black ash lamination

[Seank]

Hello everyone! I've been thinking about this for a while, and I stumbled on this forum today, so I thought I'd ask the crowd. We have lots of black ash trees on our property, and from what I understand, you can't really make a bow from these the way you would with white ash, because the porous fast growth crushes under pressure. I do however use the logs occasionally to make ash splint baskets, which got me thinking that When I separate the growth rings to make the splints, I could scrape away the porous layer leaving only the strong smooth summer growth, then stack them up and glue them back together to make a bow. does this make sense? has anyone ever done something like this? I know that the process of pounding ash logs can be done on other ring-porous hardwoods as well, so if it does work, the technique could be applied to other woods as well.

[PEARL DRUMS]

I like your thinking, but that sounds crazy difficult. Those mated surfaces have to match up pretty darn good to be safe and effective. I haven't seen many growth rings that are the same thickness around the tree, meaning you would have all kinds of side to side variance. Id probably keep making baskets with it myself.

[Seank]

Just to clarify, the rings are separated and peeled off lengthwise in long strips, then I gauge them to the same width and run fine set block plane over them on both sides making them remarkably flat and uniform. it's essentially the same as having strips of veneer, but it's really strong lengthwise. I don't think the glue-up would be the hard part, because I've done similar laminations with veneer to make bent-wood furniture, and it came out great. I wouldn't think I'd want to make a bow with veneer though, because the grain would be going every which way and it would break under tension. maybe i'll just glue up a test piece and see how strong it is.

[Seank]

oh, and would a bow that's 3/4 inch wide be ok? That's the easiest width to handle with the strips. i could go a little wider, but i'd have to make a new gauge.

[PEARL DRUMS]

At 3/4" wide you could make 12-15# bows. Your depth cant exceed your width on any bow or wood, that's where the limitations start.

[LittleBen]

I think it sounds awesome .... ly time consuming. But also awesomely cool.

I personally probably wouldn't bother. My guess is it will work, but probably no better than just making a wider bow.

Where in NY are you? There are lots of suitable bow woods across the state from oak, to hard maple to hickory, hophornbean, american hornbeam, I think even birch can make selfbows.

There's also ERC (which my favor has been turning againt lately, serviceberry ... I think beech can make a bow if you can find a straight piece (good luck).

So my thought it, give a plain black ash selfbow a try, especially if you've got alot of it ... keep the bow long (at least your height) and wide (2.5" pyramid style). Better to have a durable bow that shoots a little slower than a rocket launcher that blows up after 10shots or during tillering. you're not gonna get 65# out of an ask bow, but maybe 45# ....

[Seank]

Pearl drums - That's good to know about the depth not exceeding the width! makes sense, I suppose. would a buttload of reflex (I can bend easily to any shape when I glue up) add anything major to the draw weight? I'm picturing those mongolian bows that are shaped like a C when unstrung.

LittleBen -  by ERC do you mean eastern red cedar? I had a decent sized (maybe 5 inch diameter) arborvitae (thuja) that I cut to make way for a garden last year.. is that the same thing? We live about half way between Rochester and Buffalo. I wish I had access to a greater variety of trees, but we pretty much just have black ash, silver maple, boxelder, cottonwood (populus nigra), a few black cherries, and one or two (little) elms. We do have a nice white oak, but the chickens like to eat the acorns, so it's gotta stay.

I actually just cut down a really nice black ash today, and I got a really long straight section That I was planning to break down into boards for some moldings the wife has been bugging me to make, but I guess I can spare a stave and just experiment! maybe I'll glue up some splints into a reflex bow too and compare the results. this could be fun!

I'm also butchering a couple of cows this week, and I'm curious if I should save any bone/skin/sinew for bow making projects... maybe I'll make a new thread for that one.