Noob Questions on limb thickness and tillering

[CamoZ]

Hey folks. I am super new to bow making so go easy on me her. I am a bit into my first one. I am doing a 1x2 68" Red Oak Board Bow to start (move to Hickory next). So far I have taken the limbs down to roughly 1/2" at the end of the fade to roughly 3/8' at the nocks. I a pulling roughly 15"-16" at about 15=20lbs or so. It seems like removing wood is not making it bend much more as I am already measuring what many other builders final thickness measurements are and I still have only 15" of draw?? The draw weight accuracy is questionable at this point though.  My questions are as follows.

1. Is my limb thickness close to where it should be for a d shaped bow? It seems as though I need to take it rather thin to continue to get it to bend more..yet it seems close to other builders final measurements..kind of lost here.  

2. Am I correct in tapering the thickness out to the nocks or should I have kept the limbs an even thickness from handle to nock?

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Millhimes]

CamoZ-It depends on the shape of the bow.You can take width off as well as thickness.It doesn't remove weight as fast as thickness.Pull it to your intended finish weight 20-30 times to get it use to bending then keep scraping 10 scrapes each limb and pull it 20-30 times after each scraping.Use a gizmo to check your tiller.You will get there--Joe

[CamoZ]

Hey Joe...thanks for the reply. I am just checking to see if I am doing something wrong here..It seems like it is getting fairly thin yet not bending all that much. Unless I am too nervous to really pull it (though I dont think so, just taking it to the point that it seems like it will handle it okay).

[Millhimes]

If the tiller looks ok.pull it.If it is going to blow best it does it sooner.Just don't go past final weight--Joe

[talkingcabbage]

If you don't have one, get a scale so you know what weight you're pulling. You can use a bathroom scale if you don't have anything else. Then you'll know a little better how much you can pull and still hit your intended weight and draw.

[Pat B]

Forget about the thickness measurement. Remove wood until the limbs bend evenly and together.
  20#@16" works out to 45#@28"...now! Are you still on the long string? If so at 16" you should be able to brace the bow at a low brace height of 3" to 4". At brace you will be able to see your stave as a bow and what it needs to thrive.

[CamoZ]

Thanx for the replies. I am still on the long string, yes (using paracord as I do not yet have any bow string at all).

I have done a bit more work and I am pulling 17-18 inches. I have been using the bathroom scale and currently show around 23lbs at 17 1/2" of draw. As  I keep thinking the bow should be relatively easy to pull (fearing it may break if I try to pull down to say 30 or 40lbs at this point..I do have a heavier gauge linen backing on it so that gives me a bit of added confidence..

[k-hat]

You don't want it to be "easy" to draw, that means a light weight!  It will naturally resist more as it bends more.  Again the primary emphasis is on making sure the limbs are bending EVENLY and not pulling past the weight you want to finish at.  The 45# Pat stated is a respectable goal, though with tweaking and finishing you'll likely fall under.

DON'T BEND'R ANYMORE TILL YOU GET HER ON A SHORT STRING.  Sorry for yelling   :D , but i wanted to make sure you saw that.  You can still use the paracord, just shorten it up till it give you a 3" or so brace height (3" from inside of grip to string).  You may have hinges hiding behind that long string, either way it doesn't give a true read.

Once you get the short string on, stand in front of a mirror and draw it back to your 17" or so and watch how she bends.  Easier to see as the limbs are in motion.  Then stick her on the tree to check overall tiller.  If there are no hinges or stiff spots, both limbs bend evenly together, then you can inch it back bit by bit, constantly checking the tiller each time.  Exercise it about 20-30 pulls at each length before progressing as well.

Good luck and keep checking in  

[Roy from Pa]

How long is your tillering string? Don't use those super long strings, they don't give you a true indication of the tiller. When I first put a string on a new bow and string it in the string grooves, my string lays tight against the belly of the handle. Once the limb tips are bending to about 6 inches and I have a nice even arc to the limbs, I brace the bow to about a 3 inch brace height and continue tillering. Once the limb tips are bending to 8 or 9 inches and I still have a nice limb arc,  I brace the bow up at 6 inches. The shorter string you put on a bow the more stress it puts on the outer 1/3 of the limbs. Do you have a tillering gizmo? if not here is a link to making and using one.

   http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=000075

[CamoZ]

Hey guys..great thanks..I have been using the long string, yes..I have it so that it rests against the handle..so not really loose..I will be sure to set it in a low brace and carry on with the tillering using the low brace..glad you told me..i would have kept using the long string not knowing..awesome..I will work on getting some pictures (I have another thread with tillering questions but some photos will probably help a lot..I just have to figure out how to post pics on here now!!

[CamoZ]

I was going to make a gizmo thingy just now..my drill bits (the size i need) is so badly chewed up at the non business end that it spins with a bit of a wobble..time to get some new bits eh?? Ha..

[k-hat]

Set up a photobucket account.  In the settings you can have it resize them to 640x480 for TG.  Click on the img code under the links and paste in your msg.  You can preview to see if it shows correctly.

[Roy from Pa]

Here is a link for pictures recommended by trad gang.
 http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=129&t=000228

[CamoZ]

Hey Kevin..so I was just trying to get a shorter string on for a low brace (3" or so as per your post)..I am having a heck of a time trying to string it at 3" brace..wow..I am using the step through method but as the bow is 68" I can not seem to get the bend even throughout and i just can not seem to get the string up to the nock for a3" brace..

What i will do is post a picture(got the photobucket account ready to go) and let you see where I am at with the long string..maybe you will think it is not ready for a low brace just yet?? I dont know..at any rate..I will post a pic or two in a bit here..

[CamoZ]

update..i did get it to a low brace height..just had the sting a bit too short..probably would have had a full brace height on at the length i had it..photobucket refuses to save my picture at 640 x 480..tried a number of times but it says a problem saving..please try again..thanks for your help so far...i will carry on..

[Roy from Pa]

I suggest you buying a bow stringer to string wooden bows. Get the one that has a leather cup on both ends. The push pull method is safer and better for wooden bows also but stringer is the best and safest.

[CamoZ]

Okay.so I used a diff photo bucket type site..image is here..I will have to post more showing the draw on the tillering tree but I have it at 3" brace height now in this pic..

[CamoZ]

[Roy from Pa]

That's not looking bad at all.

[k-hat]

Yes sir looking pretty good.  BTW, that looks like about a 1" brace     Brace height is measured from the grip, not the belly.  So the point is you can shorten the string some more (one problem with paracord/nylon etc is it does stretch after you brace it.)  That said, it def looks like you're on the right track. If you want you can check the tiller with that brace, then proceed as Roy mentioned earlier (raising brace as you get more limb movement).  Looks to me though like you can go on to 4" or so on the brace height.  Shorten your string by an inch or so at a time and see where it braces.  Use push/pull as Roy mentioned.  Your taper looks real nice and fades look about right.  

Can we see a front profile?  I'm assuming the width is parallel for most of the length?