gonna miss weight.... maybe not...

[Echatham]

im on track for 45# on an osage self bow.  66" ntn.... top limb two inches longer than bottom.  wanted 50 to 55# .  i guess i could pike it a bit....  but dont really wanna.   toasting the belly help much?  how much can i gain by putting more flip to the tips?  silk backing?  i have only tillered to 20"..... but i can already tell its falling short. going to 29" btw.

[John Scifres]

Are you sure about your draw length?  Have you actually shot trad bows for a while and settled on that?

[Bowjunkie]

Silk won't add weight. Is this the stave that you gently recurved the tips on? You could shorten the bow, recurve it further, sinew back it... or just finish it and start another one  

[Echatham]

yah im sure about the draw length. was 30 with a compound.

[Echatham]

can i get away with 64" ntn with asymmetrical limbs and a 29" draw? or is that pushing it?  think i will just tiller it out as good as i can for now, see where it ends up. then if i pike it and/or flip the tips the tiller should stay pretty close right?

[John Scifres]

Not doubting your belief Eric but there is a lot of arrow hanging off the front of this pic and you look stretched out fully.

 

If you truly draw 29", then you could shorten it to as short as 62" ntn.  I made a 61" ntn for a friend that draws 29-1/2" with it.  It will follow the string more.  I would want it to bend more at the fades though.  You can also temper the belly, flip the tips a little more and maybe get it in the 50s.

[Echatham]

pic didn't show, but im going to check my draw length again.

[Echatham]

28.5" the way im shooting right now. have been kinda fluctuating between 28 and 29 as i figure out my form. not sure what pic you tried to post, but not all my arrows are the same length. for my screwing around and stumping arrows i leave them long so i can get at least one more use when i break a tip off.

[Echatham]

tillered down to 30# @ 26". no good.  chopped an inch off the lower and an inch and a half off the upper.  flipping some recurves into the tips now.  im going to make a hunting bow or firewood... one or the other.

[LittleBen]

Did you cut a shelf?

you could pike the top limb by 2" to amke the bow symmetrical.

That will make the top limb much stiffer than it is now.

Then flip the bow so top limb is now bottom limb.

Then tiller to appropriately and you should gain some weight. How much you ask? No one knows ... but it'll be some.

[Echatham]

no shelf.  thats an idea... but im already on another course. wish me luck!

[wandering monk]

30" with a compound does not mean 30 with a traditional bow...especially a self bow shot canted off a shelf...in reality you might be really drawing 26"


it would be a good idea to shoot a self bow and see exactly how it sets up for you before you get to far ahead of yourself...

[Echatham]

wandering monk i don't think you read all the posts.  i shot 30" draw with a compound. i am somewhere between 28 and 29 with a stick bow.  been shooting traditional for a year and selfbows for a few months.

[Echatham]

 

 

20#@ 15"   may still be hope for 40#. was 20#@20" before the pike and flip. going to let the tips rehydrate a while before i pull any further,  but i just had to know what effect that had!    

[Echatham]

thats only a 4.5" brace too... so might pick up a pound when i get to full brace around 6 - 6.5"?

[Bowjunkie]

That's a nice profile. I like the looks of that more.

So now you've got a top limb 1 1/2" longer than the bottom? I think you'll like that better. It will balance nicely in your hand and be very stable throughout the draw. As long as you don't inflict it with a default 1/4" positive tiller...  :^)

Draw it on the tree from where your string hand will be and sync them limbs.

[Echatham]

thats the plan. gotta modify my tree again.  question on syncing limbs.  there is some play in how my handle sits in the cradle.... so do i want to sit the bow on the cradle so that string is horizontal.... or perpendicular to direction of pull. .. and then at full draw tips should still be even?

[Bowjunkie]

Handle should be level and perpendicular to direction of string travel, not necessarily the string.

Synchronized limbs don't necessarily show their tips even at full draw... or any other time... due to a variety of possible reasons.

Synchronized limbs will allow the string fulcrum to travel perpendicular to the handle as it's drawn. If limbs are of uneven strength, not synchronized, one of two things will happen...

1. If allowed to pivit, the bow will tip in the cradle. The strong limb will ride higher. Weakening the stronger limb until the bow comes to full draw without tipping is creating harmony between the limbs.

Or....

2. If your cradle shape and handle shape is such that it's not prone to tip in the tree, or if you elect to otherwise afix the handle solidly in the cradle, then keep a close eye on the fulcrum point on the string.... you will quickly see it pulled toward the stronger limb as it's drawn. It's a simple matter then to weaken the strong limb to allow the fulcrum point to travel perpendicular to the handle.

I draw a vertical line to simulate perfect string fulcrum travel, and then tiller the bow so that the hook on the string follows that line.... totally disregarding brace height measurements or profile.

These techniques will enable you to tiller/time odd-shaped bows with the same degree of confidence and accuracy as any others.

One more thing,...  it is very important that you replicate your holds on bow and string as closely as possible. If you hold the bow with a torque-free grip, and neither healed or high, but allow the weight of the draw to pull evenly into your palm, it simplifies things and a cradle that spans the width of the grip will work well and you can watch the fulcrum as described in scenerio #2.

I have another idea that may be of considerable benefit and I'm going to work it out in the next few days. I'll let ya know if it works. My tree is always evolving too  

[Echatham]

thats the first explanation thats made sense to me. thank you.

[Echatham]

my handle is already roughed out, and round.  since its round, what about making the cradle just a piece of 2x4 lagged edgewise to the tree, and i could make one radiused for when im tillering a bow with a blocky handle... or i could use some kind of web or leather strap to hold the bow...  what do you use?