bend thru the handle RD bow??

[fujimo]

i really prefer my bows to bend thru the handle- does this work well for a RD bow- or are there potential problems, with leverage in the deflex area.
or is this merely a matter of personal preferance.
wayne

[Pat B]

It should work fine. Make it so the handle gives a little right at full draw.

[fujimo]

thanks Pat.
is it not really the norm??
would there be performance losses with it?
thanks

[John Scifres]

My favorite design is a 60" osage with deflexed center section and reflexed outer thirds to flipped tips, bend in the handle.  Go for it and post pics  

[Stiks-n-Strings]

I have one of John's bows like he is talking about. I'm not quite sure it bends at the handle but it might a touch.

 Shoots awesome!

[fujimo]

hey John.
do you have pics of one of them, or even possibly a profile drawing, that i could build a caul from- huge request i know!!

[Bert Frelink]

Wayne,
Get uncle Dean's video!!! there is no need for a caul, the way he does it and explains it makes a lot of sense and you can experiment till your'e heart's content.
It's called "Hunting the Bamboo Backed Bow"
Look up bowyersedge.com. and you should be able to find it.
Good luck.
Bert.

[fujimo]

thanks bert, i remember watching your copy, i think!
but that was quite a while ago.
i will certianally have to buy one now
thanks
have a good time !!

[Lee Robinson .]

PERSONALLY, I wouldn't want a bow to flex in the grip at all. I don't want ANY movement in the sight window, as that is the weak link of a bow. I want that portion as tough as possible in order to prevent failure.

[PEARL DRUMS]

I thought about doing the same with the hickory stave I just got. Sinew back it and make it short like John was talking about. Lee I think your right on the mark with glass bows, but wood bows have no problems beding through the handle, they love it!

[Pat B]

Having a bow bend in the handle actually releaves the stresses in the bending bow by spreading those stresses throughout the working section of the bow, handle included. With a stiff handle the stresses are congrigated at the fades where the bending limb transitions into the non working handle.

[kerryb]

great explination Pat, I couldnt agree more.

[fujimo]

pat, i always notice that bow in your avatar- do you have any other pics of it- maybe even an unstrung profile- i am sure it will help me with my next caul
thanks, and regards
wayne

[Pat B]

I traded that bow a few years ago. My current hunting bow is the same(60"t/t, osage static recurve, 55#@26"). Here the caul I bent the tips with. I also built a similar elm bow for Kodiak Kid for the TG Bow Trade. It is the bow in these pics...
 

...and the caul I added back set to the bow...
 

...and the unfinished bow unbraced...
 

This is a close up of the recurve form...
 

..and here is my hunting bow(osage)
 
...and my hunting set...
 

[fujimo]

that is sooo nice Pat.
thanks that will be a great help.
i love how your hunting arrows are all kinda different- just how a primitive hunter would have been- if the arrow shot well, it was in his quiver i imagine!!
an intimate knowledge of his equipment gave him  the personal knowledge and understanding of each piece of his equipment as was needed.
i sincerely doubt they had perfectly matched arrows, like we strive for so hard nowdays.
a symptom of our truly amorphous modern society.

thanks again pat- always appreciated.

[Sixby]

I agree with Lee. If you bend in the grip then you are concentrating all the compression forces in tbe weakest part of the bow. Glass or wood, compression is still compression. Unless you have no sight cutout at all and no grip shaping at all.

God bless you all, Steve

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by fujimo:
i really prefer my bows to bend thru the handle- does this work well for a RD bow- or are there potential problems, with leverage in the deflex area.
or is this merely a matter of personal preferance.
wayne

Why do you want the riser or handle bending? I'm just curios what is the advantage would be?

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by Pat B:
Having a bow bend in the handle actually releaves the stresses in the bending bow by spreading those stresses throughout the working section of the bow, handle included. With a stiff handle the stresses are congrigated at the fades where the bending limb transitions into the non working handle.

This may prove to be valuable in an all wood bow to keep it from blowing up..... but for us guys that use crutches and build glass bows, we like to store the energy in the limbs instead of the riser so we can harvest it.    

You are definitely loosing performance in a flexible riser.

[John Scifres]

A bend in the handle design is very common among natural material bowyers and must have been the very first bows.  Most native bows were of this design.  Most English longbows bend in the handle.

It is true that you don't cut in a sight window but that's true about many wooden bows.  Shaping the handle is usually done by adding leather and shaping that, if at all.

This design is often thought to be more natural to aim and shoot, more of extension of the arm vs. a separate part.  It also allows all the wood you are carrying to do its share of the work and to make shorter and handier natural material designs.  

I have built faster (if that is the definition of performance) bendy handled bows than rigid handled ones, especially using sinew.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Thanks John.... i appreciate the explanation. I haven't studied much of the history of building bows with natural materials, but have a deep respect for skilled self bowyer's that have taken the time to do so. interesting stuff. You folks have the patience of Job.

There is also a fine group of truly talented glass bowyer's out there who take just as much pride in their work through fine artistic joinery and balancing of the limbs as the masters of primitive weapons do.

it would be a truly wonderful thing to see more mutual respect for craftsmanship than I've seen among the self bowyer's and composite builders.

We are all brothers of the bare bow here who find joys and challenges in different ways....

sincerely, Kirk