Something to Remember

[Jeremy]

I posted this on another topic, but that really wasn't the place for it...

Something that really needs to be said from time to time in the middle of all the discussions we end up having here is HAVE FUN!

Sure, using known steels and high dollar quench oils is the proper way to do things, but...

hundreds of thousands of really good knives have been made out of old files, truck leaf springs, saw blades and the like using simple equipment and regular old mineral or veggie oil or water. The steels fall under only a few types and unless you're going for a big thick bowie the simple oils will work.
These knives might not have the optimal edge geometry, they might not have the greatest of grain structure or might be a little too hard (or soft), but they won't fail you under anything resembling normal field use.

99.9% of knifemakers are hobbyists. They don't aspire to a MS ranking in the ABS, they want a knife that they made for them and their buddies that won't fail them. That's COMPLETELY attainable with junkyard steels and a $5 bucket of corn oil.

I'm a scientist by trade and nature. I'm not fond of multiple unknowns in my experimental setups, but you can change one thing at a time and see the result until you find the limits of the materials available to you. If you're paying attention one "test" knife and you should be good to go to make serviceable knife.

So while a lot of us, myself included, often get caught up in technical discussions of the "correct" way of doing things, please remember there are "other" ways of getting a result that better than 95% of people won't notice the difference.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Amen Brother!  I am presently working on a half round file that I plan to make a not so fancy pig hunting knife out of.  I plan to quench it in heated canola oil.  To keep it straight I plan to wire it down to a flat 1/4 inch thick piece of flat stock and heat the whole thing to just above critical and then quench it. Bac yard shop blacksmithing at its best and tons of fun.  

I love fiddling with old pieces of scrounged steel.  I find that each piece of recycled steel makes something really special to me.  Plus I am being green instead of letting something useful go to waste.  I have never had a complaint from buddies and family members over the quality of any of my junk steel knives or tomahawks they are now hunting and fishing with.

[DW]

VERY Well said Jeremy! We enjoy using 50 year old Pitted Saw-mill Blades, Old Files,etc....

At the moment we have collected about 10 pounds of Square nails from Skylers Great, Great grandparents old Home Place...They built this House with their bare hands in 1889....Doug Campbell is gonna help us Forge Weld these into workable steel and Sky is gonna build knives for the Grandkids for Christmas...It's a big Project but a very worthwhile one.....we'll keep ya'll updated.....

[OconeeDan]

Hear hear!!!

or is that here here!!??

[prarieboy]

Well said!
Love them knives from rasps,files and plow disc's.
 Havin a ball doin it!

[Maxximusgrind]

 Verry well put!Recycling can be alot of fun.And if you made it and it holds its edge,how much better could it be?I wish I still had my first(ugly as it was)
 Robert

[beaver#1]

Very well said. I have thought the same thing myself sense not everyone plans to be a pro. But on the other hand all that info has helped so many that does plan on being more than a hobbyist. I agree with you toatlly but I would hate tO see that info disapper.

[Jeremy]

I in no way want to dissuade people from giving good information; that wasn't the purpose of my post.  In the last month I've "talked" with two guys who both felt they were, well, "jumped on" when asked about how to deal with the materials they had instead of given help.  That's not what we're all here for.  After reading the same comment on Terry's "Popular Mechanics" thread I thought we all needed a little reminder.  That's all.

[Maxximusgrind]

I cant speak for anyone,but I think that what some of the guys meant was that it can simplify the process and improve the initial success to use the "known materials".Its really easy to loose something in the translation in this kind of interaction,so I try to give the benefit of the doubt.
 Like I said,I cant speak for the high end makers,but I am pretty sure that I have posted things that changed meanings between my tiny brain and the way they were translated on the other end(hopefully,not this one)
  Even though,I have a big box of good,brand name knives,my hunting knife,was a file and I replaced my name brand knife after"feild testing"the file knife and truly believe its better at holding its edge.
 
  I just told a guy yesterday,who asked me about heat treating files-"...do some testing before you put handles on(that one was embarrasing)and if your having fun making it and it doesn't work out,you get to make another one.
 Robert

[beaver#1]

Jeremy. Maximus hit the nail on the head also with the lost in translation idea. I know are are not trying to dissuade any one I was simply adding 2 cents from both sides. I remember what it was like when I first started and I can see how some folks might take things as being jumped on.

[Jeremy]

When I first started out I read everything I could get my hands on and contacted as many of the ABS JS and MS as I could find contact info for.  I pestered some of them pretty good! (Special thanks to Terry Primos and Bruce Evans needed here).  So I completely understand about wanting to start off with as much proper info as possible.  That had nothing to do with my post.

I figured if I had heard the same comments about the tone of some posts from three separate sources in such a short time there are probably lots of silent guys out there and we all may need a gentle reminder.

[Jeremy]

Side note:
Any idea how many smiths earned the JS ranking w/ either 5160 or 1080 quenched in regular mineral oil or veggie oil??
Know what the vast majority of old leaf springs are?  The little bit of carbon content on either side of those doesn't affect much.  So while they're not "known" they kind of are.

[Maxximusgrind]

Wether or not I am right about what was intended,You are definately right about keeping this fun.and if you have a whole bunch of free steel,you have nothing to loose by using it.I personally have never bought tool steel(unless you count 6 feet of logging cable),just because its less fun and I am cheap.   :rolleyes:  
 the knife I made from cable may be total crap,I have no idea what the steel is-but it was something I had to try until I got it.and even though,I tell people that-that is the one knife everyone hears about and asks me to seee.
  Thanks for trying to maintain the balance.

[UMLarcher]

Thanks for this, Jeremy. This forum has been an enormous help to me in getting started with knife making, and I'd hate to see others get scared off from trying this because it looks like they can't get results without expensive tools and equipment. Like many others, I made my first knives out of lawnmower blades quenched in old motor oil and I love them. That being said, I do always appreciate the advice and knowledge of the professionals here.

[Maxximusgrind]

http://images.imagelinky.com/1266826326.JPG   an old file and a piece of cable-recycling is fun

[James Oertel]

very well put !!!    

[Doug Campbell]

Great post Jeremy, sometimes we get to taking things to "serious" we have to remember that this is fun    Most everybody, even the MS's and JS's out there started bladesmithing as a hobby with "junk" steel and used cooking oil or something similiar  

Speaking of fun, I'm typing this from Hawaii, I've met three different knife makers over here now. An open air shop is pretty nice for ventilation...    

Hold down the fort while I go have some more fun  

[Lin Rhea]

Doug, you rascal! Are you wearing your long johns? I bet it's hard to break the habit.

 If you see a maker by the name of Craig Hashimoto, tell him I said hey. He has my Little Giant power hammer. Have fun. Lin

[Jeremy]

Hawaii again!  :D   You lucky dog!  More fishing and shooting I hope?