he uses his long bow me my recurve, we hunt rifle together and muzzleloader “am I bad” just a thought.
Bruce      
   

[Kevin Dill]

One thing I constantly hear..."They took my land away from me."  If you didn't own it, it wasn't yours. Nobody took anything away from anyone. The landowner made a concious decision to use his property as he saw fit and right. Who can argue with that? Who would have the gall to tell a landowner he can't control what happens on his land?

If you let a guy pasture his horse on your land free...another guy comes to you and says "I'll pay you $2000 a year to pasture my horse"...would that not cause you to think?

[adkmountainken]

i myself would NEVER pay to hunt land. thank God i live in an area with alot of public land. as had been stated you will se less and less younger people hunting which is a shame.

[HB3]

I think leasing can be good for the wildlife. I see people  on leases willing to put in food plots, plant hardwoods and do other improvments to the property that will improve hunting for future generations. The people who lease are also in some cases more selective about what they shoot and will hold other member accountable for what they shoot. On public land most people are not going to let a legal animal walk because of the competition. To me it is similar to  owning the land and wanting to improve it rather than just using it. If you can't afford to own it maybe you can lease it. There are always reasonable leases for those willing to look hard enough.

[SS Snuffer]

In my area mosts land is private and what gets me is when one person owns 500 acers which contains 150 to 200 deer and they shoot mabey two deer per year. All the farms around them feed the deer all year but are not allowed to harvest any and of course only the two largest bucks will be taken. Not good management.

[Don Stokes]

Chuck, that's an awful lot of deer on 500 acres. Mild winters?

I went the club/leased land route after giving up on public land because of the slobs and thieves.

Down South, much of the leased land is owned by big timber companies. They lease out the land in large tracts to control liability, and require the lease holders to put up gates, patrol the property, manage the game, buy insurance, etc. It can be a good deal for both sides. The land is usually leased by a club, and the fellowship afforded by the club can be very rewarding, too. Here in MS, the State will supply a biologist to help with game management for qualified clubs.

However, prices are getting so high that it's rapidly becoming a wealthy man's game, and the average guy/gal may not be able to afford to participate. Bummer.

[2 Barrels]

In my opinion leasing is a bigger danger to our way of life then PETA or crossbows.And fellas this is not a sport.Thats the whole problem the hunting industry has sold that sport crap.And when you get right down to it competition is what drives leasing.As far as kids hunting i'd bet most of us started on small game.This is where we learned to love hunting.If some guy hell bent on killing a (MONSTER BUCK) every year because thats the only way he can enjoy hunting anymore.Has every thing leased up and cant stand the thought of letting a kid on HIS place to hunt.Because he will mess up the deer he has 300 trail cam pictures of.I'm sorry guy's but this is my pet peev.And i think we see the truth in the matter by how defensive the lease guys are about this topic.It's not really about the hunting it's about being able to control the perameters of the hunt.For these guy's and is that what hunting really is?Thank's for letting me vent.Jim Preece

[pickaspot]

Double edged sword from my perspective. We manage better than ever and the quality of our hunting is very good. BUT, it now comes at a big cost - both time and $$.

I really miss the simple old days when it was a simple matter of just going hunting. Ww are fortunate to have a small close knit group in my lease...I have less fortunate buddies who have to deal with a lot of politics and frustration.

Also, leases & big game hunting has lead to a decrease in small game hunting in our neck of the woods. That spells bad news for youngsters & the future.

[Buckeye Trad Hunter]

The property that we used to hunt on was owned by a very well known paper company and was open to the public before it was leased.  The paper company maintained and improved the land and such.  Being that this wasn't privately owned land does that make the situation any different?

To clarify I wasn't saying they took my land away or whatever, I'm just asking how everyone else feels about the lease situations.  By the way when 20 people are on the lease and only 2-5 of them hunt it does reult in poor game management.  What's up with that anyway?  Why spend the amount of money these guys have spent only to take up a spot on a lease that you haven't hunted in the 12 years you've been leasing it?

[mgompf]

Just my two cents…
The change in hunting/ land access is due more to the fact the society has changed from a rural/agricultural one to a city dwelling/technology driven one. In my area leasing is less of a problem than the building of houses and erosion of habitat. I can’t tell you the # of farms that my father hunted that are now nothing but houses and roads.
Also what I have seen is the older generation is who owns the farms but they typically stop farming it and pass along the responsibility to their children who typically don’t want anything to do with farming so the land is either sold or rented for crop production and these folks don not want to deal with letting hunters on the land.
I can see leasing being a problem but the bigger problem is a societal one.

[mrjsl]

When I was growing up, you could stop most anywhere along any road and hunt. Why? There weren't any deer.

My dad and a friend of his bowhunted in the 60's and they never saw any deer, because there just weren't any deer. Very few people bowhunted, and there were way fewer deer hunters in general.

Deer population goes up, demand to hunt them goes up.

I live in a place where there is a lot of public land around, and a lot more leased up land in clubs etc.

I have only been to one club in my state that doesn't bait deer with corn or whatever. I go there a lot (18 years) because one of my best friends is in it. I do not deer hunt there too  much because I am technically a guest. But it is the best deer place I have ever seen - it will spoil you for wanting to hunt anywhere else. It is the only lease I have ever seen that is worth it.

I've been approached to join various clubs over the years and for deer hunting I don't think it worth my while. You are forced to hunt the way other members hunt in the ways that matter (you have x number of stands, in x area, etc...).

However, because of Cabela's and Bass Pro, and Hunting on TV, people put less pressure on public land than ever in my part of the world. It's difficult to implement complicated stand set ups, feeders not allowed, trail cams not allowed, bait... not allowed. No food plots of your own. Lots of times you can't find a 4 wheeler trail where you want it, or you aren't allowed to ride on it. Public land is a pain in the ass for  people who have lots of high tech hunting products, and therefore they say screw it and join a lease where they can hunt using all the proper products. Where I live, if there is a piece of public land with limited access by truck/ATV, then it's not overly pressured because people just aren't going to work that hard when there are easier ways to kill deer.

Personally I would rather hunt where no one else wants to go. On public land where they soil quality is such that no bucks can grow to trophy size, etc. Where no one is baiting, and no one has cameras strung up all over the woods, etc. No deer farmers allowed. I have been in the woods and seen and killed big bucks. In the right place it is not hard. I value solitude and a challenge, so I seek out thos kind of places. Where I live, that is public lands usually.

[Paul/KS]

Here in Kansas there has been an increase of leased hunting land. I know a large farm up the road is leased to an outfitter.
The state also leases land and that allows it to be used as walk in hunting only public land so it goes two ways...

[rascal]

Honestly Im surprised that this is such a divisive issue, haves and have nots it seems.  As stated before Im not rich, I dont own a single custom bow (to be fair my wife owns one) I build my own from staves I cut myself or buy at reasonable prices.  I buy used equipment whenever possible, I mend the torn, I fix the broken to save a few bucks on my gear.  I save relentlessly to afford and justify my lease.  I am blue collar, I am in fact the little guy that is suppose to be losing out because of the big fat cats leasing all the land.  Ive never even owned a brand new vehicle, Im the poster child for just your average guy.  I have a lease because Im willing to compensate a land owner for the use of something I cant afford to own, to do something that Im extremely passionate about.  I let friends and relatives hunt for free, I take my kids and friends kids onto the property for youth hunts etc.  The "good ole boys" using the land for FREE for all the years before this lease was established threw garbage all over the land, left hardware in the trees, drove 4x4s all over the place with guns hanging out the windows, shot at but didnt bother tracking game, they trespassed after the lease was established and were extremely unapologetic for their lawless behavior, shot deer out of stands that were obviously not theirs, tore down signs posting the land, stole stands that I had put up!!!  Now I dont know about all of you but I can tell you while I hunted public land with all of these so called little guys, I had people sit in my stands, Ive had shots with guns so close to me that I needed a fresh pair of shorts, had game animals claimed that were with out a doubt mine, picked up more trash and put up with more rude behavior than I could tolerate.  I want my kids to love hunting as much as I do, I want them to see some game, I want them to know that at the end of a long blood trail we arent going to just find a gut pile indicating that some slob stole their animal, I want them to be safe... my lease ensures this.  

Honestly leases havent ruined hunting for anyone, anyone can save for a lease or create a group to get a lease.  You can find deals out there, its like finding a job, you work at it, you network, you pool resources etc.  Why exactly would you expect a land owner to offer a product for no compensation?  What protects the land owner from rude and destructive behavior on his property?  

I lease because I expect everyone that hunts around me to be an ethical hunter, to hunt safely and to be respectful of the land and animals.  Its not that much to expect really and I think we all probably want that, now try to find it on public land or while trespassing on private land.  People have changed, behaviors have changed, these changes have forced a change in the game.  In my experience the loudest opponents of leases in my area are the biggest reason for land owners to shut down free access to their land.


On a side note:  Hunting is a sport, yes I said it is a sport. I dont, you dont, we dont need to hunt to survive the winter (on average, Im sure that there are exceptions).  Store bought food is much much much more economical than wild game even if it isnt as nutritionally sound.  Figure out how much you spend to get that deer in the freezer(time, travel, gear, licenses) and you absolutely could afford some of the best food in the super market on a per pound basis comparison.  If you spent the same hours working overtime at your job as chasing game you could probably have the same volume of food prepared for you by a master chef.