HELP!!! What do i do?!

[UnderControl16]

Ok so i have a slight issue.... I was messing around with a design for a longbow that i was tillering (and while I don't like the design now) as i was tillering the pine layer that i had applied to the belly of the glue buckled and created a hinge in my bow that only got worse over time. I used tb111 to apply the pine was it possible that i just missed that spot and need to reapply the glue there? i also just backed the bow with tb111 after this happened to try and strengthen it.... am i doing the right things? what would you do? i will post pictures soon....

[UnderControl16]

 

 

 

[Eric Krewson]

You shouldn't use pine in a bow as it is not capable of standing the stresses of tension and compression.

[Pat B]

You haven't been doing your homework!  
   When working with wood bows, either self bows, backed bows or multi-lam bows there are certain properties that you need for a successful project.
  For a self bow you want a wood that gives a compatible amount of compression strength and tension strength for the design used so your bow can bend evenly to the draw length and draw weight you desire without being overpowered by either stress.
   For a backed bow you want a backing that is strong in tension but not overpowering to your belly wood and you want a belly that can take the compression stresses that the backing will impart on it...but you also want the proper design for the woods used.
   For a multi-lam bow you want a tension strong backing, a compression strong belly and a core lam(s) that are compatible with both the back and belly.
   From looking at your pics, I can see that your belly wood was crushed by the backing. The hinge may have exaggerated this effect but was not the cause.  First of all, pine is not a good belly wood. It is not strong enough in compression. As a matter of fact it is not a good bow wood at all. It may work as a core between a back and belly but other woods would be a better choice.
   You didn't say what your backing wood is but I can tell from the pics, it is way to thick; looks like 3 times as thick as the belly.
  When you want to build a wood bow, find the wood(s) you plan to use first. From there, design a bow that is compatible with the wood(s) chosen. Now, take your time! Remove wood from stiff areas and don't touch areas that are already bending, exercise the bow between wood removals to help the bow register the removal of wood and to educate the bow to bend.
   If there is a specific type or style of bow you want to build, find the wood(s) that is(are) compatible with the design and then execute the design thoughtfully to reach your goal. Without the proper design for the wood chosen or without the proper wood for the design chosen you are setting yourself up for failure and disappointment.

[Roy Steele]

SWEET PAT

[John Scifres]

"HELP!!! What do i do?!"

Don't panic. Playing around with different woods is a good way to learn.  But there are a lot of lessons you can learn from others that will save you a lot of trouble.  Let us know what you want from a bow, what woods you'd like to use and some more background and we can get you started down the right path.

I like to cook.  And I like to experiment with food.  But when I make a new recipe, I follow it explicitly the first time.  After I have a little experience with the technique and some confidence by my instructed success, I strike out on my own.  It's the same way with bows or just about anything else you want to learn.  I am pretty sure Ford didn't start out making cars by inventing the wheel.

[frank bullitt]

Thats great advice, John! If people like Paul Comstock and Tim Baker had listened to "no you can't". Staying within certain parameters whether with materials or design. I give you alot of credit, Michael, your tiller was starting to come around! And will go out on a limb and say you will be making some awsome bows in the future! Best to you, Steve.

[razorback]

Undercontrol16, listen very carefully to what the guys on here tell you. They are a wonderful source of information. Read everything you can on websites and in books that talks about building bows. You will start to see a pattern develop in what they are saying. When the same idea is repeated by many who have done this for a while, it is probably a good idea. I see you are a cadet member, if you go to a school that has a woodworking program, talk to the teachers and tell them what you are doing. Ask the for help with ideas on compression and tension strenghts. I know they are a little difficult to wrap the mind around. Ask lots of questions, read lots of books and articles, get plenty of wood and make shavings. You will bust a bunch of bows and make plenty of kids bows while learniong to create a good bow, but have a whole bunch of fun in the process.

[UnderControl16]

Alright i knew most of that stuff about pine and i had already snapped a pine bow before i learned that lesson but i wanted to try this and see if it would last, and it almost did, only a inch shy of making it. So yeah going to stick away from soft woods from now on, lesson finally learned. Are you guys talking about specific gravity/density?


John: Very nice simile, i actually also have a garden and like to mess around in the kitchen as well.


razorback: I know right, i love this website everyone is so friendly and helpful nad smart compared to me. And no my school doens't have a woodshop.


Steve: thank you very mush, i have made on little 15# but am now shooting for a 30# and then will go up from there as i build the right/more muscles. it was tillering perfectly till the pine gave way, then it formed a hinge there that i couldn't get rid of and i then declared the bow "dead".


Pat: Sorry pat i think i used the wrong words before or something. It was a pine ceder bow that i was making and the pine was just in the center on the back, not typical but i needed to use up the wood and felt like trying something new. the hinge formed when the pine gave out. I hope that makes things clearer, i didn't really expect the bow to work but thought i'd give it a try anyway. It almost made it, i had been able to pull it to 26" but when i pulled it to 28" (my draw) then the pine crumpled and ended the bow.


I've got two 6' boards downstairs right now, one's maple and the other is (red?) oak, will those two work for making self longbows if i do them right?

[Pat B]

Yes, both maple(hard) and oak(red, white) will make good bows.

[UnderControl16]

If it's difficult to skratch with your nail does that it it's hard?

[Pat B]

Not necessarily. Going by species and specific gravity is the best method.