Crossbow usage up in MI. Good or bad for us?

[PEARL DRUMS]

A wise man once asked me, "If you have to pull a trigger, is it really a bow?"

[Mojostick]

The tough thing is, about 90-95% of hunters in bow season "fire" the bow by putting their finger on a trigger. Most use a trigger release.

[Broke N Arrow]

The way some people defend the crossbow and compound u have to wonder if they really belong on a web sight that is soully for traditional archery and the values there of..

[Broke N Arrow]

The way some people defend the crossbow and compound u have to wonder if they really belong on a web sight that is soully for traditional archery and the values there of..

[PEARL DRUMS]

Originally posted by Mojostick:
The tough thing is, about 90-95% of hunters in bow season "fire" the bow by putting their finger on a trigger. Most use a trigger release.

Its just food for thought is all.

[J.T.]

Cold weather,
To get back to the topic of this thread on weather cross guns in Michigan's archery season is good or bad bad for us.  I feel since the act.of shooting a cross gun take no archery skill it does more harm than good to archery season.  It bring more hunters into the woods than buy a cross gun shoot it twice and then go hunting.  As far a proficiency tests that has more to do with ethics and personal responsibility and happens to be the same test my father made me pass in order to hunt when I was of legal age and there are a few areas that use them in order to get tags but as far as Michigan is concerned ethics don't make the state money crossbows do  so I doubt we will see state wide proficiency tests.

[Mojostick]

More food for thought-

In a way, both xbows and modern compounds are more like arrow shooting platforms, than bows. There is no "bowing" of the bow, with most parallel limbed compounds. Add drop away rests and D-loops and you remove contact with both the bow and string. I certainly have no issue with modern compounds being used in archery season, or xbows for that matter, but is a modern compound really a bow anymore?

If anything, this is why we're seeing more interest in traditional bows. I think more and more people want to get back to the roots and away from gadgets and back to a more pure bow hunt.

The reality is, killing deer in most places isn't difficult anymore. So more people will opt for the challenge of trad bows as time wears on.

I've sold all 3, xbows, compounds and trad bows and have a "to each his own" attitude on the weapon used. I think harvest regulations are a much greater concern for all of us vs weapon used rules. The reality is, xbows and compounds will always be what the majority gravitates towards and they aren't going anywhere. However, traditional gear is growing in interest and I think our energy should be focused on fostering that, and growing the traditional ranks, than fighting an old battle that has essentially been settled, for good. Just my opinion.

[Cold Weather]

Mosojostick brings an excellent view and one I agree with wholeheartedly.

the reality is one can use these other platforms to grow traditional archery.

I remember when the compound was coming in-and how trad bows where forsaken in the 70s.  By the early 80s trad bows were almost extinct.

but they came back, and now I venture  to say that there is more people interested in trad bows than in the hey day of recurves/longbows the 60s.

[PEARL DRUMS]

JT,

When I worked in an archery shop I couldn't count the amount of two-shot and go hunting wheelies I sold. Its not just cross bows. That same shop also sent out gun after gun with a fresh scope mounted on them. It was spooky the amount of people who walked right to the woods trusting our bore sight to be adequate, it never is as we all know. The whole 2-shots and go hunting argument applies to every weapon that is legal. Work a sporting goods shop and you will have a sick stomach more than once a day. For that matter hang out at a Trad. 3D shoot for a weekend and tell me how many of those folks have the "right" to actually hunt with their bows? Lots of holes in the trees and lots of broken arrows. I suppose the wheelys and x-bow guys could condemn us as well?  

Im not a x-bow fan, Im not a compound fan. All I care is that whatever legal weapon you chose, you shoot it well.

[J.T.]

Also I'm not implying that all cross gun shooters are unethical but since Michigan legalized cross guns they seem to have attracted more slob hunters than real ethical hunters and thats bad for archery

[PEARL DRUMS]

The good news. Even slob hunters have a voice if anybody tries to get serious about taking our hunting rights away. Were on the same team, like it or not! I will gladly stand next to any legal hunter to defend our rights if it comes to that point.

[Mojostick]

Not to divert to another subject, but the bait pile has probably attracted 20 times the slob hunters than anything else. Take away baiting and many of those "hunters" who don't know anything about deer hunting but where to dump the bag of carrots would likely take up lining/snagging salmon instead. LOL

From my experience in the hunting retail world, the folks buying crossbows are made up almost entirely of current bowhunters who want a xbow due to age, health or don't have the time to practice as much but still want to hunt in archery season (and xbows are legal now, like it or not), the long time firearms only hunter who wants to join his buddies or family on a bowhunt and people buying xbows for their kids that can't yet pull back 35-40lbs, but the parents want to sit with them as 10-14 year olds.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of xbows. I've shot a couple of them at work and just don't care for them. I don't have to explain to the trad crowd why I'm not a big fan of xbows. However, they are here to stay and we all need to face it. Secondly, having had rotator cuff surgery, if I could never draw a bow again, I'd buy an xbow, reluctantly.

[Zradix]

Mojostick,
You make a VERY good point.
Being able to hunt during archery season with a youngin that can't pull a bow back is pretty cool.

[Jakeemt]

I started out with a crossbow. I have been a gun hunter for some years. About 2 years ago I bought a recurve type cross bow thinking that taking the full plunge into archery would be too much. After about 6 months I traded it for a compound riser recurve and about six months after that I bought a lovely wood long bow. Now I practice 6 days a week and love it. If I had my way primitive muzzle loaders using patch round balls and trad bows would be in the same season along with weapons like the atlatl. Once the rut starts toss in the compounds, xbows, and inlines. However that's not to be compounds are here to stay. My buddy bought a Hoyt compound and brought it over to the range. My first time shooting it I put 3 arrows in 3 inches at 20 yards something I would be very hard pressed to do on my best day with my long bow an even my old crossbow. To be frank I see little difference.

[SKITCH]

I got it.  
Why don't we just mount a high tech crossbow with some amazing optics, motion sensors, night vision and heat seeking bolts to a small waterproof battery powered tracked remote control vehicle equipped with hi def cam and 360• view capability...then we could sit in the back of a cozy heated (or air conditioned) SUV equipped with dual 36" hi def, flat screen, 3D monitors with a life like surround sound system, multi function remote controls, a cold beer and a nice meal and go bow hunting!!!  Wouldn't even have to get dirty or break a sweat.     :D    :D    :D    

That would put a little more $$ in someone's pocket.  

To each his own I guess as long as its legal and responsible.

[Broke N Arrow]

Skitch.. I think u r on to something cuze if it keeps on going in the direction its going thats where its going..someone is always trying to build a better mouse trap..when is enough enough?

[Broke N Arrow]

Hey pearl drums..alot of folks that come to the trad 3D shoots dont hunt. They r there for the fellowship and the sport..its a really fun thing to do even if u can't hit the broad side of a barn..lol I've seen the ones u are talkin about..I hope I'm not hunting the same woods they are...

[Bonebuster]

Bowhunting will not be made better as a "sport" because of the legalization of crossbows.

I personally know many people who had no difficulty getting a permit to use crossbows because of physical limitations. (for which I completetly agree)

Why do you think the state changed the rules AFTER repeat...AFTER they passed the law?

[PEARL DRUMS]

Maybe we need 4 bow seasons 10 days long each? That we each sector gets a chance to hunt the way they feel is "real bowhunting". We can start with self bows since they are the toughest, then the next 10 days is for glass guys, the next 10 for wheelys and we wrap up the Michigan archery season with a 10 day x-bow hunt. Maybe a cross-bow line like we have the rifle line with M46 & M57? Or, we just enjoy our chosen legal bows and hunt for 75 days each season they allot to us as HUNTERS. Life is too short to worry about anything but what we each love about our archery.

[Mojostick]

What Michigan needs is to get out of the 1940's and into the 2010's, as far as season dates go. We do that by changing our short bow season and work towards season dates that match some of the other states in the region. Increasing "time afield" opportunity is key.

Michigan set the October 1 start date way back in 1945. For closing dates, there was a hodgepodge of closing dates in the 1960's, until the statewide closing date of Jan. 1 was set in 1981.

All of these season dates, along with a bow season that is weeks shorter than other states, are out of date.

People today have ever more packed up work schedules. Kids also have different schedules now than we did as kids. The days of 4-5 guys taking a week off, together, are as out of date as high paying factory jobs. The same is true with taking kids out of school to hunt. Our season dates are from a different era, completely.

While the UP should probably retain the old Oct.1-Jan. 1 bow season dates due to winter yarding and the long term return to marginal deer habitat than can only support lower herd numbers, there's no reason that LP bow season couldn't run from Sept. 1 to Jan. 31. All that would do is offer more hunter opportunity and spread out hunting pressure in the often crowded woods.

The truth is, the only folks out there in January would be the most dedicated/ethical 10%. I say all Michigan bowhunters should push to extend bow season to Jan. 31.


Ohio's bow season in Sept. 28 to Feb. 2.

Kentucky's bow season is Sept. 7 to Jan. 20.

Wisconsin's bow season is Sept. 14 to Jan. 5.