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Author Topic: GEORGIA BAITING BILL  (Read 3641 times)

Offline bama

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GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« on: April 20, 2011, 09:12:00 AM »
I read the below article yesterday.

Legislators Pass Baiting Bill Only the Governor's signature stands between legalized baiting for Southern Zone deer hunters. By GON Staff Posted Thursday April 14 2011, 1:28 PM The Georgia House of Representatives voted today, April 14, the final day of the legislative session, to approve House Bill 277, the "Baiting Bill."

The only remaining step before HB 277 becomes law is the signature of Gov. Nathan Deal.

The Baiting Bill will allow Southern Zone hunters to hunt deer and hogs over bait with no distance requirements.

The Baiting Bill does not allow Northern Zone hunters to deer hunt over bait. Northern Zone hunters would be subject to the existing law, which requires hunters be 200 yards away from and out of sight of bait to hunt deer. However, the Baiting Bill would allow Northern Zone hunters to hunt hogs any day of the calendar year over bait with no distance requirements.

The House had already once voted in favor of HB 277, but the state Senate had made a change to the House version, so the House had to vote again to approve the bill with the Senate change. The House today voted 110-39 to agree to changes made in the Senate.

The Senate amendment, and the reason the Baiting Bill went back to the House for another vote, addressed concerns over Northern Zone properties because of the 200-yard rule. Feed placed within 200 yards of a property boundary could cause hunters on an adjoining property to be hunting illegally too close to feed. This is not new. It has been an issue for a decade, since the 200-yard rule was first implemented. The Senate amendment made it so deer hunters would not be in violation of baiting law for feed placed on an adjoining property.

Offline BWD

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2011, 09:17:00 AM »
If two Northern zone fellows, with adjoining properties, wanted to bait, they could legally help each other out for sure.
"If I had tried a little harder and practiced a little more, by now I could have been average"...Me

Offline Blueridge

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2011, 10:16:00 AM »
this is a sad day for deer hunting in Ga. maybe they are trying to draw a bunch of these TV hunters in to make "hunting" shows.
Bad move in my opinion.
The term "hunting" is used very loosely.
Isaiah 1:18-20 Come now let us reason together, says the Lord.

Offline BWD

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2011, 11:16:00 AM »
To me the beginning of the sad days in Ga. was back when they raised the limit on does to ten.
"If I had tried a little harder and practiced a little more, by now I could have been average"...Me

Offline GRINCH

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2011, 11:26:00 AM »
Alabama supposedly has a similar bill,don't agree with it but it's already happening.
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Offline Blueridge

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2011, 11:29:00 AM »
That was a bad move too. I don't know anyone who shoots 10 does during a season but the fact that you can shoot them beginning day one, Everything goes nocturnal alot sooner.  Season is a lot longer and should be moved backwards not forward.
They really screwed bow season up by starting it too early. Hunting in Ga. is good , its just "different" from the way it used to be when I started in 1970. Baiting is just not needed here, of course nobody had food plots back in the early days either. "the times they are a changing"
Isaiah 1:18-20 Come now let us reason together, says the Lord.

Offline Blueridge

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2011, 11:33:00 AM »
the 200 yd rule is a joke anyway. that just opened the door for a lot of corn in the woods.
No more scouting for trails , rubs , scrapes.
makes it real easy now.
Isaiah 1:18-20 Come now let us reason together, says the Lord.

Offline dixiearcher

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2011, 11:40:00 AM »
Baiting is allowed here in arkansas and it is sad...however it is not allowed on state owned land and wildlife management areas so there are still a few refuges for those of us who still want to hunt the way it used to be...and should be in my opinion
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Offline tarponnut

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2011, 11:45:00 AM »
It's definitely needed for the hogs. You certainly can't eliminate them, but at least put a dent in the population.

Where I lease(in Fl), deer(bucks actually) rarely come to a feeder during daylight hours.It's definitely not like shooting fish in a barrel.

Thanks for the update.

Offline Blueridge

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2011, 12:07:00 PM »
I'm ok with baiting for hogs which is allowed by land owners only after deer season and before turkey season starts. we are beginning to have a hog problem here in North Ga. where we didn't used to. I think the 300-200yd. baiting law a few years ago has something to do with that too.
Isaiah 1:18-20 Come now let us reason together, says the Lord.

Offline DesertDude

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2011, 12:12:00 PM »
:coffee:
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Offline bama

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2011, 12:14:00 PM »
I'm assuming it passed because of popular support in the southern half of the state.  That being said, if its the will of the people, I'm fine with it.

Offline Uncle Buck

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2011, 12:27:00 PM »
I grew up in Michigan where pretty much unrestricted baiting was allowed for a while. In my opinion it made the deer more nocturnal and wary. It also disrupted the natural order of nature. concentrating them in areas and teaching them to depend on rotting piles of sugar beets. eventually diseases pop uo in the herd. To make matters worse the DNR in Michigan is run by political hacks and not real conservationists. I would hate to see the same thing happen in Georgia

I personally think the real root of out of control herds  herds is the dramatic decrease in the number of hunters. Too many people are too busy to take a kid hunting or fishing

Offline Blueridge

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2011, 12:32:00 PM »
I guess you could drink a lot of coffee while propped up watching a bait pile huh.
Isaiah 1:18-20 Come now let us reason together, says the Lord.

Offline stabow

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2011, 12:46:00 PM »
I have a feeder in my back yard and been feeding the deer now for over 2 years it’s not to hunt over , the wife and I like to watch them from our back porch. I seen one spike in those 2 years the rest have been does. IMHO I think a bunch of people will be spending a lot of money on corn for no reason.....stabow
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Offline rascal

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2011, 01:59:00 PM »
I grew up in Michigan as well, hunted a lot before and after baiting became the prefered method of hunting deer.  Trust me baiting works!  Ive hunted over bait and shot bucks off bait piles.  Not just little bucks, I shot respectable, representitive bucks for the area. I cant say as it was the method I prefered but it was a legal activity none the less.  Later when I decided I just didnt like the method and switched to no bait it became a challenge to find suitable spots that would produce shots at good bucks during daylight hours.  Half the time I ended up setting up on a travel route to some other persons bait without knowing it.  Eventually I found places to hunt where baiting had little effect on the deer, I didnt see the number of deer I would have over bait but I hunted on my terms which suited me.  I guess in the end I had to look at it this way, it was legal and if I didnt like it I could choose not to do it.
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Offline Mojostick

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2011, 07:03:00 PM »
In Michigan, baiting has created a Hatfields and McCoys between baiters and non-baiters, after a bait ban was put in place in 2008 as a result of a CWD action plan created in 2002, followed by a CWD positive deer found in an enclosure in 2008.

The bait ban was the unanimous decision of all the deer biologists in the DNR. They still want the bait ban.

Michigan has longterm TB in the deer herd, a case of CWD in a pen...and a solid 50% or more of the deer hunters are demanding that the bait ban be lifted. In fact, most of those never stopped baiting, they only reduced the amounts, according to bait sales figures. Bait for sale is still found everywhere.

In my opinion, in light of what we know now about baiting vs 20 years ago, baiting is a symptom of our society's thirst for instant everything. Instant gratification, instant communication, instant success, etc.
We see it in schools pushing that kids shouldn't keep score because the kids that work the hardest shouldn't score more than the kids who put in less effort.

Love bait or hate bait, one cannot argue that it's widespread use in Michigan has created large numbers of now two generations of Michigan hunters that know of no other way to deer hunt other than to bait and baiting is the only tactic they employ. Without bait, even in a state with 1,500,000 deer, they claim they don't see deer without bait. This opinion is now the opinion of roughly 300,000 Michigan deer hunters.

The bait debate has it's pro's and con's on all sides.

The pro bait argument is that some people don't have time to scout or "go to the deer", so as a way to "level the playing field", those folks should be able to bait in order to enjoy the hunt like the next guy. Many people don't hunt much and aren't very knowledgeable, or they're hunting poor deer habitat or in area's with few deer and bait gets them into seeing game. As far as disease threats, the pro bait folks see no difference in drawing power of bait vs other food sources and claim the deer biologists are wrong with some hidden agenda.

The pro "natural" argument is that bait disrupts natural deer movements and the act of many people repeatedly replenishing bait sites makes deer nocturnal, just as the crush of 600,000 Michigan hunters 2 days before firearms opener puts the deer on notice. The view of these folks is that nothing draws deer like bait, and that bait (corn, apples, sugar beets, carrots) in a pile is like crack cocaine to deer.

Another argument is, on public land, some hunters squat on baited sites and the non-baiter gets edged out of public lands baited by another.

I'd baited in the past. In fact, in the unrestricted baiting days, we baited heavily, because we had to in order to keep up with all the neighbors. It got to the point where the DNR even coined a term for it, "defensive baiting".

In my opinion from that experience, bait is like crack to deer, but widespread baiting turns deer sightings into a "last light" event, due to the human activity/pressure of baiting, so the piles usually get hit hard after dark. In fact, if bait isn't such the draw, regardless if after dark, why are so demanding it's return? The truth is, bait is king in drawing power in the deer woods and he with the biggest and most piles usually wins. The only problem is, the tracks and sign of the 20 deer that hit the bait may have all been at midnight.

To me, a bait pile is also like a smoker in a crowded room. He thinks he has the right to smoke and the other non-smokers around him want him to stop. If a smoker wants to smoke at home or in his truck, that's fine. But when he lights up at the table next to my family in a public place, then it becomes my problem, even though I never asked for it. Since deer are a public resource, one cannot claim total landowner "rights". Unlike a neighboring ag field or orchard, which everyone knows is there well before any hunt, a neighboring bait pile affecting all the deer movement around it can pop up anywhere, at any time, often in the middle of the night.

I hope our bait ban stays in place. Our hunting has been much better after the ban, likely because even though many still bait, they bait far less because they don't want to get caught.
We're seeing much more deer movement hours before and after last/first light, because the deer get up to seek normal foods. Before the bait ban and many baited with larger piles, deer movement was often right at last/first light. But sadly, I think so many folks are so used to the practice, (addicted to it) and unable or unwilling to use other tactics, that the folks who think they need bait are going to bait no matter the law.

If you guys get baiting, I hope for your sake it's only a 1 gallon limit and corn only. You may also wish to suggest that it be on private land only, like Ohio and North Dakota do, because if you're a public land hunter in area's with decent hunter pressure, you're scouting efforts will likely be for naught, if others are baiting nearby.

Here's among the best video's I've seen on the subject, from the North Dakota DNR...

    http://gf.nd.gov/multimedia/pubs/baiting-video.html    

Here's also a very recent story from the Detroit Free Press on the issue that the Michigan NRC may vote to allow baiting in the LP again...

    http://www.freep.com/article/20110417/SPORTS10/104170630/1058/Eric-Sharp-Ted-Nugent-shouldn-t-support-deer-baiting    

Eric Sharp: Ted Nugent shouldn't support deer baiting

Apr 17, 2011  

"Routine bovine Tuberculosis (TB) surveillance testing conducted by the Michigan Department of Agriculture and Rural Development and the U.S. Department of Agriculture recently found two bovine TB positive beef herds in Alpena County located in the Modified Accredited Zone."

Anyone who read that announcement last week and still thinks we should resume deer baiting in the Lower Peninsula doesn't care about Michigan's deer, never mind that two more Michigan farmers might see all of their cattle slaughtered.

You might argue that because you hunt many miles from Alpena County, you should be allowed to bait. But where do you draw the line? Fifty miles from the infected farm? One hundred miles? Two hundred?

The reason TB hasn't become commonplace in deer outside the core area (although there have been scattered cases) is because the Department of Natural Resources has contained it to the northeast lower.

Bad management decisions in the middle 1990s underestimated the threat from bovine TB, which reached a rate of 4.9% in deer at the core area in 1995. But the DNR overcame a late start and brought the incidence of disease down by drastically dropping deer numbers and banning baiting and feeding.

But as deer numbers dropped, so did the number of people who went to that area to hunt deer. That led to illegal baiting and feeding by many people who continued to hunt there, and the infection rate was still 1.9% at the core last year.

Deer bait is sold openly by businesses throughout the TB zone. Even after the baiting ban was extended following the discovery of chronic wasting disease in a single deer on a game ranch, deer bait continued to be sold blatantly by businesses that knew it would be used illegally by hunters who knew it's illegal to use it.

We don't yet understand everything about the transmission of diseases such as bovine TB and CWD, but we do know they spread from animal to animal, so deliberately concentrating those animals will spread disease.

Recently, rock star Ted Nugent told Gov. Rick Snyder that baiting should be allowed in Michigan -- and that we should not require people to buy turkey licenses because the birds are as common as mosquitoes.

This brought down the wrath of groups such as the National Wild Turkey Federation, which pointed out that hunters' license money brought the wild turkey back from the edge of extirpation in much of America.

Nugent is a rock star whose career depends on getting public attention. Because of that he has more than once made a statement that was outrageous or thoughtless.

But his defense of baiting is more than disingenuous. Last year Nugent was fined $1,750 after pleading no contest for baiting deer in California and not having a properly signed hunting tag. He managed to plea-bargain away another charge of illegally killing a deer, which would have had far more serious consequences.

Had Nugent been convicted on the illegally killing a deer charge, he would not have been able to buy hunting licenses for up to three years in many states, including Michigan.

Nugent also told Snyder that the state should not try to ban game ranches and that the threat from feral pigs is greatly exaggerated. Once again, Nugent's claims need to be taken with a bucket of salt: He owns game ranches in Michigan and Texas (where he now lives) and sells canned hunts.

Nugent's Web site said he charges $5,500 for people to hunt buffalo with him at his fenced Sunrize Acres facility in Michigan. And people can pay up to $7,700 on his Texas ranch to hunt various Asian and African antelope, sheep and deer. They can also hunt whitetails with him there, but it costs extra (the Web site says "call for pricing").

Nugent sells hunts for "wild boar," which makes his statement about feral pigs less than disinterested. (Michigan's wild pig problem began with escapees from game ranches.) Though he might not be concerned about them, wildlife, agriculture and environmental agencies in several states spend millions of dollars each year to try to eradicate wild swine and repair the damage they do.

At the federal Merritt Island Wildlife Refuge in Florida (home to the Kennedy Space Center), trappers remove 2,500 or more wild swine each year, and car-pig collisions are a serious problem. The ancestors of those swine were introduced by the Spanish 400 years ago, but they still breed like rabbits.

Michigan's pig farmers are concerned about escaped swine because they say the feral animals can carry serious diseases that threaten a pork industry valued at about $500 million.

Ethical hunters understand that their primary concern isn't their desire to kill a specific animal or bird during the next open season but maintaining the health of all the wildlife and the habitats in which they live. Nearly as important is maintaining their image as ethical among that great mass of people who don't hunt but do vote.

If it's just about making it easier to kill deer, let's not stop at baiting. As one reader suggested, why not let hunters put sedatives in the bait to slow the deer and make them easier to shoot?

Whenever I hear hunters complaining about the threat from animal rights advocates, I tell them not to worry about that small group. If they want to see the biggest threat to hunting, many hunters need only look in the mirror.

Contact ERIC SHARP: 313-222-2511 or [email protected].

Offline Mojostick

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2011, 08:10:00 AM »
Here's some info on how baiting alters deer movement.

Here's SCI's full opposition to allowing baiting...

 http://www.scilowcountry.org/georgia_wildlife_baiting_controversy.htm

Deer Movement Patterns

 

Another behavioral change in deer frequently attributed to deer baiting is increased nocturnal activity.

 

1. A Mississippi study noted that 90% of bucks use of bait stations was during non-legal shooting hours.  Over 84% of total use occurred during the hours of darkness.

2. Normal diurnal: nocturnal movement ratios averaged 2.22 for bucks and 2.03 for does in a Georgia study.

3. A Texas study of baited and non-baited stands showed that deer use of baited stands became more nocturnal as the hunting season progressed.

4. A Michigan study documented that most feeding at bait stations occurred at night and daytime feeding was non-existent.

Offline bobman

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2011, 06:28:00 PM »
stands to reason when a deer can go to one spot and eat his fill in short order he wont have to forage around during the day for total caloric daily needs


baiters are not sportsman they are killers

Offline last arrow

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Re: GEORGIA BAITING BILL
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2011, 10:13:00 AM »
Great information and some excellent points Mojo.

I have encountered several problems with baiting in my 22 years of hunting state land in Michigan. First is the sense of ownership of an area having a bait pile gives some people.  They feel once their bait is set no one should be in the area for any reason.  Next, I have seen ATV and 4x4 trails established illegally to bait sites.  Bait piles, as practiced here, are ugly things in the wild with the resulting litter, rotting produce and cut trees you usually see.

A couple of other observations I have made recently. One is that since the bait ban in lower Michigan has been in place, I have seen more hunters in the woods on public land.  I have also been told by a teenager that he quit hunting because "siting in a tent watching a pile of carrots" wasn't much fun and didn't seem sporting.

Personally, there is no sense of adventure or connection to nature in baiting.  Those are what I believe ultimately hold young (and old) people's interest in all forms of hunting. I do not believe baiting results in more hunters.  

Hopefully, if you can keep baiting out of Georgia you will not have to experience the social issues and the disillusionment of the younger hunters that I have encountered in Michigan.
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