New York Proposals for 2012...Added Info

[joe skipp]

The latest news from the "Great" DEC here in NY...Need to act now. Letters to all NY Officials and Governor voicing our disapproval. Here is the verbage from NYB News letter:

Southern Zone Season Structure:

* open the archery-only season on October 1st,

* create a 3 day youth firearm season on the Columbus Day holiday weekend followed immediately by,

* a 4 day muzzleloading/bow season for antlerless deer only (including bowhunters),

* bow-only season continues through the 3rd Friday in November,

* open the regular season on the 3rd Saturday in November for 23 days (current season structure),

* a 9 day combined bow/muzzleloading season after the regular season (current season structure).

 

If this DEC plan is implemented, bowhunters in 2012 will only have a 5 days of uninterrupted archery-only hunting season.  After the deer drives start and the guns start going off, the deer will go running, including the mature bucks that will head to their safe hiding spots until the woods calm down in late December.

The archery-only season you enjoy now will cease to exist.

 

Northern Zone Season Structure:

* open the archery-only season on September 27th,

* 3 day youth firearms hunt on Columbus Day holiday weekend,

* bow-only season thru the next to last Friday in October (gain 4 days with no additional weekend opportunity),

* 7 day muzzleloading/bow season (moved back one week),

* regular season opens on the last Saturday in October thru the 2nd Sunday in December (moved back one week),

* 7 day muzzleloading with bow hunting included in season.

Additional proposals:

* The DEC can modify the bow and muzzleloading seasons as it sees fit, resulting in unpredictable season structures.

* Make additional portions of the bow season, in selected areas, antlerless only (no bucks).

* Allow for the use of crossbows in ALL the hunting seasons (legislation required).

* Open a youth-only firearms hunt during the 1st weekend of the Suffolk County January firearms season.

Proposed  Tag/Permit Structure  - FOR THE ENTIRE STATE

* eliminate all antlerless & either sex  tags, therefore no tags will be issued with bow or muzzleloading licenses,

* antlerless deer can ONLY be taken with deer management permits (DMPs) in selected areas,        

* the ONLY deer carcass tag that you will receive will be ONE buck tag with your big game hunting license.  Once a            buck is harvested it’s your only one and you’re done. In areas with no DMPs, or a DMP is not secured via the lottery, hunters can only harvest one antlered (buck) deer. Therefore if a buck is taken during the early bow season, the regular season and muzzleloading licenses that were purchased are useless,

* expand the antler restriction (3 antler points on one side) program in the Catskill region

[huskyarcher]

Im glad i live in North Carolina...

[LongStick64]

If this passes, the best you can do is find locations that have always been for the most part Archery Only. They are out there but slim pickings. Stupid question but why couldnt they have the youth gun during gun season. But the most alarming one is the combination muzzleloader and bow season. Hate to say it but someone is going to get shot.

[LongStick64]

And maybe that is what they want.....great way to prove that hunting is dangerous and needs to be abolished.

[joe skipp]

I bowhunt New Jersey and CT every year. Now..should this pass...90% of my time will be spent with my hunting buddies in Jersey and CT.

Basically my license will be for turkey and chasing walleyes and smallmouths around the Reservoirs.

[tarponnut]

In general, I think it sucks!
Most legislators, I would bet, don't know what a muzzleloader is.
Would you still be able to harvest does during bow season?(and not just the 4 day muzzle/bow antlerless hunt).
I do like the Oct 1 opener, even earlier would be good.
Do you think the three day youth season would spoil bow season?(not being facetious).
The places I hunt in Western NY would see very few youth hunters that weekend(that wouldn't already be bowhunting).

[trad.-ed]

I'm all for pushing our youth into the wilderness to learn the necessary skills of survival.  However, the introduction of a 4 day muzzleloader hunt as well as the proposal to remove the separate tags that we recieve when purchasing an archery or muzzleloader permit is just rediculous.  
The need to increase the hunting community numbers is understood, but why not add to the archery season not take away!  Perhaps one day the stick and string will be understood and looked upon as a select few individuals who enjoy the simplicities of our primative equipment and our embrace with mother nature.

[crotch horn]

Just a thought.... If we have to have guns going off during bow season for our youth then why not have it only open where there are nuisance permits being handed out? At least that way bow hunters can avoid those areas during that time. Plus the deer population is high in those areas so success rates for the kids should be high. Overpopulation could be helped & bow hunters can know where to go to avoid gun spooked deer. Why not even have the youth hunt in early September for only nuisance permit areas? Will give the deer time to settle down & save crop damage. Just thinking out loud.

[Al Dente]

Firearms already go off during the bow season from small game hunting.  BUT..., the whole reason why bowhunters lost a rut weekend and up to 10 calendar days from the bow season was to have a Saturday Firearms opening day so the kids can hunt without losing a school day.  As a side note, the Saturday opener was for a supposed 2% increase in hunter participation also.  This is a systematic plan by the DEC to decimate the bow season, and then the firearms season as well. Every hunter, not just bowhunters, need to open their eyes, wake up, and realize what is going on.  Pay more, get less, lose more days afield, share seasons, overlap seasons, one buck, reduced DMAPS, etc...  Very ugly, and 100% not based upon one shred of scientific data.

[ronp]

Very well said, Al.    

[no]

dont know what to think about this? I know many guys who shoot too many deer every year just cuz they can & always question weather the deer are used. I know that you only got one tag when I was a kid & had to get 3 hunters together for a party permit. Also now many guys using other guys tags. I remember my second archery season when I shot a small doe during archery & sat out firearms season because we didnt draw a party permit & didnt feel as though I lost out. I know something in this state must change because the system is broken, just not sure it should be this drastic? I dont mind at all the 1 buck limit but believe we should get a bow muzzleloader tag to harvest a doe. I couldnt find this on the dec website. Mike

[Ray]

I ONLY BOW HUNT and its been a while since I've got a deer.If this happens my odds will be even slimer.Who can I write to voice my opinion?

[no]

I did some checking & the buck only thing is only in areas where they dont issue DMP permits. Like the Adirondacks, you also net more bow hunting days & earlier when bucks can be patterned. Remember years ago you could shoot a doe on your buck tag during archery season. I think you will get a reg season & special season tag? Then you may draw a DMP. You will get one less tag for sure. I will keep my eye on this to see if anyone can clarify. Just trying to understand for sure.  Mike

[Stumpkiller]

Originally posted by joe skipp:
Southern Zone Season Structure:

* open the archery-only season on October 1st,

* create a 3 day youth firearm season on the Columbus Day holiday weekend followed immediately by,

* a 4 day muzzleloading/bow season for antlerless deer only (including bowhunters),

* bow-only season continues through the 3rd Friday in November,

* open the regular season on the 3rd Saturday in November for 23 days (current season structure),

* a 9 day combined bow/muzzleloading season after the regular season (current season structure).

If this DEC plan is implemented, bowhunters in 2012 will only have a 5 days of uninterrupted archery-only hunting season.

What Am I missing?  October 1st to the third week of November is 49 days.  Less three for youth and four for muzzleloader is 42 days of archery only.  Not five?  They're giving us two weeks and taking one back - but we can still bowhunt even though it's shared.  We're still ahead one week archery only.

[adkarcher]

Deer will certainly act different after a week long gun season, not your typical archery season once the guns go bang.  Happens up north here during the shared week, I can only imagine it will be even worse in the southern zone, especially the state land hunter.

The DEC is not giving bowhunters anything regarding extra time.  This is at best replacing the time lost back in 2005 where we lost up to 10 days when they moved to the Saturday opener.  Vermont recently vetoed a gun season in the middle of archery season, hopefully this will die too.

no - there are areas that you are not guarenteed a DMP as well, such as in 6K, where I am.  Typically get a DMP every 2nd, sometimes every 3rd year.  Short season, bucks only if you don't draw a tag, more or less makes the archery tag worthless when a working guy has maybe 6 weekend days to hunt....Night as well take a camera and enjoy the woods, save yourself some money...

[no]

Ken, I know 6k well & usually make it up there a few days just north of Rome. I grew up not far from there & have friends still there. Actually looking for a little piece of land near there. But anyway here is what I have been able to find out on another forum. I have asked the question as to if we can shoot 3 bucks(which I dont like either)or just 1? will lput up the response when I hear.  Mike

Penrod and Maspaci, I am on both the NYS Conservation Fund Advisory Board and the Fish and Wildlife Management Board.  I sure don't know all the answers but can usually come up with a correct answer.  If you ever have a NY hunting, fishing or trapping question that deals with regulations, laws or general info put a post here on the "Hunting in New York" forum.  I check it two or three times a weeks and I'll try to get a straight answer for you.

Penrod, as I understand it the only times an early muzzleloading season would be used in the southern zone would be in areas where all the available DMPs were not issued due to a lack of applicants or if one is needed to knock back the overall population in which case they would issue either sex, antlerless or antlered tags depending on what the goals are.

Maspaci, What you would get if you hunted both archery and muzzleloading would be a total of three antlered tags-one each for bow, muzzleloading and the regular season.  

DMPs will be the only way for a southern zone adult hunter to harvest an antlerless deer.  If they follow through with this I will propose a change to the law on license fees to drop the $10 application fee for DMPs.  The CFAB was opposed to it anyway and the Office of Budget stuck it in the last price increase.  Neither we nor the DEC had any choice.  

The DEC will use the recent historical average of bow/muzzleloading antlerless deer harvests and use that along with the typical success rate info to issue more DMPs than the istorical average to make up for the lack of antlerless and either sex tags.  There will be no harvesting of antlerless deer (except for 12-15 year old hunters) in any wildlife management unit (WMU) where they don't issue DMPs.

Lance

[adkarcher]

The DEC just recently posted a clarification that can be found on their website.  There is no one buck rule, there are plans for a 2nd buck tag.  This was a gap in the original document that they missed which indicated a 1 buck tag.

Concerning the muzzleloader season during the middle of archery season, it will be the last option in a 3 tiered approach and only in certain areas.  The first 2 options would be attempted and if that did now work, then the potential muzzleloader season.  Also spelled out in the clarification.  Still don't think it belongs in archery season.  The gun season is quite long, certainly room to put it there.

one antlerless tag will be lost to bowhunters.  Bowhunters will need to draw a DMP thru the lottery system for that 2nd tag.

[T Lail]

a case again of lobbyist and big money decideing seasons and not biologists.....it is happening in every state.....I live in NC and it seems that the Wildlife Commission gets a kick back or something from firearms and crossgun manufacterers....they have not listened to the biologists in many years....

[Bent Rig]

Just talked to a politician freind of mine who has been fighting all of this , a bowhunter only himself and he told me that most of these proposals were originating out of the Long Island area . He also added to tell every hunter that I know to get invovled and write to protest as much as possible because it will not end at these proposals - if it is left up to these people . These proposals that you are talking about now are nothing compared to what I have heard may come later .

One of the things which really concerns me (aside from a gun season in the middle of bow season and the introduction of crossbows) is that there are already a lot of people out there who feel justified in poaching deer because the license fees have gone up and the management plan is not well explained or well understood. I am hearing the "one shot in the middle of the night" already and it's August. Personally, I think the $100 or so I spend on my licenses is the best buy on the planet, but it won't be if they don't include the privilege tags. The last thing the DEC needs is to sell fewer licenses and I'm afraid that's where all of this is headed.